BMC Owners, your counsel, comments and general thoughts please...
grahamcp
Posts: 323
My current "best" bike is an '08 Pro Machine. This year I'm looking to get something new, not necessarily another BMC but at the moment I am leaning heavily towards something from their current range (if not possibly a Cervelo).
While my "other" bike has hydraulic discs (a Genesis CdeF30), which I do love, I am leaning towards sticking with calipers for summer best, so I've been looking at the teammachine, SLR01 or more likely SLR02, with Ultegra. As Evans have exclusivity on BMC, I would be limited to what they have and how much they are asking.
My head is saying the SLR02 is the sensible choice. Certainly they are more in line with the maximum I want to spend. But I was wondering if anyone out there can comment on the SLR02 frame from experience? If you've also tried an SLR01 for comparison then all the better! As far as I can gather, the main difference is about 200g in weight, which I'm not too fussed about considering the price difference. But are there any other differences I am missing?
The SLR02 is not available as a frameset, so I'd be restricted to the standard builds, and therefore frame colours as follows:-
SLR01 Ultegra Mechanical £3699 Black with blue flashes
SLR01 Ultegra Di2 £5599 Red
SLR02 Ultegra Mechanical £2899 Yellow
SLR02 Ultegra Di2 £3399 All Black
My predicament here is that from the pictures, the all black one looks by far the best. The yellow one does really doesn't appeal to me anything like as much. So I'd be paying £500 for the colour I like, with Di2 of course but I'm not sure how much I really need that! Has anyone seen the all black one in the flesh to comment on how it looks? (Evans have said they would get one to my local shop so I will be able to see/try before I buy).
Finally did any of you manage to get any discount from RRP at Evans? The British Cycling website hints at something but gives no further info at present.
Thanks All :-)
While my "other" bike has hydraulic discs (a Genesis CdeF30), which I do love, I am leaning towards sticking with calipers for summer best, so I've been looking at the teammachine, SLR01 or more likely SLR02, with Ultegra. As Evans have exclusivity on BMC, I would be limited to what they have and how much they are asking.
My head is saying the SLR02 is the sensible choice. Certainly they are more in line with the maximum I want to spend. But I was wondering if anyone out there can comment on the SLR02 frame from experience? If you've also tried an SLR01 for comparison then all the better! As far as I can gather, the main difference is about 200g in weight, which I'm not too fussed about considering the price difference. But are there any other differences I am missing?
The SLR02 is not available as a frameset, so I'd be restricted to the standard builds, and therefore frame colours as follows:-
SLR01 Ultegra Mechanical £3699 Black with blue flashes
SLR01 Ultegra Di2 £5599 Red
SLR02 Ultegra Mechanical £2899 Yellow
SLR02 Ultegra Di2 £3399 All Black
My predicament here is that from the pictures, the all black one looks by far the best. The yellow one does really doesn't appeal to me anything like as much. So I'd be paying £500 for the colour I like, with Di2 of course but I'm not sure how much I really need that! Has anyone seen the all black one in the flesh to comment on how it looks? (Evans have said they would get one to my local shop so I will be able to see/try before I buy).
Finally did any of you manage to get any discount from RRP at Evans? The British Cycling website hints at something but gives no further info at present.
Thanks All :-)
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Comments
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BMC are usually Nude carbon (black) with the odd flash of colour. This is how BMCs should be. The SLR01 is a very light frame and paint just adds weight in their opinion. Bear in mind an Ultegra mechanical version is under 7kg.
If you don't want to use Evans try http://www.mantel.com dutch but deliver to uk0 -
Except all those in the model range that aren't...SmoggySteve wrote:BMC are usually Nude carbon (black) with the odd flash of colour.0 -
Imposter wrote:
Except all those in the model range that aren't...SmoggySteve wrote:BMC are usually Nude carbon (black) with the odd flash of colour.
The SLR01 is predominantly nude. They made a nice shiny red one which pissed their designers off no end as it added more weight. They spend ages engineering a frame to be as light as possible then slap a load of weighty paint on it. They look better without paint anyway.0 -
Thanks... I hadn't heard of Mantel before (not sure how they have never come onto my radar!). I can't see any current model year BMCs on their site, but they do have a single 2016 SLR01 with Ultegra mechanical which could well fit the bill (black, with white detailing), with over £1000 off. It looks like a single 58cm that is available though, so I would need to go through the geometry charts to make sure the fit was right.0
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Grahamcp wrote:Thanks... I hadn't heard of Mantel before (not sure how they have never come onto my radar!). I can't see any current model year BMCs on their site, but they do have a single 2016 SLR01 with Ultegra mechanical which could well fit the bill (black, with white detailing), with over £1000 off. It looks like a single 58cm that is available though, so I would need to go through the geometry charts to make sure the fit was right.
It may be that they're not allowed to sell current year bikes to the UK, i don't think they even had full bikes for sale on there a year ago so maybe they're now allowed to offer previous year sale models to the UK.0 -
For about the nest 2 years, that would be unlawful if that were the case.
I'm currently outside the UK and left it as default Dutch and still only last years!Currently riding a Whyte T130C, X0 drivetrain, Magura Trail brakes converted to mixed wheel size (homebuilt wheels) with 140mm Fox 34 Rhythm and RP23 suspension. 12.2Kg.0 -
SmoggySteve wrote:Imposter wrote:
Except all those in the model range that aren't...SmoggySteve wrote:BMC are usually Nude carbon (black) with the odd flash of colour.
The SLR01 is predominantly nude. They made a nice shiny red one which pissed their designers off no end as it added more weight. They spend ages engineering a frame to be as light as possible then slap a load of weighty paint on it. They look better without paint anyway.
Weighty paint? Really?0 -
Shortfall wrote:SmoggySteve wrote:Imposter wrote:
Except all those in the model range that aren't...SmoggySteve wrote:BMC are usually Nude carbon (black) with the odd flash of colour.
The SLR01 is predominantly nude. They made a nice shiny red one which pissed their designers off no end as it added more weight. They spend ages engineering a frame to be as light as possible then slap a load of weighty paint on it. They look better without paint anyway.
Weighty paint? Really?
Yup - can add up to a couple of hundred grammes: bits about it in either this month's or last month's Cyclist mag.Postby team47b » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:53 am
De Sisti wrote:
This is one of the silliest threads I've come across.
Recognition at last Matthew, well done!, a justified honoursmithy21 wrote:
He's right you know.0 -
Duplicate post.0
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Matthewfalle wrote:Shortfall wrote:SmoggySteve wrote:Imposter wrote:
Except all those in the model range that aren't...SmoggySteve wrote:BMC are usually Nude carbon (black) with the odd flash of colour.
The SLR01 is predominantly nude. They made a nice shiny red one which pissed their designers off no end as it added more weight. They spend ages engineering a frame to be as light as possible then slap a load of weighty paint on it. They look better without paint anyway.
Weighty paint? Really?
Yup - can add up to a couple of hundred grammes: bits about it in either this month's or last month's Cyclist mag.
Well let's not get into whether 200 grammes makes any material difference to anything or can be described as weighty. But I assume that a "naked" carbon finish will have some kind of protective lacquer coating applied which will also add weight? Any saving can therefore only be the difference between the weight of the lacquer and that of the paint? Maybe it makes a difference to the marketing men but do people really make purchasing decisions going into thousands of pounds based on how much paint weighs? In fact don't answer that, I already know the answer, this is the world of road biking lol!0 -
Shortfall wrote:Matthewfalle wrote:Shortfall wrote:SmoggySteve wrote:Imposter wrote:
Except all those in the model range that aren't...SmoggySteve wrote:BMC are usually Nude carbon (black) with the odd flash of colour.
The SLR01 is predominantly nude. They made a nice shiny red one which pissed their designers off no end as it added more weight. They spend ages engineering a frame to be as light as possible then slap a load of weighty paint on it. They look better without paint anyway.
Weighty paint? Really?
Yup - can add up to a couple of hundred grammes: bits about it in either this month's or last month's Cyclist mag.
Well let's not get into whether 200 grammes makes any material difference to anything or can be described as weighty. But I assume that a "naked" carbon finish will have some kind of protective lacquer coating applied which will also add weight? Any saving can therefore only be the difference between the weight of the lacquer and that of the paint? Maybe it makes a difference to the marketing men but do people really make purchasing decisions going into thousands of pounds based on how much paint weighs? In fact don't answer that, I already know the answer, this is the world of road biking lol!
In the grander scheme of things it's not much but if you painstakingly design a frame to be sub 700g the someone pours 200g of paint on it you would be pissed too.
https://youtu.be/P_O4WZAA9qs1 -
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SmoggySteve wrote:
So I watched the video and he says paint adds 120gm to the naked frame. He said this annoyed the engineers so they released one with "clear coat" but he didn't say how much this added to the build or how much lighter it was than paint. Anyways, 120 gms isn't hefty.0 -
Shortfall wrote:SmoggySteve wrote:
So I watched the video and he says paint adds 120gm to the naked frame. He said this annoyed the engineers so they released one with "clear coat" but he didn't say how much this added to the build or how much lighter it was than paint. Anyways, 120 gms isn't hefty.
You obviously don't get it. Its the point that after making such a light frame something gets put on it that adds nearly a 5th of its original weight. Btw. A thin clear layer will weigh a lot less than paint which is lacquered as well. End of the day they know a damn sight more than you0 -
SmoggySteve wrote:Shortfall wrote:SmoggySteve wrote:
So I watched the video and he says paint adds 120gm to the naked frame. He said this annoyed the engineers so they released one with "clear coat" but he didn't say how much this added to the build or how much lighter it was than paint. Anyways, 120 gms isn't hefty.
You obviously don't get it. Its the point that after making such a light frame something gets put on it that adds nearly a 5th of its original weight. Btw. A thin clear layer will weigh a lot less than paint which is lacquered as well. End of the day they know a damn sight more than you
Yeah you're right, they know there's enough people out there with more money than sense who fall for marketing BS that "heavy paint" might make any material difference to the way a bike rides. In any case, if weight is the deciding factor there are plenty lighter bikes out there or even the Focus Izalco Max which manages to come in pretty close to the BMC at 6.8 kg including discs........and paint! This isn't intended as a pop at you, it's just an observation of how people are so willingly deluded by advertising and marketing which is the real reason behind manufacturers racing to produce ever lighter bikes.0 -
Shortfall wrote:SmoggySteve wrote:Shortfall wrote:SmoggySteve wrote:
So I watched the video and he says paint adds 120gm to the naked frame. He said this annoyed the engineers so they released one with "clear coat" but he didn't say how much this added to the build or how much lighter it was than paint. Anyways, 120 gms isn't hefty.
You obviously don't get it. Its the point that after making such a light frame something gets put on it that adds nearly a 5th of its original weight. Btw. A thin clear layer will weigh a lot less than paint which is lacquered as well. End of the day they know a damn sight more than you
Yeah you're right, they know there's enough people out there with more money than sense who fall for marketing BS like heavy paint is going to slow them down.
You can attribute nearly everything to do with on bikes to 'marketing bs' more aero wheels, wider tyres, electronic gears, disc brakes etc. If you left it to you we would all be riding steel frames with toe clips. Innovation and trying to go that extra step in performance helps later down the line when you can buy a sub 800 quid carbon bike. Car industry does it. Plenty of other industries do it. Every one of them have morons poo pooing their leaps in innovation only for them people to take it for granted later down the line.0 -
SmoggySteve wrote:Shortfall wrote:SmoggySteve wrote:Shortfall wrote:SmoggySteve wrote:
So I watched the video and he says paint adds 120gm to the naked frame. He said this annoyed the engineers so they released one with "clear coat" but he didn't say how much this added to the build or how much lighter it was than paint. Anyways, 120 gms isn't hefty.
You obviously don't get it. Its the point that after making such a light frame something gets put on it that adds nearly a 5th of its original weight. Btw. A thin clear layer will weigh a lot less than paint which is lacquered as well. End of the day they know a damn sight more than you
Yeah you're right, they know there's enough people out there with more money than sense who fall for marketing BS like heavy paint is going to slow them down.
You can attribute nearly everything to do with on bikes to 'marketing bs' more aero wheels, wider tyres, electronic gears, disc brakes etc. If you left it to you we would all be riding steel frames with toe clips. Innovation and trying to go that extra step in performance helps later down the line when you can buy a sub 800 quid carbon bike. Car industry does it. Plenty of other industries do it. Every one of them have morons poo pooing their leaps in innovation only for them people to take it for granted later down the line.
Morons? Where to start? You seem angry Steve when all I did was question whether 120 grammes of paint would make any material difference to the way the BMC rides or why it even matters when it is a long way off being the lightest bike out there anyway. As it happens I am a traditionalist but I can see the value in carbon frames (I've owned plenty) and aero wheels (owned one set and currently have some Borg semi aeros on order which incidentally run wide rims and will be shod with 25mm tubeless tyres). I also use clipless pedals so a Luddite I ain't mate. Innovation is fine, particularly when it brings material and measurable improvements to the speed of a bike, or the way it rides or climbs etc. If it makes me a moron to question whether a coat of clear coat lacquer is better than "hefty" paint then I can live with the accusation. I'm fine with people spending wads on electronic shifting (or naked frames) if that's what they want and I've even said so on these boards, but on a discussion forum it doesn't harm to question people's justification for their decisions and if you're going to flame anyone who dares to question your contributions then may I suggest you just chill out a bit?0 -
Well said Shortfall.
I'd very much doubt that the decision to offer a painted model "pissed the designers off no end", the truth behind that comment is going to be subjective exaggerated here say at most. I'd very much doubt that all of these multiple designers were angry and upset at a painted option anyway, and if all of them were then I'd be stunned that people intelligent enough to design bikes could be that thick.
Note that yes, paint can add a couple of hundred grams or so, Colnago are noted for this as one example and some people get surprised paint can weigh that much when an underlying frame can be so light. Whether it matters is a separate issue of course (it doesn't really, but it does to some people who are chasing the lowest figure their bike can show on the scales, and of course even more people do the same with painted bikes as most bikes are painted without worrying about the paint).0 -
@ MFIN
Thanks. Competition drives innovation and then it's the job of marketing men to convince the public why this year's new invention should find its way onto their bike, or not onto it in the case of heavy paint. ;0)0 -
In answer to the OP, yes I've tried the SLR01, 02 and even 03.
When I was thinking about buying a Teammachine a couple of years back, Evans didn't have a massive number in stock, so I ended up trying quite a few models to get the right size etc. It seemed to me that there was a more noticeable difference in weight between the 02 and 03 than there was between the 02 and the 01. The 01 does have a slightly different geometry, with a lower front end than the others. I ended up going from a 54cm Canondale to the 51cm BMC, which had a similar toptube length, but a much lower stack height and hence I wasn't sure about having an even more aggressive geometry.
I actually ended up buying an 02 with 105. It seemed to me that that this was much the best value for money - why pay another £800 quid for ultegra and some slightly better basic wheels? With the money I saved I was easily able to buy a really decent set of wheels that actually made the bike lighter than the more expensive models.
I see what you mean about the paint jobs (some of them really are pretty dodgy), and I'd not have a yellow one. To be honest, I'd be inclined to go for a 2016 SLR02 105 and buy it some upgrades.0 -
Just re-visiting this thread - I've been busy getting the cash together for my new bike but haven't actually made a final decision yet! I noticed that Evans have knocked 700 off the team machine SLR01 Ultegra, plus a further 250 if I find any old rust bucket to trade in, and I can get another 10% off through a voucher scheme - so that is looking quite attractive. I am slightly paranoid over comments I've seen that say the SLR01 is long & low, more aggressive, but I've been studying the geometry charts, and it doesn't seem all that bad - at least not for a 58cm, unless I am missing something.
Anyway my local Evans are getting a 58 in for me to test ride, so it will be interesting to see how the 58 suits me - I decided the 56 would be too small.0
