Bespoke build: Campag Chorus 2015 S2 - experience so far
badgerbeaver
Posts: 102
Thought I would share some of the teething issues I have had after 2015 Chorus S2 was fitted to my new titanium frame.
Campagnolo flavoured problems with the build
1) Front mech not shifting up to the big ring
2) Creaking bottom bracket
3) Rear mech not dropping into smaller sprockets, sometimes not making it up to bigger sprockets. 50% success rate moving from 5th to 6th, resistance pushing up from 2nd to 3rd and 3rd to 4th with the shifter sometimes clicking twice to make the shift
Lessons learnt:
1) Front mech: A couple of things
Firstly the design of the mech means that on some bikes the cable will foul on the mech pivot when in the lower gear, meaning you can't get into up into the big rig without reach down and pushing the cable past the pivot point. There is a little washer that you can get to guide the cable further inboard towards the frame so it clears the pivot point. Have a look at the official Campag installation guide online for the part number and basic instructions.
Secondly, the template MUST be used to set up the front mech. Unless you get lucky, it seems impossible to get right without the template part that guides the cage into the right spot. After that, the adjustment and limit screw adjustment seems spot on, and easier than SRAM in some ways.
2) External bearing cups, English thread. These were not installed with enough grease. Simple as. Don't be shy with the grease and bear in mind there will be some drag with the seals initially until the grease is distributed. Crank fitting, external bearing cups all v easy to fit.
3) Rear Mech. By far the most frustrating set up, even the LBS could not get it sorted. Here's a list of things we tried in order
Adjustment cable tension
Lubrication of the shifter (pointless, no effect)
Checked the frame and gear hanger alignment (no problem there)
Lubrication of cables and manipulating the inner
The latter has helped a great deal. The problem appears to be that the cables were either not lubed enough, or were cut too short with too much friction caused by tight turns. Lesson learnt - lube the cable and be v careful with cable routing in the handlebar zone. It seems that Chorus is VERY sensitive to cable stuff. When I replace the tape later this summer I will also replace inners and outers. I usually run the rear mech cable down the right hand side of the down tube, but running down the left side might reduce the bend and therefore the friction, but haven't done it this way before so it will be a bit of an experiment.
There is a helpful https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umKMVjLhmE4 video online showing the test you can do to check the routing of the outers. Note this cannot really done if you have already trimmed the inner. TBH I would do this test ANYWAY to check that your outer cables are ok and everything running smoothly - do it before you trim your inner cable.
Lastly, regardless of what it says in the instructions, I would advise lubing the gear cables, personally I did this with Lifeline wet lube (the green top). I cannot imagine it has a detrimental effect, so why not.
Some non-Campag problems included here so you can gauge just how dumb I have been in some of my choices. It's my third bespoke build, believe it or not...
Headset: not properly preloaded because the insert inside the carbon steerer was not done up properly
Wheels:
1) Rims rattling - Pacenti SL23 have a problem where a fitting inside the rim at the join comes away and needs to be glued or stamped back on. Personally I happen to think that this is a faulty piece of equipment and would not recommend these rims to anyone. LBS actually recommended H&Son and should have taken this recommendation!
2) Sapim xray spokes were build 3-ply which meant there was just too much flex for me and they would not hold tension and went soft. Had them rebuilt 2 ply with DT swiss round section spokes. All fine now but an expensive mistake.
3) Challenge Strada 25mm tyres - cut to ribbons very quickly on summer roads. Puncture / blow out saw a section of the tread coming away from the carcass of the tyre. Extremely disconcerting(!). LBS sent back to manufacturer and I got a replacement, but it's not a set of tyres I will be replacing like for like.
Look Keo Blade - I used Keo pedals since 2007 but the blade version is not for people who expect to flip and clip quickly. It just doesn't hang in a way that invites the front of your cleat. Annoying.
Used Fizik for bar, stem, saddle, bar tape. All perfect.
Enve fork seems to be spot on, no issues with Chris King Headset once adjusted.
Campagnolo flavoured problems with the build
1) Front mech not shifting up to the big ring
2) Creaking bottom bracket
3) Rear mech not dropping into smaller sprockets, sometimes not making it up to bigger sprockets. 50% success rate moving from 5th to 6th, resistance pushing up from 2nd to 3rd and 3rd to 4th with the shifter sometimes clicking twice to make the shift
Lessons learnt:
1) Front mech: A couple of things
Firstly the design of the mech means that on some bikes the cable will foul on the mech pivot when in the lower gear, meaning you can't get into up into the big rig without reach down and pushing the cable past the pivot point. There is a little washer that you can get to guide the cable further inboard towards the frame so it clears the pivot point. Have a look at the official Campag installation guide online for the part number and basic instructions.
Secondly, the template MUST be used to set up the front mech. Unless you get lucky, it seems impossible to get right without the template part that guides the cage into the right spot. After that, the adjustment and limit screw adjustment seems spot on, and easier than SRAM in some ways.
2) External bearing cups, English thread. These were not installed with enough grease. Simple as. Don't be shy with the grease and bear in mind there will be some drag with the seals initially until the grease is distributed. Crank fitting, external bearing cups all v easy to fit.
3) Rear Mech. By far the most frustrating set up, even the LBS could not get it sorted. Here's a list of things we tried in order
Adjustment cable tension
Lubrication of the shifter (pointless, no effect)
Checked the frame and gear hanger alignment (no problem there)
Lubrication of cables and manipulating the inner
The latter has helped a great deal. The problem appears to be that the cables were either not lubed enough, or were cut too short with too much friction caused by tight turns. Lesson learnt - lube the cable and be v careful with cable routing in the handlebar zone. It seems that Chorus is VERY sensitive to cable stuff. When I replace the tape later this summer I will also replace inners and outers. I usually run the rear mech cable down the right hand side of the down tube, but running down the left side might reduce the bend and therefore the friction, but haven't done it this way before so it will be a bit of an experiment.
There is a helpful https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umKMVjLhmE4 video online showing the test you can do to check the routing of the outers. Note this cannot really done if you have already trimmed the inner. TBH I would do this test ANYWAY to check that your outer cables are ok and everything running smoothly - do it before you trim your inner cable.
Lastly, regardless of what it says in the instructions, I would advise lubing the gear cables, personally I did this with Lifeline wet lube (the green top). I cannot imagine it has a detrimental effect, so why not.
Some non-Campag problems included here so you can gauge just how dumb I have been in some of my choices. It's my third bespoke build, believe it or not...
Headset: not properly preloaded because the insert inside the carbon steerer was not done up properly
Wheels:
1) Rims rattling - Pacenti SL23 have a problem where a fitting inside the rim at the join comes away and needs to be glued or stamped back on. Personally I happen to think that this is a faulty piece of equipment and would not recommend these rims to anyone. LBS actually recommended H&Son and should have taken this recommendation!
2) Sapim xray spokes were build 3-ply which meant there was just too much flex for me and they would not hold tension and went soft. Had them rebuilt 2 ply with DT swiss round section spokes. All fine now but an expensive mistake.
3) Challenge Strada 25mm tyres - cut to ribbons very quickly on summer roads. Puncture / blow out saw a section of the tread coming away from the carcass of the tyre. Extremely disconcerting(!). LBS sent back to manufacturer and I got a replacement, but it's not a set of tyres I will be replacing like for like.
Look Keo Blade - I used Keo pedals since 2007 but the blade version is not for people who expect to flip and clip quickly. It just doesn't hang in a way that invites the front of your cleat. Annoying.
Used Fizik for bar, stem, saddle, bar tape. All perfect.
Enve fork seems to be spot on, no issues with Chris King Headset once adjusted.
0
Comments
-
re the creaking bottom bracket...I've had two types of noise associated with this
- 'ticking', I think this is caused by grit in the bearings so as you did, I added Campag Lithium grease into the bearings to help prevent dirt getting into them.
- 'creaking'. This is almost certainly caused by the bearings moving in the metal cups. Repacking the cups solves the issue for a while, but it comes back after a few 100 miles. I've now fitted the Rogue Mechanic UT shim kit which replaces the wavy washer. A much better solution as long as its done properly (no binding and no play).WyndyMilla Massive Attack | Rourke 953 | Condor Italia 531 Pro | Boardman CX Pro | DT Swiss RR440 Tubeless Wheels
Find me on Strava0 -
That sounds like a horror show of an installation (sorry) and not much better from your LBS...if lubing the shifter was their second ploy then words fail me. The cables must have been ridiculously short. Lubing should not have to have been your answer here, that just attracts dirt.
The front mech bit was interesting, didn't know that.0 -
Bondurant wrote:That sounds like a horror show of an installation (sorry) and not much better from your LBS...if lubing the shifter was their second ploy then words fail me. The cables must have been ridiculously short. Lubing should not have to have been your answer here, that just attracts dirt.
The front mech bit was interesting, didn't know that.
I think you're absolutely right. Thank you - I now feel better for the indignation I felt at the time!
So I suppose that these days with groupsets have such low tolerances, you can't just sling on the components and wing it. More fool me for not getting a Campag dealer to build the bike up for me instead of building it with the frame builder over cups of tea! Cosy yes, but clearly ineffective.
Until I isolated the gear cable as the issue, I had considered going back to Campag 10 speed (per my winter bike and the wheels would be compatible across both), or go compatible with my carbon bike which is 10 speed SRAM which has generally been quite well behaved. In other words, desperate stuff...0 -
Are your gear cables internally or externally routed?
If they are internal and you have a problem with both the front and the rear derailleurs I would suspect that the cables might be looped over each other in the downtube.
I've built two bikes with Chorus 11spd and found it very easy to fit and setup.0 -
My builds with 2014 Chorus (2 no) have both been flawless in service.
On the flipside, a build towards the end of last year with 2015 Chorus initially went well, but during final set-up an odd pulse could be felt and heard whilst spinning the pedals. Frame is a TCR Adv SL ISP in Medium (as was one of the 2014 builds). After being unable to dial it out, I tried the rear derailleur hanger adjustment. It wasn't off by too much, but fixing that didn't remove the pulse when turning the pedals. Neither did wheel changes, etc. Have built perhaps a dozen bikes for myself over the years, and it's the first thing that has stumped me. The bike wasn't going to be ridden over winter, so I just parked the problem., and have yet to ride the bike. Will need to tackle it soon though...0
