Wheel Upgrade advice?

tjw_78

I have a 2012 Giant Defy 2. 4 years on and I’ve done 2,800 miles on it, so turns out it wasn’t just a fad. This year I’m signed up to do RideLondon in July

I am hearing that upgrading the wheels is the biggest single improvement I can make to my bike and so am considering doing this, but it seems a rather confusing landscape

Does anyone have any advice? I reckon I could probably stretch to about £250

The Defy has the original Giant S-R2 wheels on it, with Gatorskin tyres.

Shimano Ultegra 6800 @ £249 have caught my eye…

The other consideration here is that I hit 40 in 2 years’ time, and have it in the back on my mind to treat myself to a better bike for my 40th. ‘Better bike’ of course is widely open to interpretation, and I’m yet to decide where I’m going with this idea… Carbon frame + disc brakes probably

Thanks for any ideas/suggestions/advice!

drlodge

With £250 budget, I don't think any new wheels will be much of an upgrade. I would try some decent tyres and lightweight inner tubes to start with. Are your rims tubeless ready?

apreading

Perceived wisdom is usually these: https://www.merlincycles.com/fulcrum-ra ... 74070.html The wider rim on the LG models gives the tyre a better shape and these are awesome wheels.

Or you might find Campag Zonda for your budget which are fantastic too but old style narrow rim.

these are great too: https://www.cycledivision.co.uk/cero-ar ... set-bundle

Or, if you really want to save money (and like white, gold or red): http://www.superstarcomponents.com/en/c ... s-2024.htm

dj58

Hunt Wheels do a 4 Season Dura shallow 23mm wide rim 24/28 spoke 8/9/10/11 speed tubeless compatible wheelset for £229.00. They won't be a vast improvement compared to your O.E. wheels, though will give you the wider rim benefits with 25/28c tyres and the option to try tubeless.

indyp

For around £250 then as above Campagnolo Zonda's are great wheels - they're good for all round use and to keep with upgrade.

imposter2.0

As drlodge says - save your money. Zondas are ok wheels, but will not be significantly better than the ones you already have. Spend some money of a nice set of quality tyres first...

markhewitt1978

The Ultegra are ok, but just ok. I would look at a set of Shimano RS81, which are more like £350, but if you're going to spend some money you might as well make it count.

A set of RS81's coupled with GP4000s tyres will be a massive improvement.

apreading

I would disagree with Imposter and Drlodge, and so would bikeradar: http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/category/ ... -12-45687/

A bike at that price normally has really heavy, basic wheels as the budget is spent elsewhere to keep the paper spec sheet looking as attractive as possible and focus on the frame.

You could shed a huge amount of weight (probably at least half a kilo) and get much nicer, wider wheels which will make a big improvement.

imposter2.0

apreading wrote:

I would disagree with Imposter and Drlodge, and so would bikeradar: http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/category/ ... -12-45687/

You're offering a Bikeradar review as supporting evidence?

apreading wrote:

A bike at that price normally has really heavy, basic wheels as the budget is spent elsewhere to keep the paper spec sheet looking as attractive as possible and focus on the frame.

You could shed a huge amount of weight (probably at least half a kilo) and get much nicer, wider wheels which will make a big improvement.

Ironically, the review you quote suggests that the wheels are sturdy, but does not specifically suggest changing them. In any case, as others have said, you are not going to find anything significantly better for £250.

drlodge

You might get a really nice pair of wheels from the likes of Harry Rowland for £250...just. Although £300 is nearer the mark. 105 hubs, Archetype rims and 28 3x sapim race spokes.

Or ask Malcolm at thecycleclinic...his Borg22s are £254!

apreading

Imposter wrote:

Ironically, the review you quote suggests that the wheels are sturdy, but does not specifically suggest changing them. In any case, as others have said, you are not going to find anything significantly better for £250.

eh:

"If you’ve got cash to splash later on though, there’s plenty of potential still to discover with lighter wheels and other upgrades."

"functional rather than fancy finishing kit and wheels"

"but then, the Defy frame is so good it’s worth whatever money you can throw at it in terms of lighter wheels and cockpit kit."

"The Giant wheels are relatively sturdy" [sturdy is a byword for 'heavy']

For £165, the Fulcrum Racing 5 LG wheels are 1645g as opposed to the ones that came with the bike at over 2kg. You could save another 50g with Zondas or 100g with the Cero or Superstar wheels and the Cero ones come with tyres too. The fulcrum wheels have a wider rim, so much nicer tyre shape and are raved about on this and other forums.

mrb123

http://thecycleclinic.co.uk/collections ... lset-black

or

http://thecycleclinic.co.uk/collections ... from-1425g

imposter2.0

apreading wrote:

Imposter wrote:

Ironically, the review you quote suggests that the wheels are sturdy, but does not specifically suggest changing them. In any case, as others have said, you are not going to find anything significantly better for £250.

eh:

"If you’ve got cash to splash later on though, there’s plenty of potential still to discover with lighter wheels and other upgrades."

"functional rather than fancy finishing kit and wheels"

"but then, the Defy frame is so good it’s worth whatever money you can throw at it in terms of lighter wheels and cockpit kit."

"The Giant wheels are relatively sturdy" [sturdy is a byword for 'heavy']

For £165, the Fulcrum Racing 5 LG wheels are 1645g as opposed to the ones that came with the bike at over 2kg. You could save another 50g with Zondas or 100g with the Cero or Superstar wheels and the Cero ones come with tyres too. The fulcrum wheels have a wider rim, so much nicer tyre shape and are raved about on this and other forums.

Like I said - the review does not specifically suggest changing them.

slowbike

I wonder when the last time drlodge or Imposter rode stock wheels?
I'll confess - I've never ridden Giant stock wheels - but I have ridden and still sometimes ride Specialized stock wheels - functional yes - but I do notice* when I get off them and onto even some FR7's ...

£250 - I'd be looking at Fulcrum Racing Quattro and some nice tyres.. but the FR5's are good too ...
Mind you - with the superstar link above - I'd seriously consider a pair of those - or two pairs!


* well - I think I notice - it could be that it's making no difference at all, except in my mind ... and its just my mind telling me that this climb is easier or that it's taking less effort to ride at cruising speed ...

apreading

Just checked - there is still an extra £20 off those Superstar wheels - so £79.99 for 1500g wheels, its the bargain of the year

[edit] code for discount is GETEXTRA20

imposter2.0

Slowbike wrote:

I wonder when the last time drlodge or Imposter rode stock wheels?

Not even sure why that matters, but I'm actually riding 'stock' wheels at the moment - so you can stop wondering now...

drlodge

I don't ride stock wheels, I'm above such things. They have to be hand made by an Italian living in the UK :-)

£250 budget its marginal whether the benefits would be seen. A £300 budget opens up a lot more options.

slowbike

Imposter wrote:

Slowbike wrote:

I wonder when the last time drlodge or Imposter rode stock wheels?

Not even sure why that matters, but I'm actually riding 'stock' wheels at the moment - so you can stop wondering now...

That's ok then - different experiences from the same sort of thing ... I was only wondering cos lots of ppl say "xyz is all you need, you'll not get any benefit from anything else" when all they ride is much more expensive kit ...

tjw_78

tjw_78 wrote:

I have a 2012 Giant Defy 2. 4 years on and I’ve done 2,800 miles on it, so turns out it wasn’t just a fad. This year I’m signed up to do RideLondon in July

I am hearing that upgrading the wheels is the biggest single improvement I can make to my bike and so am considering doing this, but it seems a rather confusing landscape

Does anyone have any advice? I reckon I could probably stretch to about £250

The Defy has the original Giant S-R2 wheels on it, with Gatorskin tyres.

Shimano Ultegra 6800 @ £249 have caught my eye…

The other consideration here is that I hit 40 in 2 years’ time, and have it in the back on my mind to treat myself to a better bike for my 40th. ‘Better bike’ of course is widely open to interpretation, and I’m yet to decide where I’m going with this idea… Carbon frame + disc brakes probably

Thanks for any ideas/suggestions/advice!

Thanks for all the suggestions! Clear as mud now!!!

My reading of all this is that there are gains to be made, but they are somewhere been subjective and marginal.

As such, perhaps my ignorance is bliss (the OE wheels work after all, I've no other experience to compare with. And I find I tend to go past people when the road heads uphill, but that's mainly down to me being skinny I think). So perhaps, I'll use that £250 as seed money for the 2018 new bike fund. And that's a whole new thread!

slowbike

drlodge wrote:

I don't ride stock wheels, I'm above such things. They have to be hand made by an Italian living in the UK :-)

and my best wheels have to have spokes hand turned by albino monks living in total isolation ....

drlodge wrote:

£250 budget its marginal whether the benefits would be seen. A £300 budget opens up a lot more options.

£300 does open up more options - don't disagree - I'd love to have £300 to spend on wheels, but I think I better not for now ... but having read other threads there are those with the opinion that a £300 wheelset isn't much improvement over a £250 wheelset - and if that's no different to a stock wheel - why aren't we all on entry level bikes with stock wheels?? Come to that - why do we bother with buying new bikes at all - just get one that's being skipped, clean them up, true them and off you go ...

benjai

I have a Giant TCR Composite 2 from a few years bike, so I guess the stock wheels were probably same as OPs, maybe slightly better. After over a year I switched to Zondas and the difference was night and day. It just felt so much sharper and nimble. Also shaved at least 2-3 minutes a lap of Richmond Park without using much effort. I think they're definitely worth the small price to upgrade.

tjw_78

benjai wrote:

I have a Giant TCR Composite 2 from a few years bike, so I guess the stock wheels were probably same as OPs, maybe slightly better. After over a year I switched to Zondas and the difference was night and day. It just felt so much sharper and nimble. Also shaved at least 2-3 minutes a lap of Richmond Park without using much effort. I think they're definitely worth the small price to upgrade.

That's more than a modest gain

joe2008

Keep your eyes on ebay, I got an amazing deal: barely used, hand built wheels worth over £500 for £173.89

'Hand built wheelset Dt Swiss 240 hubs on Ambrosio Excellight rims with sapim cx ray spokes.

Wheels have only done about 250 miles and as such bearings are like new and spin effortlessly both wheels are perfectly true. Freehub is campagnolo and will take 9 10 or 11 speed cassette. Condition is as near new as you will get from a used set of wheels.'

I wouldn't have known they'd done the 250 miles quoted, must have been flat miles, they looked brand new.

http://ebay.eu/1rdaQEU

Came with two almost new Continental tyres, which I sold for £40, and two tubes, one latex.

tjw_78

joe2008 wrote:

Keep your eyes on ebay, I got an amazing deal: barely used, hand built wheels worth over £500 for £173.89

'Hand built wheelset Dt Swiss 240 hubs on Ambrosio Excellight rims with sapim cx ray spokes.

Wheels have only done about 250 miles and as such bearings are like new and spin effortlessly both wheels are perfectly true. Freehub is campagnolo and will take 9 10 or 11 speed cassette. Condition is as near new as you will get from a used set of wheels.'

I wouldn't have known they'd done the 250 miles quoted, must have been flat miles, they looked brand new.

http://ebay.eu/1rdaQEU

Came with two almost new Continental tyres, which I sold for £40, and two tubes, one latex.

Trouble with that is that I don't really know what I'm looking at. I doubt I could tell the difference between a set worth £50 and £1000 until I was riding on them. And even then I am only assuming I would notice.

I could easily get it wrong (and with two small kids I rarely have time to trawl eBay)

bompington

apreading wrote:

Just checked - there is still an extra £20 off those Superstar wheels - so £79.99 for 1500g wheels, its the bargain of the year

[edit] code for discount is GETEXTRA20

I "needed" new wheels for the PX (they're a bit tired) and have just bought these - they seem like an incredible bargain, let's hope so! Got to love the bling look...

bompington

... just occurred to me to ask: do they come with rim tape? If not, what would people who know more than me (i.e. nearly everyone) recommend?

photonic69

bompington wrote:

... just occurred to me to ask: do they come with rim tape? If not, what would people who know more than me (i.e. nearly everyone) recommend?

Velox adhesive fabric rim tape. Comes in a roll. Enough for one wheel per roll and has hole punched out for valve. Simple. Easy. Do it. 16mm is what you want.

Vslowpace

tjw_78 wrote:

benjai wrote:

I have a Giant TCR Composite 2 from a few years bike, so I guess the stock wheels were probably same as OPs, maybe slightly better. After over a year I switched to Zondas and the difference was night and day. It just felt so much sharper and nimble. Also shaved at least 2-3 minutes a lap of Richmond Park without using much effort. I think they're definitely worth the small price to upgrade.

That's more than a modest gain

and almost none of it will be due to the upgrading of the wheels.

bompington

bompington wrote:

apreading wrote:

Just checked - there is still an extra £20 off those Superstar wheels - so £79.99 for 1500g wheels, its the bargain of the year

[edit] code for discount is GETEXTRA20

I "needed" new wheels for the PX (they're a bit tired) and have just bought these - they seem like an incredible bargain, let's hope so! Got to love the bling look...

Suppose I should report back:
- have done around 250km over 5 consecutive days - that's a lot for me - and the wheels feel great: they are palpably lighter to pick up than the PX's stock ones, feel very smooth and true on the road, and I have been noticeably faster: I seem to be able to hold my speed better whenever the road goes uphill, for a start. As ever, hardly scientific data - for example I had a few days off last week, so better rested than usual. What's more, it's the red rims I've got, so they're bound to be faster.
Overall: if they don't fall apart very quickly they have to be good value.

dyrlac

Was looking for one of the many wheel threads to report on my new Zondas, which replaced the stock Mavic Aksiums (2014) on my Dolan. I've put 131 km into them since I fit them on Monday, still early doors, but initial impressions are favourable. As a proxy for a careful scrutiny of underlying data: Strava recorded 41 personal records in May to date (so over the last 3 days) over my usual commuting haunts. In the entire month of April, I got 90. This is a mere correlation, as there were some likely contributing factors as (a) I changed the cassette and chain at the same time the Zondas went on; (b) was pretty well rested having taken 48 hours off the bike after 28 consecutive days with at least some cycling; (c) I benefitted from favourable wind patterns at times; (d) while I was at it, I also changed my tyres to GP 4000s IIs (from ordinary, if fashionably yellow-striped, Schwalbe Duranos); and (e) I *knew* I had flash new wheels, so I probably pedalled harder.

Anyway, they seem to be round and roll acceptably, which is as far as I'll go for now (go on Campy, put that in your advertising copy). The freewheeling click is a bit stealth for my taste (a louder click reminds me to pedal). More subjectively, while 2-3 minutes off a Richmond Park lap is ludicrous, I'd say 2-5% quicker going round in perfect conditions *feels* achievable.

tjw_78

A year on, and I'm still wondering about whether to upgrade my wheels. My budget is possibly a little more now, and so erring towards Fulcrum Racing 3s. On the other hand, I'm not not sure I can be faffed with sorting it all out. Changing them might be easy enough, but I don't know how to (switch the cassette over), and I don't own a chain whip. So I'd probably have to pay someone to switch things over, and make sure the gears are adjusted etc (which I also don't know how to do). In another life I'd learn how to do all this, but I've got 3 children under 6 and time is at at a premium. If I've got spare time I want to ride my bike, not faff around with it.
That all being said, part of me wonders whether I might just enjoy being a little quicker, especially on the hills, and especially especially on club runs (not that I'm competitive or anything, honest)