Gearing change advice

Chrisjb22

basically my gearing is too high and I need to do somethign about this.
I have a 53/39 and 11/28. (Ultegra)
39/28 is too high and im struggling on some of the hills around here and I'd like my climbing experience to be a little more pleasant. Im of medium fitness and will go out for cycle 50 miles or so a couple of time a week.

I didnt really choose these gear ratio's, just found a good second-hand deal for a bike and have lived with it for a couple of years - if I had known then what I know now I wouldnt have brought this Specilized Tarmac Expert.

Id also like to make this change with minimum expense and not have to also change the entire gearing mechanism

1st option would be to sell the bike and find something more appropriate ( i've been thinkign of doing this for a while).

2nd option is to change the cassette - but changing it to a 30 isnt much of a difference so its hardlly worth it. Im not sure i can change it to a 32 - which would then mean I would have to also change the rear mech. Im not sure what issues would arise from this

3rd option is to change the entire chainset from Standard to Compact i.e. But this is probably going to rack up the costs which Im against doing. I

If the option to significantly make a change to allow lower gearing is meanign a change of the chainset then I would probably prefer to change the bike.

sungod

you can get a compact chainset for 50-60 quid, maybe less if you can find a voucher code, also there'll be plenty on ebay

once you've done it, put the old chainset on ebay to recoup some cost

if that's too much, selling the bike and getting another may be better, but depends how much you can get for it vs. what you'd want to buy

imposter2.0

As above - I'd go straight for option 3. If you are otherwise happy with the bike, then selling it because the gearing is wrong sounds a bit OTT, especially when swapping chainsets is such a (relatively) straightforward task.

keef66

Yep, you already have a decent cassette, so get yourself a compact chainset with 50 / 36 or 34 chainrings

Hell, I even stuck a 46/36 CX chainset on my winter bike; much more usable ratios for me.

bernithebiker

Chrisjb22 wrote:

basically my gearing is too high and I need to do somethign about this.
I have a 53/39 and 11/28. (Ultegra)
39/28 is too high and im struggling on some of the hills around here

You are not alone. Numerous Cat 1 / Elite riders at the Etape du Tour this year thought they could get away with it on the Joux Plane by fitting a 28/11 to their standards.

It only took a km or 2 of 10% to see them absolutely mullahed (?) by that climb, wishing for a lower gear. I even saw one guy topple over sideways, and this was the pointy end of the race.

Still, at least they looked cool, what with that big 53 ring and all....!

Just swap your chainset over, easy peasy.

Chrisjb22

Thanks for the advice.

So didn't realise how low the prices are to buy a 2nd hand chain set. (thought id be looking at £200 or so)

if I go for a 50/34, what other issues will i need to address? i.e. will i need to change the chain or shorten it?

Will i need to change the front mech?

Is it perhaps more advisable to stick with Ultegra (as the rest of the group set is) or it doesn't particularly matter?

Fypo

Yes you may need to shorten your chain a little but that isn't hard, no need for a different front mech, it may also need a little adjusting though. It doesn't really matter what chainset you get, but you should make sure it is 11 speed for the best shifting.

StillGoing

Chrisjb22 wrote:

Thanks for the advice.

So didn't realise how low the prices are to buy a 2nd hand chain set. (thought id be looking at £200 or so)

if I go for a 50/34, what other issues will i need to address? i.e. will i need to change the chain or shorten it?

Will i need to change the front mech?

Is it perhaps more advisable to stick with Ultegra (as the rest of the group set is) or it doesn't particularly matter?

You certainly need to lower the front derailleur and consequently adjust the cable tension again. You might get away with the chain length, but it's an easy job to snip a link or two out.

keef66

Dura Ace, Ultegra, 105 or Tiagra chainsets will all work just fine. Which you go for will depend mainly on your budget and how much the appearance of the thing is important to you.

You'll need to drop the front mech down a few mm then readjust the cable for best shifting. Maybe take a link out of the chain too.

philbar72

Go compact or mid compact (52/36). if you drop down to mid compact you might not need to take any links out of the chain.

compact would be much easier than a double up most hills.

debeli

I quite understand the desire to lower one's gearing and I accept that the customer (in this case the OP) is always right.

Nonetheless, you have quite a nice spread of gears there with your 53/39 and a lowest of 28 on the cassette.

My lowest is 39/23 and I ride in among the Malvern Hills and the Black Mountains. Certainly there are times when I might be looking forlornly at my rear hub, wishing I had another cog, but for 98% of climbs and for 100% of flats and descents, the gearing I have is perfect.

There is not much tarmac in the UK that 39/28 won't get you up on a standard road bike. I am no mountain goat - far from it - but there is no shame or crime in just grinding slowly at the lowest gear you have.

If I were to drop to a compact, I would lose some of the benefits I get from being able to descend on 53/11.

Swings and roundabouts, but my instinct is to stick with what I have. You have a lovely bike. Swapping the chainrings won't make it very much better - and even where it does, that might be at the cost of performance elsewhere.

But it's not my bike....

keef66

I'm fast approaching 60 and my knees are knackered. I bought a cheap second hand groupset when I built up my CR1, and it came with a standard 53/39 chainset. I thought I'd get fitter and faster but after a year or so I had to admit defeat. The 53 tooth chainring was barely used. I fitted my old 105 triple instead. Now I spend most of my time in the 39, zipping up and down the 12-27 cassette, but come a steep hill I'm glad of the 30t inner chainring and my ability to spin up just about anything. The 50t big ring is only really used if I have a long downhill and / or a tailwind...

ForumNewbie

Debeli wrote:

There is not much tarmac in the UK that 39/28 won't get you up on a standard road bike. I am no mountain goat - far from it - but there is no shame or crime in just grinding slowly at the lowest gear you have.

I agree no shame in grinding up, but spinning up steep climbs on a 34/28 is clearly much more manageable, and the OP clearly feels he needs lower gears. I don't blame him as lower the better when you get to 15%-20% gradients and above.

flasher

Debeli wrote:

My lowest is 39/23 and I ride in among the Malvern Hills and the Black Mountains. Certainly there are times when I might be looking forlornly at my rear hub, wishing I had another cog, but for 98% of climbs and for 100% of flats and descents, the gearing I have is perfect.

There is not much tarmac in the UK that 39/28 won't get you up on a standard road bike. I am no mountain goat - far from it - but there is no shame or crime in just grinding slowly at the lowest gear you have.

Congratulations you are a true hero :roll:

I shall hang my head in shame as I look down at my semi-compact and compact chain sets.

bernithebiker

Debeli wrote:

I quite understand the desire to lower one's gearing and I accept that the customer (in this case the OP) is always right.

Nonetheless, you have quite a nice spread of gears there with your 53/39 and a lowest of 28 on the cassette.

My lowest is 39/23 and I ride in among the Malvern Hills and the Black Mountains. Certainly there are times when I might be looking forlornly at my rear hub, wishing I had another cog, but for 98% of climbs and for 100% of flats and descents, the gearing I have is perfect.

There is not much tarmac in the UK that 39/28 won't get you up on a standard road bike. I am no mountain goat - far from it - but there is no shame or crime in just grinding slowly at the lowest gear you have.

If I were to drop to a compact, I would lose some of the benefits I get from being able to descend on 53/11.

Swings and roundabouts, but my instinct is to stick with what I have. You have a lovely bike. Swapping the chainrings won't make it very much better - and even where it does, that might be at the cost of performance elsewhere.

But it's not my bike....

53-11 at 100 cadence is 60.7km/h
and
50-11 at 100 cadence is 57.3km/h

Not a massive difference.

Going down a 5km 9% hill at these speeds would take 4'56s on the 53, 5'14s on the 50, so 18 seconds faster (but there's nothing to stop you pedalling at 106 cadence on the 50 to match the 53).

However, going UP the same hill, a speed of 13km/h would be quite competitive, assuming you're giving it full beans.

On the 39-23 you'd be pedalling at 60 at that speed. On the 34-28, a much healthier 85. Contrary to the descending case, you CANNOT increase your cadence on the 39-23, as you are already pushing at max sustainable power. Little ramps, (like hairpins) may drop your cadence to 40ish (versus 57)).

If you were to be even just 5% less efficient due to your low cadence, this would cost you about 1 minute 20 seconds, far more than you gained down the hill.

It may be that hills aren't that steep in your area, I don't know it, or maybe you're a very efficient grinder (they do exist).

Anyway, food for thought...

davep1

My old bike had 53-39 initially with a 12-25, and I found all my mates with compacts would spin up the hills and pull away from me. I could get up them all, but would be slow, and out of the saddle way before the guys with compacts. I swapped the cassette for a 27, and noticed a difference, so much so, when that wore out I went to a 29.
My advice is to try the cassette, it will be cheaper and simpler than the chainset.
My new bike has a semi compact with 11-28. Before the Fred I went for an 11-32, new chain and mech for about 100 quid. Best compromise gearing for me. People who prefer compacts say you don't lose out at high speeds, but you don't have to be pedalling absolutely flat out down a 1 in 4 to run out of gears with a compact

lesfirth

Debeli wrote:

I quite understand the desire to lower one's gearing and I accept that the customer (in this case the OP) is always right.

Nonetheless, you have quite a nice spread of gears there with your 53/39 and a lowest of 28 on the cassette.

My lowest is 39/23 and I ride in among the Malvern Hills and the Black Mountains. Certainly there are times when I might be looking forlornly at my rear hub, wishing I had another cog, but for 98% of climbs and for 100% of flats and descents, the gearing I have is perfect.

There is not much tarmac in the UK that 39/28 won't get you up on a standard road bike. I am no mountain goat - far from it - but there is no shame or crime in just grinding slowly at the lowest gear you have.

If I were to drop to a compact, I would lose some of the benefits I get from being able to descend on 53/11.

Swings and roundabouts, but my instinct is to stick with what I have. You have a lovely bike. Swapping the chainrings won't make it very much better - and even where it does, that might be at the cost of performance elsewhere.

But it's not my bike....

When I read the OPs post I knew it would not be long before we heard this point of view. I am very envious of your climbing ability mountain goat or not.When you say what "you" need, it depends very much on who" you" are. I have 30 front 30 back. That is what I need to enjoy my cycling, many decades ago I did not. Remember OP is is better to have a gear you do not need than to need a gear you do not have.

debeli

My apologies if my post sounded as though it was another MTFU exhortation.

I have no racing credentials and was slow even when I was younger and slimmer. Now I am neither and am slower still...

I tried (and failed) to offer the opinion that going for lower gears is not ALWAYS the answer.

So.... Apologies again for seeming to belittle the desire for lower gears. Nothing of the sort. I just quite enjoy the grind and burn of the slow, painful climb. I may be in the minority on this.

ForumNewbie

DaveP1 wrote:

People who prefer compacts say you don't lose out at high speeds, but you don't have to be pedalling absolutely flat out down a 1 in 4 to run out of gears with a compact

You still pedal going down 25% descent??

philbar72

the other thing to mention is some people actually enjoy going up hills overgeared. I run 36 x28 for the most part as my lowest gear and there are times where I really want a 34 tooth on the front. like that 15th 4th cat climb in Liege for example....

davep1

ForumNewbie wrote:

DaveP1 wrote:

People who prefer compacts say you don't lose out at high speeds, but you don't have to be pedalling absolutely flat out down a 1 in 4 to run out of gears with a compact

You still pedal going down 25% descent??

No, that isn't what I was saying. With a compact, it doesn't take a steep hill and a tornado-following wind to run out of gears. The same guys who were spinning past me on the uphills were having to coast when the speed got up to the igher end of the spectrum because they didn't like the very high cadence needed.

keef66

My tallest gear on the triple is 50 x 12. I'm in East Anglia, and round here I never come close to spinning out in that. Occasionally on the winter bike with it's CX chainset and 46 x 12 top gear, but then I'm usually out in crap weather and welcome the excuse to take a breather...

bernithebiker

DaveP1 wrote:

The same guys who were spinning past me on the uphills were having to coast when the speed got up to the igher end of the spectrum because they didn't like the very high cadence needed.

On decent descents* (!), I tend to stop pedalling at about 60 to 65km/h which is 104 to 112 cadence-ish on my 50-11.

I could pedal on to 70km/h (122ish) if need be, but I've found by experimentation that I'm better off adopting a full aero tuck and not pedalling, as it works out faster, and saves energy. At these speeds aero is everything.

If I was on a 53-11, I don't think much would change here.

*>6%, >2km