Forced off my bike by oncoming vehicle - Ouch

daveb99

Last Thursday I was out for a short ride at lunchtime, and was unfortunately involved in an accident ending up with me being taken to hospital in an ambulance.

I ride mostly on country lanes, they are decent roads and the motorists are largely very aware and respectful of cyclists. However on this occasion I was cycling along a nice straight stretch at 20mph only a couple of miles from home, when I was suddenly aware of an oncoming car, on my side of the road, overtaking parked cars on his side. He should never have pulled out to do it - there simply wasn't room - and of course it was my right of way. His speed, combined with mine, meant there was no time to simply brake, unclip and stop - it all happened very quickly.

My memory of it is very hazy, because although the car didn't hit me, my avoidance of a collision meant my head hit the road, the helmet did it's job but I've had a nasty gash on the cheekbone and I've suffered some concussion. I also landed on my wrist and shoulder, badly mashed, but neither are broken, and my collarbone is intact.

He was an old guy who was very quick to deny any wrongdoing, so I'm told. There were no other witnesses so I'm left frustrated and angry, and in some pain, but also aware that it could have been a lot worse - I'm fairly sure I hit the road just after he got past me, if it had been in front of him I could have ended up under his wheels, doesn't bear thinking about.

However I'm now thinking about making some minor changes to my rides before I get back out there, and I'd also like to get a GoPro to record my rides, simply so that I can use it as evidence if something happens again.

In terms of the camera, I was looking at the GoPro Session 4, seems like a nice compact bit of kit for £140. Has anyone got one - any thoughts? Or would a second hand Hero 4 Silver be better?

If anyone has any general tips or ideas on minimising risks when I'm out on solo rides I'd really like to hear them.

I feel pretty lucky to be here typing this - I was lying unconscious in the road 5 days ago..

pblakeney

Contact British Cycling.
You do have membership. Don't you?

daveb99

PBlakeney wrote:

Contact British Cycling.
You do have membership. Don't you?

Thanks - I am a member, but how would that help?

pblakeney

daveb99 wrote:

PBlakeney wrote:

Contact British Cycling.
You do have membership. Don't you?

Thanks - I am a member, but how would that help?

Give them a phone and find out.

daveb99

PBlakeney wrote:

daveb99 wrote:

PBlakeney wrote:

Contact British Cycling.
You do have membership. Don't you?

Thanks - I am a member, but how would that help?

Give them a phone and find out.

Very cryptic! Are you referring to the accident itself, or tips on reducing risks?

pblakeney

daveb99 wrote:

PBlakeney wrote:

daveb99 wrote:

PBlakeney wrote:

Contact British Cycling.
You do have membership. Don't you?

Thanks - I am a member, but how would that help?

Give them a phone and find out.

Very cryptic! Are you referring to the accident itself, or tips on reducing risks?

The accident itself. Think what you would do if an on coming car had forced you off the road (and hospitalised) when driving. Take the same actions.

(Edited to reflect the below)

jgsi

Ambulance was called to get you to A&E?
So the Police were also informed and attended this?
if not, why not?
(Of less importance...
A camera would not have stopped such a thing like this from happening, but 'cycle dashcamware' can show negligence up.)

mouth

No contact doesn't mean no liability. I'm no ambulance chaser, but I'd say he owes you a few quid. Such is the incident you describe, dunno what you do for a living but I'd be looking at a month or more off work.

Grahamsjz

GoPro Session 4 is a lovely piece of kit. Fantastic quality video and if you turn image stabalisation on it is superb (can't use image stabilisation and 4K but 1080 is good enough to get reg plates). The downside is battery lasts about 2-3 hours and then the unit needs charging. Love mine.

mfin

There's one particular bit of road I ride where this will happen about one time in four. A car comes out around half a dozen parked cars when I have right of way, going 20/25mph. Every time I have to decide what to do, whether they've seen me, whether they will continue or stop or what.

If anyone has any general tips or ideas on minimising risks when I'm out on solo rides I'd really like to hear them.

Anyway, the advice for this is no different for any other situation when driving, always have a plan of action for when the traffic around you does something unexpected or wrong. It is as simple as that. Be hyper-aware and ride within your abilities to control the bike should anything happen.

cycleclinic

look well ahead is all I can say and assume the worst will happen and ride accordingly.

cougie

I do find taking the centre of the lane and having a bright light on the front dissuades most of this behaviour.
But be prepared to dive left if needed.

shimanobottombracket

Grahamsjz wrote:

GoPro Session 4 is a lovely piece of kit. Fantastic quality video and if you turn image stabalisation on it is superb (can't use image stabilisation and 4K but 1080 is good enough to get reg plates). The downside is battery lasts about 2-3 hours and then the unit needs charging. Love mine.

I was considering getting a camera, but I would need one with a longer battery life. If I did get a camera tho, sods law I would never even have an accident/RTC.

cougie

Get one asap then !

shipley

Sorry to hear of your accident. Exactly the same thing happened to me earlier this year and still have some lingering pains. (viewtopic.php?f=40013&t=13074899).

You can take avoiding action sometimes but other times you can't. Don't let it discourage you, you will always be the most vulnerable of road users so I have treated it as a learning experience and now ride with a bit more deference.

StillGoing

JGSI wrote:

Ambulance was called to get you to A&E?
So the Police were also informed and attended this?
if not, why not?
(Of less importance...
A camera would not have stopped such a thing like this from happening, but 'cycle dashcamware' can show negligence up.)

Police don't attend every RTC. Only where it is serious or fatal, or allegations are being made. What it is, is a reportable RTC and one where the driver of the motor vehicle must provide the name and address of the keeper, their registration details, and as it involves injury, the insurance details to any person having reason to request them. If they don't provide that information, then they must report it to a PC as soon as reasonably practical, or within 24hrs. I doubt that it has been reported if the Police didn't attend and the OP should check up on this, as that in itself is a reportable offence.

The OP is claiming they were concussed, there were no witnesses, yet he's told the other party is denying any wrong doing. Who told them that? Who spoke to them about the RTC? If it was the police, an collision booklet should have been completed.

daveb99

Thanks for the replies. The Police were involved, and I have an incident number - the driver gave all his details to them.

There were no witnesses but despite my hazy memory I do remember having a go at the driver, after I came round, saying he left me no room, no choice etc. In response I am 99% sure he said that he wasn't at fault. My overriding memory is of being quite angry, so although I can't remember the actual incident fully I don't believe it was my fault. Clearly looking at the road (my wife took me back there to take photos etc too) and the parked cars, it can't be my fault - end of.

So I may call British Cycling and get some advice, and nip to the Police station for the information. Unfortunately it's my word against his I suspect and I'm not sure I want all the stress, given how much my head hurts already!

I still have concussion, I work as an IT Manager (mostly from home, not self-employed) but I have to say I'm struggling a bit - I've had 3 days off since it happened, trying to work today but getting intermittent headaches. The worst headaches were about 24 hours after it happened. I may end up taking a bit more time off.

Thanks for the advice on cameras too - I'll look into that further.

Any further advice would be much appreciated.

trivial_poursuivant

I have a go pro rear and a Garmin Virb front on my bike now after a few incidents. I have two due to the amount of times cars have squeezed past me so close that if they had hit me the front would very likely of not picked any evidence up. Plus a rear facing cam will get the drivers face so no denying who was at the wheel.

veronese68

If you measure the width of the road from the parked cars and the width of his car allowing for safe gaps either side would this not prove he was at fault helping if you claim.

trivial_poursuivant

Veronese68 wrote:

If you measure the width of the road from the parked cars and the width of his car allowing for safe gaps either side would this not prove he was at fault helping if you claim.

Is there any photo evidence from the day of the incident? Otherwise the driver could say 'what parked cars?' Difficult to prove on a your vs his argument. He can just deny everything. Cars move, he could argue there was space / no cars etc at that time. No one is going to admit liability especially if no contact was made and no witnesses

veronese68

Trivial poursuivant wrote:

Veronese68 wrote:

If you measure the width of the road from the parked cars and the width of his car allowing for safe gaps either side would this not prove he was at fault helping if you claim.

Is there any photo evidence from the day of the incident? Otherwise the driver could say 'what parked cars?' Difficult to prove on a your vs his argument. He can just deny everything. Cars move, he could argue there was space / no cars etc at that time. No one is going to admit liability especially if no contact was made and no witnesses

The police should know if there were parked cars there at the time, it would say in their report.

trivial_poursuivant

"My memory is all very hazy" says the op. I wonder what he told the police at the time. A decent lawyer for the other driver would use that against them. Going back to the scene there is no guarantee it's not changed since the incident so cannot be reliably used as evidence in the OPs favour. With or without the police being there it's still his word against the drivers. And since he has little recollection of the incident it's not going to be a reliable account.

jgsi

The times I've had the more 'serious' offs, also been a bit hazy on the details .... however....
OP can you link us into Google maps, so the prosecution team can inspect?

daveb99

Trivial poursuivant wrote:

"My memory is all very hazy" says the op. I wonder what he told the police at the time. A decent lawyer for the other driver would use that against them. Going back to the scene there is no guarantee it's not changed since the incident so cannot be reliably used as evidence in the OPs favour. With or without the police being there it's still his word against the drivers. And since he has little recollection of the incident it's not going to be a reliable account.

This, together with the fact that my BC membership is Race Bronze, so doesn't include the legal support, means that I'm probably unlikely to follow this up. I'm pretty sure I told the police that he forced me off the road (and to crash into the ground) but it's his word against mine, as has already been said. I may go to the station and see what info they have, out of interest mainly.

I'm just glad to be alive and well, it could have been so much worse. I thought I was a pretty 'aware' cyclist, but I'll seek to improve on that - and increase my presence too with lights even in daytime - and I like the idea of riding slightly further to the right to make it near impossible for someone to squeeze through such gaps in future.

I'm grateful for all the help.

awavey

daveb99 wrote:

I'm just glad to be alive and well, it could have been so much worse. I thought I was a pretty 'aware' cyclist, but I'll seek to improve on that - and increase my presence too with lights even in daytime - and I like the idea of riding slightly further to the right to make it near impossible for someone to squeeze through such gaps in future.

I'm grateful for all the help.

dont take the learning from this that the car driver didnt see you or you werent visible enough, there are plenty of people driving around on the roads who just assume they dont have to give way to a cyclist, that giving way or taking priority is for motor vehicles only, after all we are just one step up from pedestrians and you dont see cars stopping for them. Ive ridden plenty of single track roads solo,not once has a car coming towards me ever stopped for me, even when theyve just passed a passing place they could have used, even when they just had to slow momentarily, not even brake to stop.

also whilst riding slightly further to the right works most of the time as a means to better manage traffic behind you, it does not work with cars coming towards you, feel free to try it, but I can ride down the centre of my side of the road, with a row of parked cars blocking the oncoming lane, and the cars coming towards me in my lane will keep coming, they wont stop, the mad ones actually spot what you are doing and accelerate towards you to bully you out of the way, so you know obstruction is not the best solution to this, the car will keep coming.

bungle73

Now I'm no legal expert, but surely being on the wrong side of the road and causing a vehicle coming the other way to have an accident way makes it automatically the driver's fault.

bungle73

awavey wrote:

daveb99 wrote:

I'm just glad to be alive and well, it could have been so much worse. I thought I was a pretty 'aware' cyclist, but I'll seek to improve on that - and increase my presence too with lights even in daytime - and I like the idea of riding slightly further to the right to make it near impossible for someone to squeeze through such gaps in future.

I'm grateful for all the help.

dont take the learning from this that the car driver didnt see you or you werent visible enough, there are plenty of people driving around on the roads who just assume they dont have to give way to a cyclist, that giving way or taking priority is for motor vehicles only, after all we are just one step up from pedestrians and you dont see cars stopping for them. Ive ridden plenty of single track roads solo,not once has a car coming towards me ever stopped for me, even when theyve just passed a passing place they could have used, even when they just had to slow momentarily, not even brake to stop.

also whilst riding slightly further to the right works most of the time as a means to better manage traffic behind you, it does not work with cars coming towards you, feel free to try it, but I can ride down the centre of my side of the road, with a row of parked cars blocking the oncoming lane, and the cars coming towards me in my lane will keep coming, they wont stop, the mad ones actually spot what you are doing and accelerate towards you to bully you out of the way, so you know obstruction is not the best solution to this, the car will keep coming.

I must be pretty lucky where I live then, as I generally seem to have a good relationship with car drivers round here. I ride a lot of narrow country roads, and quite often I will have someone in a car coming the other way stop for me to get by, and other times I stop to let them by.

trivial_poursuivant

Bungle73 wrote:

Now I'm no legal expert, but surely being on the wrong side of the road and causing a vehicle coming the other way to have an accident way makes it automatically the driver's fault.

You're completely right, unfortunately in this case there is one missing vital piece . Evidence! In a his word vs mine with no witnesses there is a minuscule chance of success purely because the other side will deny it.

jgsi

Bungle73 wrote:

awavey wrote:

daveb99 wrote:

I'm just glad to be alive and well, it could have been so much worse. I thought I was a pretty 'aware' cyclist, but I'll seek to improve on that - and increase my presence too with lights even in daytime - and I like the idea of riding slightly further to the right to make it near impossible for someone to squeeze through such gaps in future.

I'm grateful for all the help.

dont take the learning from this that the car driver didnt see you or you werent visible enough, there are plenty of people driving around on the roads who just assume they dont have to give way to a cyclist, that giving way or taking priority is for motor vehicles only, after all we are just one step up from pedestrians and you dont see cars stopping for them. Ive ridden plenty of single track roads solo,not once has a car coming towards me ever stopped for me, even when theyve just passed a passing place they could have used, even when they just had to slow momentarily, not even brake to stop.

also whilst riding slightly further to the right works most of the time as a means to better manage traffic behind you, it does not work with cars coming towards you, feel free to try it, but I can ride down the centre of my side of the road, with a row of parked cars blocking the oncoming lane, and the cars coming towards me in my lane will keep coming, they wont stop, the mad ones actually spot what you are doing and accelerate towards you to bully you out of the way, so you know obstruction is not the best solution to this, the car will keep coming.

I must be pretty lucky where I live then, as I generally seem to have a good relationship with car drivers round here. I ride a lot of narrow country roads, and quite often I will have someone in a car coming the other way stop for me to get by, and other times I stop to let them by.

I'd be surprised if you live on the Cheshire Plain.

DavidJB

I very rarely have issues with drivers in W. Berks/Wiltshire/Oxfordshire when I'm alone...Riding in a group on a Sunday morning is a different story but meh. 99.5% of drivers are safe, courteous and respectful. I try to pay it back by being the same when it is safe for me to do so. Unfortunately, it only takes one idiot to kill you.

drhaggis

The sad bit in DavidJB's estimate is that, if you're overtaken by 50 cars per week, you will be overtaken every year by 12 unsafe, rude, and disrespectful drivers. And only one needs to make a mistake.