Please help....
Comments
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Matthewfalle wrote:Anything Boardman shaped?
Boardman bikes always highly reviewed. If you do like the look of these, it might be good to get British Cycling membership and then you would get 10% at Halfords.
This 10% will then be useful for other bike purchases such as inner tubes, cleaning products, bottle cages, bidons etc. Plus if you're lucky they will apply it to purchases for the car (if you have one). My local store did the BC discount on a windscreen wiper on saturday. Which was nice.
BC Discount also applies to Chain Reaction online purchases over £100 (again 10%, but limited to one purchase per calendar month), so something else to think about.0 -
LakesLuddite wrote:Matthewfalle wrote:Anything Boardman shaped?
Boardman bikes always highly reviewed. If you do like the look of these, it might be good to get British Cycling membership and then you would get 10% at Halfords.
This 10% will then be useful for other bike purchases such as inner tubes, cleaning products, bottle cages, bidons etc. Plus if you're lucky they will apply it to purchases for the car (if you have one). My local store did the BC discount on a windscreen wiper on saturday. Which was nice.
BC Discount also applies to Chain Reaction online purchases over £100 (again 10%, but limited to one purchase per calendar month), so something else to think about.
Another thing with the Chain Reactions discount thing from BC, is that things are often cheaper elsewhere, even with the discount taken off at Chain Reaction. I proved that today, I got a new Ultegra Chainset from Wiggle ( supposedly the same company effectively) for 10 quid less than the same Chainset, from Chain reaction, with the 10 % discount, and it was a ‘sale’ item.0 -
Dont worry about the tires, ive spend a lot on my Bianchi infinito that came with the awful Vittoria Zaffiro pro slick, after 200km i end up to throw them as far as i could replacing them with the conti GP 4000 II S. Now as far as about the new bike on your price range dont eat that ''the frame is the most important, you will be able to upgrade later'' crap, that one is true when you buy a top range frame not alu. Chose the best packet, meaning that the groupset and the wheels are very important. The new tiagra is really good, but 105 is great, nothing to jealous from ultegra other than 250g of weight. If you stick in cycling you will buy a good carbon bike anyway.
Also my advice is to buy an endurance geometry for more comfort, something essential for a new rider. The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position0 -
True.YiannisM wrote:The new tiagra is really good.
Not quite. There are some other important differences.YiannisM wrote:but 105 is great, nothing to distinguish from ultegra other than 250g of weight.
True, but it’s easier to gain comfort by fit, and finish ( the saddle and position of contact points relative to each other)YiannisM wrote:Also my advice is to buy an endurance geometry for more comfort, something essential for a new rider. The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position0 -
YiannisM wrote:
Also my advice is to buy an endurance geometry for more comfort, something essential for a new rider. The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
Not true at all. I wouldn't call my TT bike comfortable in the slightest. Its tolerable but I can go a hell of a lot faster on that than on my extremely comfortable Via Nirone 70 -
YiannisM wrote:The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
It is entirely realistic for someone to be comfortable in a 'racing' position. Lots of people are.0 -
Trivial poursuivant wrote:YiannisM wrote:
Also my advice is to buy an endurance geometry for more comfort, something essential for a new rider. The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
Not true at all. I wouldn't call my TT bike comfortable in the slightest. Its tolerable but I can go a hell of a lot faster on that than on my extremely comfortable Via Nirone 7
You’re comparing apples with melons. A road bike and a dedicated TT bike, are not even the same game, let alone the same ball park.0 -
Milemuncher1 wrote:Trivial poursuivant wrote:YiannisM wrote:
Also my advice is to buy an endurance geometry for more comfort, something essential for a new rider. The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
Not true at all. I wouldn't call my TT bike comfortable in the slightest. Its tolerable but I can go a hell of a lot faster on that than on my extremely comfortable Via Nirone 7
You’re comparing apples with melons. A road bike and a dedicated TT bike, are not even the same game, let alone the same ball park.
Rubbish. Your position on a TT bike has to be economical. but its still, pedals, saddle and arms/hands as your contact points. What about a road bike with clip on bars? You want to get as low down and aero as possible but you wont be necessarily that comfortable. im sure you will go a lot faster than on a comfortable more upright bike no matter the comfort0 -
Imposter wrote:YiannisM wrote:The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
It is entirely realistic for someone to be comfortable in a 'racing' position. Lots of people are.
Indeed, but we are talking about a new rider, not an experienced one. Also you have to take on the account the lvl of back flexibility, and as you get older the less you are, especially if you curry some extra weight.0 -
Trivial poursuivant wrote:YiannisM wrote:
Also my advice is to buy an endurance geometry for more comfort, something essential for a new rider. The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
Not true at all. I wouldn't call my TT bike comfortable in the slightest. Its tolerable but I can go a hell of a lot faster on that than on my extremely comfortable Via Nirone 7
Entry lvl alu bike compared to TT in what conditions? flat 40-50km ride? of course you will be faster, but what about on 100km ride with 1500m of elevation?0 -
YiannisM wrote:Trivial poursuivant wrote:YiannisM wrote:
Also my advice is to buy an endurance geometry for more comfort, something essential for a new rider. The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
Not true at all. I wouldn't call my TT bike comfortable in the slightest. Its tolerable but I can go a hell of a lot faster on that than on my extremely comfortable Via Nirone 7
Entry lvl alu bike compared to TT in what conditions? flat 40-50km ride? of course you will be faster, but what about on 100km ride with 1500m of elevation?
Ah but YiannisM, you never specified in what conditions with your initial blanket statement about “most comfortable being fastest”, which Trivial quite rightly pointed out as not true....
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Milemuncher1 wrote:
True.YiannisM wrote:The new tiagra is really good.
Not quite. There are some other important differences.YiannisM wrote:but 105 is great, nothing to distinguish from ultegra other than 250g of weight.
True, but it’s easier to gain comfort by fit, and finish ( the saddle and position of contact points relative to each other)YiannisM wrote:Also my advice is to buy an endurance geometry for more comfort, something essential for a new rider. The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
Actually there is not. Just weight penalty.
http://road.cc/content/buyers-guide/201326-head-head-shimano-105-v-shimano-ultegra0 -
But YiannisM,
That article is not comparing the R8000 Ultegra which has been significantly upgraded and which has many differences...
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Pilot Pete wrote:YiannisM wrote:Trivial poursuivant wrote:YiannisM wrote:
Also my advice is to buy an endurance geometry for more comfort, something essential for a new rider. The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
Not true at all. I wouldn't call my TT bike comfortable in the slightest. Its tolerable but I can go a hell of a lot faster on that than on my extremely comfortable Via Nirone 7
Entry lvl alu bike compared to TT in what conditions? flat 40-50km ride? of course you will be faster, but what about on 100km ride with 1500m of elevation?
Ah but YiannisM, you never specified in what conditions with your initial blanket statement about “most comfortable being fastest”, which Trivial quite rightly pointed out as not true....
PP
A new rider, that didnt said that wants to get into TT. You are correct about ultegra, still 105 is great groupset, and its the last thing that i am thinking to upgrade on my infinito.0 -
YiannisM wrote:Pilot Pete wrote:YiannisM wrote:Trivial poursuivant wrote:YiannisM wrote:
Also my advice is to buy an endurance geometry for more comfort, something essential for a new rider. The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
Not true at all. I wouldn't call my TT bike comfortable in the slightest. Its tolerable but I can go a hell of a lot faster on that than on my extremely comfortable Via Nirone 7
Entry lvl alu bike compared to TT in what conditions? flat 40-50km ride? of course you will be faster, but what about on 100km ride with 1500m of elevation?
Ah but YiannisM, you never specified in what conditions with your initial blanket statement about “most comfortable being fastest”, which Trivial quite rightly pointed out as not true....
PP
A new rider, that didnt said that wants to get into TT. You are correct about ultegra, still 105 is great groupset, and its the last thing that i am thinking to upgrade on my infinito.
Point is not about a TT bike per se. It’s the statement comfort makes you faster. It’s not true. You can go faster on a less comfortable bike of any kind if it’s more aero or allows you to get into a more aero position. The TT was an extreme example but I could ride 100km on a very comfortable relaxed upright bike and again on a low down aggressive bike which lets me get lower, I will go faster on the second for as long as I can sustain the position on it even if it’s not particularly comfortable.0 -
YiannisM wrote:Milemuncher1 wrote:
True.YiannisM wrote:The new tiagra is really good.
Not quite. There are some other important differences.YiannisM wrote:but 105 is great, nothing to distinguish from ultegra other than 250g of weight.
True, but it’s easier to gain comfort by fit, and finish ( the saddle and position of contact points relative to each other)YiannisM wrote:Also my advice is to buy an endurance geometry for more comfort, something essential for a new rider. The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
Actually there is not. Just weight penalty.
http://road.cc/content/buyers-guide/201326-head-head-shimano-105-v-shimano-ultegra
Depends on which versions you’re comparing. 6800 vs 5800 is closer ( but there are still subtle differences ) 5700 with 6800, the differences are larger, and if you compare 5800 to R8000, they differences are similar to 5700 / 6800. You would need to be actually riding bikes fitted with the different Groupsets on a daily basis / over several miles to know what those differences are, but I do / am, so I’m quite well placed in that regard.0 -
Trivial poursuivant wrote:YiannisM wrote:Pilot Pete wrote:YiannisM wrote:Trivial poursuivant wrote:YiannisM wrote:
Also my advice is to buy an endurance geometry for more comfort, something essential for a new rider. The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
Not true at all. I wouldn't call my TT bike comfortable in the slightest. Its tolerable but I can go a hell of a lot faster on that than on my extremely comfortable Via Nirone 7
Entry lvl alu bike compared to TT in what conditions? flat 40-50km ride? of course you will be faster, but what about on 100km ride with 1500m of elevation?
Ah but YiannisM, you never specified in what conditions with your initial blanket statement about “most comfortable being fastest”, which Trivial quite rightly pointed out as not true....
PP
A new rider, that didnt said that wants to get into TT. You are correct about ultegra, still 105 is great groupset, and its the last thing that i am thinking to upgrade on my infinito.
Point is not about a TT bike per se. It’s the statement comfort makes you faster. It’s not true. You can go faster on a less comfortable bike of any kind if it’s more aero or allows you to get into a more aero position. The TT was an extreme example but I could ride 100km on a very comfortable relaxed upright bike and again on a low down aggressive bike which lets me get lower, I will go faster on the second for as long as I can sustain the position on it even if it’s not particularly comfortable.
Its all about fatigue man, and a more comfortable bike on the long rides will keep you more fresh therefor faster. Thats the idea.0 -
Imposter wrote:YiannisM wrote:The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
It is entirely realistic for someone to be comfortable in a 'racing' position. Lots of people are.
Amen to that, I went through hell on Endurance geometry and assumed I'd never get a bike to be comfortable... now on a race geometry bike with a long/slammed stem and I can ride it all day. Each to their own.0 -
Anyway. Off topic - Decathlon is a brilliant shout if you can get to one. Honestly, any groupset of Tiagra level or above will be great for a beginner as well. My GF still has Tiagra and sees no need to upgrade.0
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YiannisM wrote:Trivial poursuivant wrote:YiannisM wrote:Pilot Pete wrote:YiannisM wrote:Trivial poursuivant wrote:YiannisM wrote:
Also my advice is to buy an endurance geometry for more comfort, something essential for a new rider. The faster one is the one who feels more comfortable, not the one who has the more racing position
Its all about fatigue man, and a more comfortable bike on the long rides will keep you more fresh therefor faster. Thats the idea.
2016 Matthew Hayman won Paris-Roubaix on a Scott Foil. Last year it was won by Greg Van Avermeat on a BMC GrandFondo. 2 very different bikes. So geometry has nothing to do with the comfort they provided. You are confusing comfort with ride quality.0 -
And continuing with a flawed argument to try to convince people that he is right! :roll:
Let’s face it, more aero will more often than not trump less aero with regards speed, different riders can be more comfortable in either position, there is no hard and fast rule...
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