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Safe passing petition needs your help

itboffinitboffin Posts: 19,690
edited May 2016 in Commuting chat
I'm not one for petitions usually but this one is a real no brainer.

Petition to introduce a permanent, minimum passing distance when overtaking cyclists.
Cycling in the UK has become a truly popular sport and way of commuting, but we still vulnerable.In 2014 21,287 cyclist were injured in reported road accidents in the UK, 113 were killed and 3,401 were seriously injured.The Highway Code, Rule 212 states giving "plenty of room" when passing cyclists.

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/128190
Rule #5 // Harden The censored Up.
Rule #9 // If you are out riding in bad weather, it means you are a badass. Period.
Rule #12 // The correct number of bikes to own is n+1.
Rule #42 // A bike race shall never be preceded with a swim and/or followed by a run.

Posts

  • macleod113macleod113 Posts: 560
    Signed also. How has the law affected motorists and cyclists in other countries so far is there any feedback on prosecutions?
    Cube Cross 2016
    Willier GTR 2014
  • smokey_baconsmokey_bacon Posts: 1,637
    Signed.
  • wolfsbane2kwolfsbane2k Posts: 2,965
    Signed, but being the highway code, breaking it isn't breaking the law, just more evidence towards "driving without due care & attention".
    Intent on Cycling Commuting on a budget, but keep on breaking/crashing/finding nice stuff to buy.
    Bike 1 (Broken) - Bike 2(Borked) - Bike 3(broken spokes) - Bike 4( Needs Work) - Bike 5 (in bits) - Bike 6* ...
  • rick_chaseyrick_chasey Posts: 50,109 Lives Here
    Say you've decided to take the road instead of the bike path on embankment.

    No way could they give you 1.5m.

    Nor do I think it reasonable that they should.
  • bigmatbigmat Posts: 5,108
    I'm with Rick, I don't necessarily agree with the proposal, although having a debate on passing distances might still be beneficial.
  • wolfsbane2kwolfsbane2k Posts: 2,965
    Say you've decided to take the road instead of the bike path on embankment.

    No way could they give you 1.5m.

    Nor do I think it reasonable that they should.

    Bearing in mind I'm not a London cyclist,
    I not sure if I'm reading this right, but are you saying your for mandating use of cycle paths and if not being used, supporting punishment passes?

    Or just mandating a cycle path use where it is actually good enough, in which case, what counts as good enough?
    Intent on Cycling Commuting on a budget, but keep on breaking/crashing/finding nice stuff to buy.
    Bike 1 (Broken) - Bike 2(Borked) - Bike 3(broken spokes) - Bike 4( Needs Work) - Bike 5 (in bits) - Bike 6* ...
  • fnq59fnq59 Posts: 37
    We have had it in Queensland, Australia, as a trial which has just now become permanent. In summary the passing rule is 1m for speed limits up to 80kmh and 1.5m for 80+kmh. Motorists are allowed to cross double lines to pass a cyclist if safe to do so.
    I don't believe there have been many or any prosecutions, certainly not in my area, but it has made motorists more aware and we have noticed a difference. Of course there is still the redneck element where these rules have been like a red rag to a bull & has created some aggro.
    An unintended consequence has been an increased difficulty in getting permits to conduct road racing as the powers to be have argued that with the 1.5m rule it is more difficult for traffic to pass a bunch due to oncoming vehicles!? (That was their actual argument they didn't cotton on to the fact that maybe overtaking traffic should wait until there was nothing coming :shock: )
  • 964cup964cup Posts: 1,359
    Highway code rule 163. Explain to me how that needs changing, rather than just enforcement?
  • adam0bmx0adam0bmx0 Posts: 263
    I used to live and commute in London for 3 years, I've now emigrated to Queensland in Aus and even though we have a 'law' here for safe passing distance, browsing the equivalent of this forum for Australia, a lot of video submissions of close passes are provided to the police but nothing ever comes of it, some of the vids of the passes are very dangerous.

    Some close passes aren't really that bad, and coming from London, I'm used to vehicles being in close proximity, but its the speed differential that is the biggest issue, when you have a 20 ton truck nail it past, 20cm from your elbow at 65mph its a bit scary.

    Some vids throughout this thread here incase any one wants to see what its like out here in Oz;

    http://www.bicycles.net.au/forums/viewt ... tart=13925
    If the bar ain't bending, you're just pretending
  • lincolndavelincolndave Posts: 8,263
    I've just had this reply from the dept of transport
    Government responded:

    This Government currently does not have plans to legislate on a set minimum space e.g. 1 metre on roads with a speed limit of up to 30mph when overtaking a cyclist.

    This type of legislation would be extremely difficult to enforce and the Government does not believe that it would add to the existing rules and guidance, including those set out in the Highway Code, which advises drivers to give cyclists “at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car”.

    We are keeping this position under review, and are interested in learning from the experience of places where legislation of this type has been introduced. One example is South Australia, where since 25th October 2015, drivers are required to give a minimum of one metre when passing a cyclist where the speed limit is 60km/h (37.3mph) or less or 1.5 metres where the speed limit is over 60km/h (40mph). The penalty for drivers caught disobeying this rule is a $287 (£148) fine, plus a $60 (£31) victim of crime levy and 2 demerit (penalty) points. However, it will take time to understand the benefits and impacts of this legislation on cyclists and other road users.

    Department for Transport

    Click this link to view the response online:
  • rick_chaseyrick_chasey Posts: 50,109 Lives Here
    Say you've decided to take the road instead of the bike path on embankment.

    No way could they give you 1.5m.

    Nor do I think it reasonable that they should.

    Bearing in mind I'm not a London cyclist,
    I not sure if I'm reading this right, but are you saying your for mandating use of cycle paths and if not being used, supporting punishment passes?

    Or just mandating a cycle path use where it is actually good enough, in which case, what counts as good enough?

    Neither.

    It's just a busy road heading both ways which most of us here at familiar with where traffic and bikes move at relatively close speeds.

    There are a lot of bikes on that stretch and there are a lot of cars.

    With a bike on the road at 10mph, I can't really see anywhere where a car could pass with 1.5m. So one bike would cause huge congestion almost instantly.

    Given the relative speeds are similar, I don't think a 1.5m passing distance is necessary.

    Same goes for any busy roads.
  • Not feasible on rural roads either. If a car was required to give 1.5m on my commute it'd be in the bushes. I'd cause huge tail backs of angry motorist being forced to do 17mph on a 40 or 60mph road.

    Pulling in at the next safe place to let cars past would need to be a requirement, which I'm o.k with, but I doubt club runs or those out chasing KOMs would be.
  • itboffinitboffin Posts: 19,690
    seeing as most motorists are totally unable to stick to the speed limit the minute they see an open road i cant see anyone obeying a passing distance rule or law.

    common sense does not prevail, see a cyclist and another vehicle coming the other way, dont slow down and wait no squeeze through the non existent gap at the same speed or faster.

    This is how it is, more so out of town in my experience.
    Rule #5 // Harden The censored Up.
    Rule #9 // If you are out riding in bad weather, it means you are a badass. Period.
    Rule #12 // The correct number of bikes to own is n+1.
    Rule #42 // A bike race shall never be preceded with a swim and/or followed by a run.
  • itboffin wrote:
    seeing as most motorists are totally unable to stick to the speed limit the minute they see an open road i cant see anyone obeying a passing distance rule or law.

    common sense does not prevail, see a cyclist and another vehicle coming the other way, dont slow down and wait no squeeze through the non existent gap at the same speed or faster.

    This is how it is, more so out of town in my experience.

    This.

    I commute on a road that runs between towns through countryside.
    It goes from a 60, to a 50 then down to 40 and finally 30.

    Doesn't matter what the limit is the all seem to try and get past regardless of what is coming the other way.

    There is little or no common sense when people get behind a wheel, and no petition or change in legislation will change their attitude.
    You cannot fix stupid.

    The only way close passing and dangerous driving will stop is if you take away their licence.
    But this will never happen.

    In short, I will sign the petition and hope it works, but I'm not holding out hope.
  • FishFishFishFish Posts: 2,238
    I got an email back from 'the government' basically saying they do not intend to do anything about it because it is unenforcible. So there. Pity actually as Australia seems to have added some legislation rather than relying on a highway code.
    ...take your pickelf on your holibobs.... :D

    jeez :roll:
  • itboffinitboffin Posts: 19,690
    dont want to come over all doom and gloom especially as i started this post in this section of the forum but to add to my point about speed and close passing, we seem as a nation to be incapable of following the basic rules of the road, take the ASL this is a total mystery to everyone police included.

    remove them, they dont work and just create tension or how about enforce them!
    Rule #5 // Harden The censored Up.
    Rule #9 // If you are out riding in bad weather, it means you are a badass. Period.
    Rule #12 // The correct number of bikes to own is n+1.
    Rule #42 // A bike race shall never be preceded with a swim and/or followed by a run.
  • I don't disagree that some rural drivers pick crazy times to overtake, it's scary being on the left side of that - if a car comes the other way their choice is a head-on smash or wipe me out!

    It'll never happen but the only solution is if both parties can walk a mile in the other man's shoes. The only reason I'm such an awesome driver and cyclist is that I regularly do both.

    It would definitely help if all the London clubs that ride in the Surrey Hills made their members drive around here for a few hours on a Sunday morning first. I'm sure their riding would improve dramatically if they could see life from a drivers point of view. Same for the reverse. If everyone who drives could see what it's like to ride on the pothole filled roads they would realise why we sometimes need to ride in the middle. And there really aren't that many places to pull in so sometimes we do hold them up, but it's not on purpose.
    But can't see it happening! Both sides will just continue to moan about each other saying the other needs to be regulated more!
  • The RookieThe Rookie Posts: 27,747
    964cup wrote:
    Highway code rule 163. Explain to me how that needs changing, rather than just enforcement?
    Education first, like all those motorists who cant cope with ASL's, many aren't aware there is any guidance and why on this matter in the HC.
  • tgotbtgotb Posts: 4,714
    The Rookie wrote:
    964cup wrote:
    Highway code rule 163. Explain to me how that needs changing, rather than just enforcement?
    Education first, like all those motorists who cant cope with ASL's, many aren't aware there is any guidance and why on this matter in the HC.
    I have to admit to having stopped my car in ASLs a couple of times. Nothing to do with education in my case; I'm so used to doing it on my bike, I didn't think until it was too late :oops:
    Pannier, 120rpm.
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