Copter tape and CF frames

wishitwasallflat

Just got my first ever CF frame and loving it! Always used copter tape on my Al frames at cable rub areas and DS chainstay so I've fitted it there on the new frame. Wondering what you think about covering the down tube, along its length, where rubbish spun up off the front wheel might impact? I would do it if it offers any real protection from potential structural damage and wondered if anyone knows if it does. I'm not overly bothered about protecting it from cosmetic damage (as I wouldn't contemplate covering the entire frame) but does copter tape make any contribution to structural protection?


PS Yes I am super nervous and suffering CF phobia but I do know it won't dissolve and is strong stuff

imposter2.0

In case this is a serious question - no, helicopter tape is just sticky vinyl or polyurethane and will offer absolutely zero structural protection.

svetty

wishitwasallflat wrote:

I'm not overly bothered about protecting it from cosmetic damage (as I wouldn't contemplate covering the entire frame) but does copter tape make any contribution to structural protection?


PS Yes I am super nervous and suffering CF phobia but I do know it won't dissolve and is strong stuff

The tape would give protection for minor cosmetic damage but that is all. The risk of major accident due to other factors - eg a dog running out into your front wheel - far outweighs the tiny risk of structural failure......

ugo.santalucia

As stated above, tape is unlikely to give you any structural protection. My feeling about bicycles in general is that if you are worrying about riding them, in case they get damaged, then you should either give up on expensive ones and just buy second hand ones that have seen better days, or you should train yourself to think that:

a) It's just a bike, not a girlfriend, a baby, not even a puppy

b) shit happens, no matter how hard you try to avoid it... shit will find a way to get to you

fenix

CF is a lot tougher than you're giving it credit for.

Copter tape will keep your paint from rubbing off - but that's about it.

darkhairedlord

Put some of thicker stuff on the chainstay to protect from chain-slap, but thats it really.
Alternatively, hard men can just stay on the big ring and you won't get chain-slap!

wishitwasallflat

ugo.santalucia wrote:

As stated above, tape is unlikely to give you any structural protection. My feeling about bicycles in general is that if you are worrying about riding them, in case they get damaged, then you should either give up on expensive ones and just buy second hand ones that have seen better days, or you should train yourself to think that:

a) It's just a bike, not a girlfriend, a baby, not even a puppy

b) shoot happens, no matter how hard you try to avoid it... shoot will find a way to get to you

Yes it is was a serious question (sorry I am neurotic).
Thanks to all for helpful answers.

You have diagnosed the issue 100% correctly ugo. Due to a sequence of complicated events (starting with my old bike being written off in an accident), unexpectedly, I find myself the owner of a ridiculously expensive CF frame having gone from a pretty cheap Al one. I am absolutely loving riding it but am working hard on making the adjustment you correctly identify is needed. Once I recover from my injuries and get some serious time in Im hoping the transition will occur naturally. At the moment it's feeling more like I bought an expensive ornament than a functional machine and this must change.

PS Not saying I'm harder than a certain Afrikan boy but I reckon I've done more miles so far on my fractured wrist than he did in TDF

PPS Not on cobbles though and not as fast :oops:

pinno

Ride it. Use it. Abuse it. That's what it is for. It's not the only CF frame on the planet.

wishitwasallflat

Pinno wrote:

Ride it. Use it. Abuse it. That's what it is for. It's not the only CF frame on the planet.

Yes but aren't most of those frames owned by rich thin cyclists who ride them super fast, own several of them and buy new ones as if there is no tommorow.

Yours old, fat, neurotic and really quite sad!

PS I do love it really it's smoother than a smooth thing rubbed down and dipped in smooth juice and it's fast.

pinno

wishitwasallflat wrote:

Pinno wrote:

Ride it. Use it. Abuse it. That's what it is for. It's not the only CF frame on the planet.

Yes....

PS I do love it really it's smoother than a smooth thing rubbed down and dipped in smooth juice and it's fast.

I have 2 and they are. Both were second hand and didn't really cost a lot. At my old bike club, they always said to someone who turned up with a new bike "You'll never ride it properly until you crash it".

StillGoing

wishitwasallflat wrote:

Pinno wrote:

Ride it. Use it. Abuse it. That's what it is for. It's not the only CF frame on the planet.

Yes but aren't most of those frames owned by rich thin cyclists who ride them super fast, own several of them and buy new ones as if there is no tommorow.

Yours old, fat, neurotic and really quite sad!

PS I do love it really it's smoother than a smooth thing rubbed down and dipped in smooth juice and it's fast.

You're being too protective of it. It will withstand a hell of a lot more abuse than you think. Face facts; you're going to get stone chips in any paint or lacquer. But, it'll take you bunny hopping over unexpected potholes etc so ride it and enjoy it. Carbon frames are nowhere near rare on the roads these days.

ugo.santalucia

wishitwasallflat wrote:

You have diagnosed the issue 100% correctly ugo. Due to a sequence of complicated events (starting with my old bike being written off in an accident), unexpectedly, I find myself the owner of a ridiculously expensive CF frame having gone from a pretty cheap Al one. I am absolutely loving riding it but am working hard on making the adjustment you correctly identify is needed. Once I recover from my injuries and get some serious time in Im hoping the transition will occur naturally.

It never happened for me. I never got round riding tubulars with confidence. Despite being able to fit them, I never quite felt confident about heading for a long ride with just one spare tyre and a can of liquid... it's irrational, I would have needed a lorry full of them to feel secure.
Eventually I got rid of them.
You have to overcome it or get rid of it, otherwise it will affect your enjoyment

pinno

ugo.santalucia wrote:

wishitwasallflat wrote:

You...naturally.

It never happened for me. I never got round riding tubulars with confidence. Despite being able to fit them, I never quite felt confident about heading for a long ride with just one spare tyre and a can of liquid... it's irrational, I would have needed a lorry full of them to feel secure.
Eventually I got rid of them.
You have to overcome it or get rid of it, otherwise it will affect your enjoyment

How many times did you actually puncture and how many times did you end up stranded and making 'that call' ? I thought the new generation of tubulars were good.

drlodge

Pinno wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

wishitwasallflat wrote:

You...naturally.

It never happened for me. I never got round riding tubulars with confidence. Despite being able to fit them, I never quite felt confident about heading for a long ride with just one spare tyre and a can of liquid... it's irrational, I would have needed a lorry full of them to feel secure.
Eventually I got rid of them.
You have to overcome it or get rid of it, otherwise it will affect your enjoyment

How many times did you actually puncture and how many times did you end up stranded and making 'that call' ? I thought the new generation of tubulars were good.

I'm the same with tubulars as Ugo, have ridden my deep carbon tubular wheels a bit in dry weather with a spare and squirt just in case. I've never punctured but I just hate the idea of being stranded. May be it would do me good to puncture then I *know* if the thing will seal, or I can replace a tub, or I have to call for help. Its just a fear thing.

Now that I've swapped wheels around the carbon tubs are not in use. I wonder if I'll ever put them back on.

ugo.santalucia

Pinno wrote:

How many times did you actually puncture and how many times did you end up stranded and making 'that call' ? I thought the new generation of tubulars were good.

Punctured three times, never got stranded. It's not a rational decision, as I said... I just was not comfortable going for long rides. Richmond to Box Hill was the furthest I was daring to go, that became laps in Richmond Park. That combined with the lack of choice in the price range I can afford made it not worth it.
I used to build wheels, so swapping the rims and flogging them half price to someone who made better use of them was straightforward

drlodge

The advantage to tubulars was ride comfort & speed, but the new range of tubeless tyres like the IRC roadlites make tubulars redundant IMO. Now all I need is a nice (and not too expensive) set of carbon clincher tubeless wheels

ugo.santalucia

drlodge wrote:

Now all I need is a nice (and not too expensive) set of carbon clincher tubeless wheels

Don't look at me...

Although getting rid of a few of those wheel and frame boxes littering my garage would be tempting...

Reynolds?

drlodge

I've looked at Reynolds but (a) they're expensive and (b) the Aeros are not tubeless ready yet.

I would dearly love a pair of carbon tubeless clinchers, but also aware they're not the best wheels for moist days. Your RR440/Mono RS wheels on the Massive Attack with IRC roadlites are just great for all round use. And if I want to play deep section, I do have the tubs.

Giraffoto

drlodge wrote:

Now all I need is a nice (and not too expensive) set of carbon clincher tubeless wheels

Carbon wheels are where I draw the "too nice for me" line, although it's more about rim brakes in wet weather . . .

drlodge

Giraffoto wrote:

drlodge wrote:

Now all I need is a nice (and not too expensive) set of carbon clincher tubeless wheels

Carbon wheels are where I draw the "too nice for me" line, although it's more about rim brakes in wet weather . . .

My carbon wheels cost £350 (hubs, spokes, rims, build) so essentially "throw away" if they get damaged. Just the job for getting a feel for these things and increased enjoyment without having to sell a kidney.

pinno

Giraffoto wrote:

drlodge wrote:

Now all I need is a nice (and not too expensive) set of carbon clincher tubeless wheels

Carbon wheels are where I draw the "too nice for me" line, although it's more about rim brakes in wet weather . . .

I'm not a Shimano man but I did buy a pair of second hand DA Carbon 1380's because they were going cheap (£250). Aluminium brake surface were a bonus, so no need for fancy brake pads. They are simply a great pair of wheels. I had to put a Shimano spline, Campag spacing Ambrosio cassette on it to make it compatible with the Campag 10 speed set up but it's not the smoothest.
Climbing wheels principally. - cba riding on flatland. I can compare them to the more all round Eurus's which are solid but i've had to replace bearings, races and the pawl spring on them (similar age, similar mileage). Whereas the DA hubs are flawless. A bit fancy for a winter bike but the 'stock' Fulcrum 7's were rock solid though as harsh as dustbin lids.
Not sure why wheel manufacturers have gone so small with bearing sizes.
When I have reached the limit with repairing the Eurus wheels (summer bike), i'll splash out on an 11 speed pair of CL 24's (the successor). I do believe that the Shimano and Campag 11 cassettes have almost identical spacing.

Both can be tubeless - I just haven't bitten the bullet and tried it. Do I?