Advice re trainer/power

barongreenback

Hi all

I've really enjoyed getting back into cycling over the past year following a serious illness. I'm never going to be a racer (terrible hamstrings plus abdominal surgery means I'm pretty upright on the bike) but I do like the idea of improving vs. my previous performance and getting as good as I can be.

Now that we're approaching Winter I'm thinking about how to get myself in good shape. I don't mind a bit of cold although I'm not a fan of getting out in driving rain, plus a structured training plan using a turbo seems like a good way forward. I have no problem sitting on a bike for an hour with some good music indoors and although Zwift seems like good fun I don't feel the need to have a virtual race.

I am however even after searching the forum, completely confused by the array of options on offer and what I actually need. I don't want to spend huge amounts of cash if it's not necessary. Does anyone know of an idiots' guide?

Some questions I have:
- Do all turbos measure power?
- If not, should I get a power meter and does that mean I can get away with a cheaper turbo trainer?
- Some turbo trainers say they only simulate up to 6% gradient (for example) but surely a higher power output in a harder gear would simulate a higher gradient?
- Is a power meter that valuable out on the road if I'm not really pacing myself for a race/sportive? What benefit do I get other than lots of data to add to Strava?

As I say, self improvement is the goal here and I know I can get out and ride more, but I like the idea of having some numbers by which to measure my improvement as well as the structure of a proper training plan.

Thanks in advance and apologies for the vast amount of questions!

qube

Not all turbos measure power. The s/w of your choice to pair with it (Sufferfest, Zwift, Bkool etc) does the clever maths bit.

All you need for this Virtual Power is a Speed/Cadence Sensor. Works well on the platforms I have used it.

The ERG mode you refer to is a bit meh IMO, but if you want to save a few quid, forget it and just get a decent fluid turbo and forget about the whizz bangs of simulating gradients.

The harder and faster you push the pedals on the turbo will increase resistance.

I wouldn't find a PM of much use out on the road, but that's just me.

barongreenback

Thanks. Everything I hear about powermeters is making sure they are consistent from one session to the next. So I'm not really fussed about the absolute number as such, just that it's properly calibrated to whatever it's said in the past.

bobmcstuff

And that's the same with virtual power, you need to keep the setup as close to identical as possible (tyre pressure, tyre compound, contact pressure of the roller etc) as they can all impact the reading.

Virtual power does work well provided you can keep the readings consistent.

I don't really like erg mode as it feels like you never really get on top of the gear like you do on the road or with regular dumb trainers. But it does make cadence easier; using the gears to adjust your power output on a fixed resistance can mean quite a bit of cadence variation.

qube

If you happen to purchase the KK Road Machine, you get their own proprietary PM type device. Basically a BT sensor and magnet attached to the trainer.

Pair it with their app and you can calibrate the device every time you use it for one of the Kinetic app workouts.

This gives me consistent results and also matches the Virtual Power I see on Sufferfest info on screen.

barongreenback

Thanks for all the advice everyone. Combining a few discounts at Halfords and based on the kit I already have (cadence/heart rate monitor) I went for the Tacx Flow. For my fitness level, seems plenty for me at the moment although with an FTP of 226w (2.76 w/kg), it looks like I've got lots of work to do. I quite like the free trial on Zwift although open to any other suggestions.

Big fan and sweat thong for the bike ordered from Amazon!!!

MiddleRinger

Good work. Enjoy the coming winter of indoor cycling pain and progression! :twisted:

Don't worry so much about the FTP figure compared to others - it's just one piece of the fitness puzzle - as long as it's moving in the right direction then you've got nothing to worry about. I didn't consult Dr Google, so is the TACX Flow a smart turbo that can automatically change resistance? If so then give the free trial on Zwift a go and see if you like that. Also check out the Sufferfest videos, they're pretty damn awesome!

milemuncher1

You're on a hiding to nothing trying to measure FTP on something like a 'Wattbike' in a room somewhere. It will give you an idea, and something to work on, but if you want a fuller picture, you need to do a full on, one hour, balls out, effort, with a power meter set up, on the actual road. The figure you arrive at, will be a more accurate 'real world' figure. You can then use Wattbike sessions, to check if your stats are improving, staying the same, or getting worse.

Brakeless

Milemuncher1 wrote:

You're on a hiding to nothing trying to measure FTP on something like a 'Wattbike' in a room somewhere. It will give you an idea, and something to work on, but if you want a fuller picture, you need to do a full on, one hour, balls out, effort, with a power meter set up, on the actual road. The figure you arrive at, will be a more accurate 'real world' figure. You can then use Wattbike sessions, to check if your stats are improving, staying the same, or getting worse.

So you now do 1 hour FTP tests on the road :roll: :roll: :roll:

milemuncher1

Brakeless wrote:

Milemuncher1 wrote:

You're on a hiding to nothing trying to measure FTP on something like a 'Wattbike' in a room somewhere. It will give you an idea, and something to work on, but if you want a fuller picture, you need to do a full on, one hour, balls out, effort, with a power meter set up, on the actual road. The figure you arrive at, will be a more accurate 'real world' figure. You can then use Wattbike sessions, to check if your stats are improving, staying the same, or getting worse.

So you now do 1 hour FTP tests on the road :roll: :roll: :roll:

Always have done, fcuk doing them in a room, on a bloody Wattbike. Waste of time.

imposter2.0

Milemuncher1 wrote:

Brakeless wrote:

Milemuncher1 wrote:

You're on a hiding to nothing trying to measure FTP on something like a 'Wattbike' in a room somewhere. It will give you an idea, and something to work on, but if you want a fuller picture, you need to do a full on, one hour, balls out, effort, with a power meter set up, on the actual road. The figure you arrive at, will be a more accurate 'real world' figure. You can then use Wattbike sessions, to check if your stats are improving, staying the same, or getting worse.

So you now do 1 hour FTP tests on the road :roll: :roll: :roll:

Always have done, fcuk doing them in a room, on a bloody Wattbike. Waste of time.

Stats are so important to you, aren't they....

StillGoing

Milemuncher1 wrote:

Brakeless wrote:

Milemuncher1 wrote:

You're on a hiding to nothing trying to measure FTP on something like a 'Wattbike' in a room somewhere. It will give you an idea, and something to work on, but if you want a fuller picture, you need to do a full on, one hour, balls out, effort, with a power meter set up, on the actual road. The figure you arrive at, will be a more accurate 'real world' figure. You can then use Wattbike sessions, to check if your stats are improving, staying the same, or getting worse.

So you now do 1 hour FTP tests on the road :roll: :roll: :roll:

Always have done, fcuk doing them in a room, on a bloody Wattbike. Waste of time.

What complete baloney.

slowmart

Milemuncher1 wrote:

Brakeless wrote:

Milemuncher1 wrote:

You're on a hiding to nothing trying to measure FTP on something like a 'Wattbike' in a room somewhere. It will give you an idea, and something to work on, but if you want a fuller picture, you need to do a full on, one hour, balls out, effort, with a power meter set up, on the actual road. The figure you arrive at, will be a more accurate 'real world' figure. You can then use Wattbike sessions, to check if your stats are improving, staying the same, or getting worse.

So you now do 1 hour FTP tests on the road :roll: :roll: :roll:

Always have done, fcuk doing them in a room, on a bloody Wattbike. Waste of time.

Any data you'd like to share on your hour FTP tests? It will assist us mere mortals with something to aspire too.

barongreenback

As per my original post, I don't care about absolute numbers, just consistency. I'm not looking for an out and out time trial but if I make sure my tyre is the same pressure each time and the calibration test is showing the same result hopefully should be good enough.

@middleringer - it does indeed change resistance. Feels a bit odd at first but I like the variety!

kingstongraham

barongreenback wrote:

As per my original post, I don't care about absolute numbers, just consistency. I'm not looking for an out and out time trial but if I make sure my tyre is the same pressure each time and the calibration test is showing the same result hopefully should be good enough.

@middleringer - it does indeed change resistance. Feels a bit odd at first but I like the variety!

Yes - you'll be effectively working on the same kind of accuracy as Graeme Obree recommends (he bases it on average speed on the turbo), so you should be good. Repeatability of setup and hence ability to accurately measure progression are key. He'd prefer the simplest magnetic turbo with no features at all, but there you go.