Black brakeset Sram

mroli

Hi there - looking for a black brakeset (caliper, non-hydro) that is SRAM compatible. I understand the new(er) Shimano brakes have been changed so as not to be SRAM/Campag compatible - SRAM Red and Force are silver/grey and I was looking for something a little more fancy than Rival (running Red on the rest of the bike, but with a black Force crankset).

Any tips? I have been trying to locate some Sram Red (Black) brakes, and found them on chain reaction at £160 for a pair: http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/sram-red-caliper-brake-with-carbon-pads/rp-prod128862
but thought I would put it to the expertise of the forum to see if there is a better deal elsewhere (especially given that I will need to swap the pads out)! Thank you!

GB have them for £116 but are out of stock: http://www.gbcycles.co.uk/p/36405/Sram-Red-Black-Brake-Set?kw=&fl=1000&ci=44622670262&network=pla&gclid=CLuclYDFwswCFdQaGwodG50JZQ

which would be perfect....

Less so are the Slane ones: http://www.slanecycles.com/sram-red-black-brake-callipers-front-and-rear-2011-p-18222.html?language=en&currency=GBP&fo_c=303&fo_k=16b8acd9d27feff98aef97bc077b62a0&fo_s=gplauk&gclid=CPK29NvFwswCFUwq0wodzz4GAg

Which feel like a lot for 5 year old brakes...

ugo.santalucia

Explain how a cable operated rim caliper might not be compatible with a cable pulling brake lever...

bendertherobot

http://www.wiggle.co.uk/sram-apex-black ... liper-set/

mroli

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Explain how a cable operated rim caliper might not be compatible with a cable pulling brake lever...

Well, I believe (from what I have read on the internet which I admit is NOT always the most accurate reflection of what is real and true ) that the amount of cable pull required to operate the brakes is different now on Shimano and Sram. This means you either are required to pull more or less on the lever to get the same amount of braking performance. Naively I would assume that the way that brakes are currently set up is so that the amount of pull gives you the perfect balance between modulation and immediacy of braking. Although I recognize that I am taking much of this on faith

If someone however runs say Ultegra brakes happily with a Sram set up and says that the braking is good and the set looks great, then I'm happy to take that on board (same with Campag - but not sure how the lack of the "open" lever works)

Bender - thanks for the suggestion, but if I'm discounting Rival for not being fancy enough (insert tart icon here), I'm unlikely to go with Apex?!

rolf_f

mroli wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Explain how a cable operated rim caliper might not be compatible with a cable pulling brake lever...

Well, I believe (from what I have read on the internet which I admit is NOT always the most accurate reflection of what is real and true ) that the amount of cable pull required to operate the brakes is different now on Shimano and Sram. This means you either are required to pull more or less on the lever to get the same amount of braking performance. Naively I would assume that the way that brakes are currently set up is so that the amount of pull gives you the perfect balance between modulation and immediacy of braking. Although I recognize that I am taking much of this on faith

Repeat after me "I will not read (and believe) manufacturers marketing bollocks, I will not read manufacturers marketing bollocks". A cable brake system consists of a couple of levers, two or three pivots and a cable. The brake caliper needs a smallish movement to press the pads onto the rims. The brake lever needs a bigger movement to allow the fingers to control the pad movement. Too much and your fingers aren't long enough to operate the levers, too little and it will all seem a bit binary, on and offy. Beyond that, it doesn't matter a flying f what the exact ratios are. It will take you about five minutes to get used to even the most radical feasible change of lever ratio.

Quite honestly, I find it vaguely insulting that a manufacturer would try to make out their having changed the lever ratios makes any practical difference at all!

To elaborate on Ugos last comment, I would like to see if anyone can come up with a conventional caliper and cable lever combination that doesn't work. But lets not be silly; lets restrict it only to componentry made over the last 50 years!

PS re the Campag thing - you'd have to release the cable or deflate the tyres to get your wheel off if you put Campag calipers on. Best just swap the entire groupset to Campag!

banditvic

Value for money and superb stoppers get some Black 105 ones. I love Sram but these are better than my Red ones.

mroli

Rolf F wrote:

Repeat after me "I will not read (and believe) manufacturers marketing ****, I will not read manufacturers marketing ****". !

I will not read (and believe) manufacturers marketing ****, I will not read manufacturers marketing ****.

:oops:

(Lennard Zinn told me: http://velonews.competitor.com/2016/02/bikes-and-tech/technical-faq/394512_394512)

OK - so I can use Shimano brakes with SRAM levers then. 105 not quite blingy enough for this build I feel. Shame about Campag as the skeleton brakes look lovely.

Am guessing the other possibles like TRP, Miche, FSA are not really worth it?

meesterbond

Clearly the answer is eeBrakes.
Black, light, really effective, suitably blingy and work with both SRAM and Shimano.

A tiny bit pricey maybe but otherwise perfect.

trek_dan

Look at TRP brakes if you want something black and a little more posh than 105.

svetty

The 105 ones actually look OK TBH - 5800 series of course. I'd say get the DA 9000 brakes but they are the same price as Red and although better functionally, if you've got SRAM elsewhere I'd get Red if you're going to spend that much.

StillGoing

Shop around for some old style SRAM Red Black callipers on eBay.

mroli

meesterbond wrote:

Clearly the answer is eeBrakes.
Black, light, really effective, suitably blingy and work with both SRAM and Shimano.

A tiny bit pricey maybe but otherwise perfect.

Ouch. A bit too blingy...

mroli

philthy3 wrote:

Shop around for some old style SRAM Red Black callipers on eBay.

Been looking, not been successful....

mroli

trek_dan wrote:

Look at TRP brakes if you want something black and a little more posh than 105.

Any model rec?

StillGoing

There's nothing wrong with the Rival 22 brakes.

mroli

philthy3 wrote:

There's nothing wrong with the Rival 22 brakes.

Yeah - to be honest, there's nothing wrong with most of the brakes I've been looking at, at the "lower" end of the market - same as there is nothing wrong with 105 etc. They're more than good enough for me. I'm doing the rest of the build with Sram Red (with a Force chainset), so I've kind of got it in my head to maintain the bling factor with an Ultegra/Force or higher brakeset.

Rode with a mate today who uses Ultegra with campag skeleton brakes and they look SWEET, but I'm going to be "coupling" my rear brake (ie putting a spit into it as its going on a breakaway bike) and no flex will make it a bit trickier...

StillGoing

I run a combination of SRAM components on both bikes. My main bike is SRAM Force 22 using 105 brakes (Reacto that needs direct mount brakes and SRAM don't make them) the rear of which is crap but I think its more to do with the brake being under the BB and a bad design. My second uses an old Force wifli rear deraileur with Rival 22 shifters and SRAM Red Black brakes (not for sale) but the modern day Rival 22 and Force 22 brakes are as good. As things evolve, the technology passes down to the lower end products so todays Apex is yesterday's Rival etc etc. Nobody is going to notice what make your brake calipers are other than you. Your only concern should be are they going to stop you.

trek_dan

mroli wrote:

trek_dan wrote:

Look at TRP brakes if you want something black and a little more posh than 105.

Any model rec?

My friend has the R879 on his bike. Having looked at the cost online they are only marginally cheaper than Red though.