Road bike build (from components) ~£2k

Palladium

I got given a new bike, Whyte Sussex (RRP ~£850) 56 cm, pretty decent but being only 5'7", it soon revealed after doing a few google searches that the bike is probably too big for me. Along with wanting to go for an upgrade of most components of the bike, I decided I'd like to build a road bike.
Reason for building a bike is that I'd like to know how everything fits together, plus I'll get financial support from my parents if I build it (rather than buying).

After having done countless hours of research I think I have a fair idea of what I want, but I thought I'd ask some you who probably have a lot more experience. Please give me some suggestions, what parts I should use, or any other tips/things to watch out for when building a bike.

Frameset: CAAD12 seems to be the result google keeps spitting out, thoughts? http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=137189 This page seems to suggest that it's a rather heavy frame? Also do I go for the 2016/2017 model? The 2016 model is going for £439.99, whereas the 2017 model is going for £849.99? Should I be looking at 2nd hand framesets instead, to save a bit of £?
Cost: (£439.99/£849.99)

Groupset: Shiramo 105 groupset- Most sources seem to agree that this is the most affordable groupset.
Cost: (£450)

Wheels: Mavic Ksyrium Disc- Really, really not sure about this one. Not sure about how important wheels are on a bike, i.e would you rather spend more money on a good set of wheels or more money on a light frame?
Cost: (£250)

Other: I don't think the other components should cost too much (Stem,Seatpost,Saddle,Bars,Cables,Handle Bar tape, etc..) But if you have any suggestions or reccomendations please let me know!
Cost: no idea but I'd estimate about £250??

In general do people have any issues slotting disk brakes on to any old frame or do I need to watch out for this? Ideally I'd like disk brakes on my bike.
Also I'd like to avoid carbon frames, for now, as I have read that they crack easily? I can't afford to keep buying new carbon components all the time :shock:

Thanks for your time,

Calpol

Building your own spec is a good idea and can work out reasonably cost effective. The basis of your build looks sound. That frame is well respected and if you could find a MY16 one at that price and in your size it would be a good start point. Everything I read and hear about 105 5800 is positive. For the price it seems very good value and the step to Ultegra seems less of an upgrade than 5700 to 6700 was.

Personally if you are going disc brakes you should consider if you think the extra expense of Hydraulics is worth it. I have never failed to stop my rim brake road bike in time therefore I reckon I could survive with cable discs. Others on here will tell you only hydro is any good.

Where I think you should give some careful thought is wheels. One of the big benefits I see with going to disc brakes is the anxiety reduction associated with running carbon rimmed wheels. You won't have the issues of weak wet braking, rim overheating and potential delamination. This issues are probably overstated for UK road condition but they are a consideration. With that in mind I'd be tempted to look at getting some chinese 45mm carbon rims with a half decent hub. Light Bicycle one seem to get good reviews on Weight Weenies. They would give an aero advantage and would look really good. The mavics would look be ok but you might aswell buy a whole bike if that is the limit of your customisation.

Summary - frame looks good but MY16 would be bargain. Budget more for the wheels and don't skimp on a cheap saddle unless you know it fits well.

g00se

Hi,

About 1150g for a 54 alloy frame - that's light. Lower priced carbon frames come in only one or two hundred grams or so lighter (that's the water in a quarter to half a drinks bottle). The weight weenies site will always look for the lightest extreme.

Also, the frame you linked to is rim braked - but you are talking about disc-brake wheels? Can you clarify what sort of brakes you are going for?

As for 2016 or 2017, they'll be basically the same frame - your paying for the more recent paint-job.

If you want to save weight - look for lighter wheels (rim braked bikes will generally come in cheaper and lighter than disc braked bikes). Get the lightest, stiffest wheels you can afford - and decent tyres - these will be the best bang for your buck.

But let us know whether you're going for rim or disc brakes first if you want recommendations.

shortfall

The Caad 12 is widely regarded as an excellent frame, regardless of what it's made out of or how much it weighs. Rule of thumb, carbon isn't the be all and end all and neither is frame weight (unless you're a pro).
Shimano 105 is an excellent groupset and is relatively good value for money.
Wheels. Have a look on the handbuilt wheels thread but it's worth remembering the old addage "Light, strong, cheap- pick two". If you want something that works well for not much down there are factory wheels out there for reasonable money but handbuilts often work out cheaper and are easily repaired and fully rebuildable.
Can't help you on the disc front I'm afraid except to say that modern rim brakes work really well in most situations.
As for carbon being prone to cracking, can of worms that one! I suspect the vast majority are absolutely fine most of the time but you might crack carbon components if you fail to use a torque wrench when you're assembling the bike.
Good luck and pics when you've built it!

Palladium

Wow first of all thanks for the replies- I'm completely blown away by how active this forum is, every time I write a reply a new one pops up haha

@Calpol @g00se
Thanks for the re-assurance on the frame. Good spot, although I was only concerned about the weight of the frame, i.e only worried about post #1- but seems like you guys rate the CAAD12 frame.
If I were to get disk brakes do I need to make sure that the frame is compatible with disk brakes?
Unless the markup on disk wheels is completely ludacris I'd like to go with disk brakes, purely because I think they are more reliable and look better. Although if the same £500 rim-brake wheels cost £750 for disk-brake wheels then disk brakes start becoming very exensive, probably not worth it.
In other words, I'm happy to pay for the extra cost of disk brakes, but if that means I need to get a special frame, special wheels then it might not be a good idea. I'm not 100% set on disk-brakes, so could you give me some examples of both disk and rim wheels? That would be fantastic.
Are chinese wheels any good? Actually I never thought about this, anyone have any experience with Chinese wheels?

@Shortfall
CAAD12 +Shimano 105 5800 it is then I guess!
Cheers, ill take a look at that thread. Pics/pricing for parts will most definately be up once it's built!

jdee84

Palladium wrote:

If I were to get disk brakes do I need to make sure that the frame is compatible with disk brakes?
Unless the markup on disk wheels is completely ludacris I'd like to go with disk brakes, purely because I think they are more reliable and look better. Although if the same £500 rim-brake wheels cost £750 for disk-brake wheels then disk brakes start becoming very exensive, probably not worth it.
In other words, I'm happy to pay for the extra cost of disk brakes, but if that means I need to get a special frame, special wheels then it might not be a good idea. I'm not 100% set on disk-brakes, so could you give me some examples of both disk and rim wheels? That would be fantastic.


You will need a disc brake specific frame and groupset if you want to go with disc brakes. Generally a frame will only be compatible with one or the other rim brakes or disc brakes.

Such as this rim brake caad12 https://www.sigmasport.co.uk/item/Canno ... -2017/EY9P

or this disc brake version https://www.tritoncycles.co.uk/frames-f ... 0wodoZoNiA

The disc version of the 105 groupset is likely to be slightly more expensive than the rim brake version.

g00se

I would think discs will end up costing more than rims if you're self-building. There's more choice with rim-brakes so more options to get discounts.

Chinese carbon wheels... There's a lot said about these - from horror stories to love-ins. My take is this. If you buy dirt cheap ones from unknown Chinese sellers on ebay or alibaba, then you could be in trouble. But there are reputable ones in China too such as farsports or carbonzone. However, any warranty will involve shipping them back.

The cheap knockoffs you can get for about £300 on ebay. Farsports and such will cost you £450-500 if you get hit with import duty etc.

If going for carbon, I would get carbon wheels from the UK. the rims are undoubtedly near-identical to farsports but you get local warranty. A lot will recommend Hunt but you could get similar and cheaper with the likes of Stayer (great reputation) and the Prime wheels from ChainReaction are a bargain, especially if you have the British Cycling membership discount - RR-50 50mm-deep carbon wheelset (1550g) for £600.

And of course, there's Malcolm at CycleClinic who will build something similar for much the same - and you have great after-service such as rebuilds.

Back to discs.... 105 rim groupset on Evans is £350. the disc version is £500.

Chainreaction RR-50 wheels - rim is £660 (before discounts), the disk version is £680 (and 200g more) - but you'll need to add rotors to that which will be about £40-50 a pair for decent ones and these will come in at about 300g. So near like-for-like, going disc will cost about £200 more and add about half a kilo in weight.


Wheel depths - it depends on what you want to do? A good compromise would be 38 to 45 but generally, it's shallow for hills and deep for flat speed. Also, in the rim braking world, alloy rims are a better bet for wet riding as carbon rims have a tendency not to stop that well. If you do go deep - don't go for 80mm as it'll make you look a bit of a 'Fred' unless you're time trialling.

Palladium

jdee84 wrote:

You will need a disc brake specific frame and groupset if you want to go with disc brakes. Generally a frame will only be compatible with one or the other rim brakes or disc brakes.

Such as this rim brake caad12 https://www.sigmasport.co.uk/item/Canno ... -2017/EY9P

or this disc brake version https://www.tritoncycles.co.uk/frames-f ... 0wodoZoNiA

The disc version of the 105 groupset is likely to be slightly more expensive than the rim brake version.

Thanks. Definitive decision: I'll use rim-brakes. Looks like it will cost me a few 100 pounds extra if i get disk brakes. Wheels are more expensive, groupset is £100+ more, + I'll need a disk-frame (seems to be fewer of these going around).

Right- anyone who could recommend me some good wheels around the £500 mark? Looking at this Chinese website: https://www.yoeleobike.com/road/wheels/rim-brake.html
23/25mm wide?
What does this mean? lol

shortfall

http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Spokesman-Whee ... 34.c0.m322

You could try these which come in your price bracket and are a UK company and have a UK warranty etc. They get good reviews. Cycle Clinic will build something​ similar at a slightly higher cost.

g00se

It's the hubs. You will want one with a Shimano 10/11 freehub and not a Campagnolo one. The other choice is between a Novatec hub (reasonable budget option) or their own-brand one. I would go Novatec as spares are easy to get.

But be aware that you may be hit with import duties which could add 20+% to the cost.

Personally, I would go for these: http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/prim ... prod142961 - but join British Cycling first so you can get 10% discount.

Or these: http://www.stayercycles.com/store/p142/novatec/stayer

or these: https://thecycleclinic.co.uk/collection ... 6-5mm-wide

trailflow

Edit

Palladium

Thanks @g00se
You made a good point regarding warranty, sending them back to China would be a complete nightmare! The Yeoleo website however has had some great reviews on their wheels, so I guess I'll have to make my mind up, £400/500 chinese wheels or £600 British wheels, might well go for wheels with a local warranty.
Thanks for your input, really appriciated!

I'll start building in 2 weeks or so, I'll make sure to post pics!

g00se

Yup - just looked at reviews for Yeoleo away from their site and they're good too. But remember that if you buy from China, there's a change you'll be hit with a 20%VAT bill + 4.7% duties from customs. It does seem random and some Chinese suppliers will mark goods as 'sample' but it does happen. So a £450 wheel ends up being £550.

trailflow

Recent bad experience of Yeoleo wheels
http://road.cc/content/forum/222891-yeo ... els-update

mr_mojo

Building your own bike to your specification is an excellent way to learn how a bike works and how it is assembled or repaired. Shop around for your components and you'll save money. Last month I build a Colnago C50 excluding the Zipp 404 wheels that I already had spare for approximately £800. Full Campagnolo Record 11 speed groupset, decent 3T and Fizik finishing kit and of course the frame. Picking up some real bagains on eBay. Most of the parts were used but were in excellent condition as I'm quite anal about no damaged or worn parts been fitted.

ZMC888

I like the cannondale frame too.

If it was me I'd forget about disk brakes as they will blow too much of the budget and increase complexity. People say they are great, and in the wet they can be a godsend, but even with 10 years of using and fixing hydraulic disk brakes on mountain bikes and motorcycles I'm not entirely convinced they are a necessity on a road bike.

Get a shimano rim brake 105 groupset with upgraded aftermarket brake pads.

Then I'd get campagnolo wheels - Zonda would be ideal. scirocco if you are on lower budget. Put 25mm to 28mm continental gp4000s2 on them or gp4 season if your local roads are covered in debris like broken glass and metal shards.

I'd spend some money on a nice saddle like a Fizik Antares and a carbon fiber seat post.

Some alloy bars and stem like Deda or Pro with 100mm stem and 42 or 44mm bars depending on your size and then wrap the bars in cork tape, specialized make good stuff. Pedals - either get shimano mountain bike pedals and shoes. Or get shimano 105 road pedals and shoes.
Maybe an FSA headset. Have a look at the bottom bracket, maybe you'll need a praxis conversion Bb for pf30 or BB30.

Cables- if you are buying from new why not get some nice cables like Jagwire Elite link, and they don't cost much more than anything else.
Have I forgotten anything?

galatzo

Had quick read of this so apologies if it was mentioned and I missed it.
A Cannondale 54cm (54.5cm top tube) will be too big for you.
I'm the same height as you and I ride a Supersix (same geometry) in a 52cm(53.5 top tube) and could probably be better with a 50cm (52.52cm top tube).
Not much seatpost showing on mine so there'd be even less on a 54 for you.
Each to there own for how they like their bike to fit though.

g00se

Agree about the side. Cannondale sizes come up big compared to others. I'm 5'9" and have a 51cm CAADX (top tube 53.5cm) and I wouldn't want to go any bigger for my height. So a 50cm CAAD12 sounds about right.

mamil314

As a side note, is 105 aluminium bike all one can get for 2k nowadays? That seems nuts, I paid similar monies for a titanium bike with Chorus a few of years ago.

Calpol

Re: Cannondale sizing

I think you have be very careful around advice here. Everyone is different. At 184cm I am riding a 58 Supersix with a 100mm stem. Its ok for me but I did think at the time I bout it that the 56 might also be about right. However it would have probably meant a great saddle to bars drop and my back and hips don't really rotate like a pro's do despite being is reasonable shape. Really its best to go and try if you can.

Palladium

@trailflow- dunno what I'm meant to make from that, maybe it was an employee gone a bit rogue? He mentioned it was a 'scam'/''fraudulent' operation. Two things I have to say about that, if the company itself was a scam operation then I'd expect to see lots of dislikes on their YT channel/fb page, but that doesn't seem to be the case. Secondly, if anything goes wrong or you didn't receive what you have ordered then it is very easy to get your money back through PayPal (I once bought some headphones from china, they were fake, made a paypal dispute and immidiately got a full refund).

@ZMC888- I really wanted disk brakes, but yeah looks like disk brakes will make the whole bike a lot more expensive. Rim brakes it is then I guess. Yeah I won't go too cheapskate on the saddle. The shimano 105 pedals have some fantastic reviews, might well get those.

@Mr_Mojo- exactly! I'm also a uni student studying engineering so building a bike is very relevant + exciting.

@Galatzo/g00se/Calpol - Thanks for raising this issue. My bike is probably WAY to big for me at the moment, I guess I should probably go to 50/52cm then? I should probably go and try some sizes- although might be kinda hard asking a bikeshop to try their bikes without having any intension of buying it. Thanks for the breakdown.

@mamil314- Yeah sure seems like it!! I also had a look into building a bike with Chinese wheels/frame/fork/pedals. Take a look at this link: https://www.reddit.com/r/bicycling/comm ... superbike/
This guy built a bike for $2600/£2000 just from Chinese parts

Defo puts another spin on it. For the price of one new aluminium CAAD12 frame I can get 3 carbon frames from China. Before the 'cheap chinese crap' comments come, I would like to point out some reviews that people have put down on yt, they all seem to be very positive, some bikes even done 6500+km.
/watch?v=cGXoLuHlt-w
/watch?v=_pwaiovJS04
/watch?v=86qWdmzOIU4
/watch?v=-KXAK3CJHCc&

@everyone- What's your opinion on products from China? I was pretty set on the CAAD12 frame until I came across this:
http://www.velobuild.com/vb-r-077-ultra ... p0035.html
So I guess I could get a frame which is 300 grams lighter and less than half the price? Let me know what you think!
Velobuild also give you a 2 year warranty on the frame, and a 1 year warranty on the wheels.