Do Turbo's put added Stress onto the Frame?

deejaysee

The reason i say this is because i've been using my Vortex a lot over this winter and in the past few days i've been getting this loud clicking noise coming from my bike.
At first i thought it was coming from the cranks but last night i was able to make the click noise without peddling but just flexing the bike ever so slightly side to side when mounted on the vortex.....so it must be the frame itself making the noise as i'm not moving any parts.

This got me thinking - bikes really aren't designed to have the back wheel in a clamped position. When you think how much the bikes moves under you when riding outside.
Having it fixed under the same pressures as you would do riding normally surely cant do it any favors.

thegreatdivide

Mount the bike and spray GT85 into the skewer clamp. It generally gets rid of any noise. Alternativley put grease on the end of the skewers.

Although some manufacturers say your warranty is void if you use your bike on a turbo and people on forums claim to know someone who knew someone who broke their frame on a turbo there is no solid evidence that it'll break a frame, just internet forum hearsay.

Bobbinogs

This usually comes up at the start of winter with particular concern coming from posters with carbon frames. In general, there is some confusion because, whilst there are thousands and thousands of riders out there who regularly use a turbo without any issues whatsoever, there are still some manufacturers who specifically exclude turbo use in terms of warranty cover, e.g., from Specialized:

High performance carbon road bikes are a really bad idea on indoor trainers. The fixing of the rear chainstays in one place and the biting of the clamp creates all kinds of twisting forces from odd angles, that can, over time, be really bad for a lightweight frame.

Personally, I have never had a problem but then my turbo bike (which happens to be a Specialized) is alu.

EDIT: Good idea above about greasing/lubing the clamp points which are the probable source of squeaking

deejaysee

Nice one
Will grease the scewer as haven't done that yet.
Hopefully it will sort the clicking noise as its a bit worrying

keef66

Just to put the opposing view, I've seen a couple of posts recently from people with cracked frames, possibly as a result of use in a turbo...

Don't think I'd ever risk it with an expensive frame, especially if I was giving it the beans and doing high intensity intervals. If ever I lose my winter road riding mojo and succumb to the temptation to buy a turbo, I think I'll be looking for a cheap S/H bike to stick on it.

deejaysee

Hmmm until yesterday i never gave it a second thought.
I need to try and read up what Giant have to say as my carbon frame is the same one as all their high end Defy bikes

thegreatdivide

keef66 wrote:

Just to put the opposing view, I've seen a couple of posts recently from people with cracked frames, possibly as a result of use in a turbo

Got a link?

Anonymous

Bobbinogs wrote:

This usually comes up at the start of winter with particular concern coming from posters with carbon frames. In general, there is some confusion because, whilst there are thousands and thousands of riders out there who regularly use a turbo without any issues whatsoever, there are still some manufacturers who specifically exclude turbo use in terms of warranty cover, e.g., from Specialized:

High performance carbon road bikes are a really bad idea on indoor trainers. The fixing of the rear chainstays in one place and the biting of the clamp creates all kinds of twisting forces from odd angles, that can, over time, be really bad for a lightweight frame.

Personally, I have never had a problem but then my turbo bike (which happens to be a Specialized) is alu.

EDIT: Good idea above about greasing/lubing the clamp points which are the probable source of squeaking

If you ever watch any pro cycling events you will, from time to time, see the riders sat on turbos warming up before the race. They probably can spin at a speed that us mere mortals can only dream of. I have been at events where they sit there spinning at some ludicrously high resistance then jump off, change the QR on the rear wheel and ride the same bike off to the start line so its obviously not likely to have done any damage to the frame if they are about to compete on it.

Personally I have ridden all my carbon and alu bikes on my turbo (TACX Sartori) with no issues at all.

thegreatdivide

^ What he said.

herzog

Ridden carbon frames on turbos for around 8 years now - never had any issues.

Providing you're not sprinting full bore, it'll be fine.

pblakeney

No proof one way or the other but the logic took me to buy a Rock n' Roller which has a flexible mount.
The converse arguement would that training to keep your body and frame stationary (which it should be in theory) is a good thing.

Bobbinogs

I wonder if the proliferation of technology led turbo training (Zwift, trainerroad, etc.) will force manufacturers to start thinking about the warranty exclusions they have? I am firmly in the "The risks of frame damage through turbo use are minimal" camp, but if I was about to drop £5k on a bike with the warranty cover then excluded I might cross off certain makes to avoid any possible claim issues.

Then again, I haven't got £5k so that's that sorted :-)

fenix

I cant see any issues with it. We've all seen bikes with cracks from just road use - so no reason to think a turbo is worse.

My bikes have survived my awesome wattage. Including full out bursts.

keef66

thegreatdivide wrote:

keef66 wrote:

Just to put the opposing view, I've seen a couple of posts recently from people with cracked frames, possibly as a result of use in a turbo

Got a link?

Think this was the most recent example. The owner was thinking the turbo was to blame, but who knows...

viewtopic.php?f=40004&t=13041234&hilit=crack

I was impressed by the appearance of the finished CF repair

Bobbinogs

mmm, that repair finish looks very good indeed.

bianchimoon

keef66 wrote:

Just to put the opposing view, I've seen a couple of posts recently from people with cracked frames, possibly as a result of use in a turbo...

Don't think I'd ever risk it with an expensive frame, especially if I was giving it the beans and doing high intensity intervals. If ever I lose my winter road riding mojo and succumb to the temptation to buy a turbo, I think I'll be looking for a cheap S/H bike to stick on it.

I had a bianchi 928 get a hairline crack around the BB, my suspicions are it was caused after a heavy winters use on turbo and some 'standing up' riding which would put more stress on the frame, I wouldn't put my newest bike on a turbo and desist from anything but sitting spinning on my other bike

slowbike

Well - there's no doubt that a bike being held in a turbo is being stressed differently to one on the road.

How come the Pro's get away with it? Frequent bike changes and a much smoother riding style is my guess.

Would I put my carbon bike on the turbo? Well I am, but it's not an expensive frame and I'm trying to do smooth efforts on it rather than mashing the pedals ... but you only have to look at how the bike moves on the turbo to see that it is stressing the frame.

AK_jnr

I wouldnt exactly feel comfortable doing all out standing sprints but I cant on mine anyway as the rear wheel would slip. The limit is about 900 watts seated. I only tend to do longer intervals inside so I am fine with using my best bike.

chris_bass

Herzog wrote:

Ridden carbon frames on turbos for around 8 years now

Wow! that is quite a training session!

fenix

keef66 wrote:

thegreatdivide wrote:

keef66 wrote:

Just to put the opposing view, I've seen a couple of posts recently from people with cracked frames, possibly as a result of use in a turbo

Got a link?

Think this was the most recent example. The owner was thinking the turbo was to blame, but who knows...

viewtopic.php?f=40004&t=13041234&hilit=crack

I was impressed by the appearance of the finished CF repair

That's nothing to do with a turbo - that's had some impact.

webboo

bianchimoon wrote:

keef66 wrote:

Just to put the opposing view, I've seen a couple of posts recently from people with cracked frames, possibly as a result of use in a turbo...

Don't think I'd ever risk it with an expensive frame, especially if I was giving it the beans and doing high intensity intervals. If ever I lose my winter road riding mojo and succumb to the temptation to buy a turbo, I think I'll be looking for a cheap S/H bike to stick on it.

I had a bianchi 928 get a hairline crack around the BB, my suspicions are it was caused after a heavy winters use on turbo and some 'standing up' riding which would put more stress on the frame, I wouldn't put my newest bike on a turbo and desist from anything but sitting spinning on my other bike

My 928 bottom bracket shell came loose after a crash. It's been sat on my turbo for the last 3 years with out getting any worse
I think 928s were prone to b/b problems.

fossyant

There is far more stress going through a frame on the road, than in a turbo.

bianchimoon

fossyant wrote:

There is far more stress going through a frame on the road, than in a turbo.

Not the twisting stresses you get from it being 'locked' into place at one point of the frame. Seated, smooth spinning shouldn't cause a problem, but standing spinning and rocking might possibly

markhewitt1978

As ever with cycling taking what the pros do as a guide can often lead you down the wrong path. If a pro ends up with a crack in their frame they put it in the bin and get a new one.

I rode my carbon frame on the turbo for a few months, no issues. I've swapped it for a dedicated alu frame now, but mostly out of convenience.

milemuncher1

Cheap type turbos that bind via the Skewers do. Better cassette integrated ones, and the flashy articulated ones, not so much.

thegreatdivide

Milemuncher1 wrote:

Cheap type turbos that bind via the Skewers do. Better cassette integrated ones, and the flashy articulated ones, not so much.

Nonsense. I'd hardly call a £1k CycleOps Powerbeam Pro a cheap skewer turbo and there's no difference between the way it skewer clamps to a sub £100 Taxc.

It's a unproven urban myth that's grown arms and legs over the years.

bianchimoon

From the Felt cycle FAQ's
I have heard that you should not put a carbon stay bike on a trainer - is this true?
The loads a trainer puts on a bike are quite different from those which the bike is designed to withstand on the road, particularly when it comes to tensile forces in the seat stay—which try to pull the dropout out of the seatstay. However, Felt has been selling bikes with alloy dropouts bonded into carbon seat stays for four years now. Some of these bikes have been used in trainers, and we have not encountered this problem. Even so, we recommend limiting riding on trainers to in-the-saddle pedaling. Riding on rollers loads the frame in a similar way to riding the road; for that reason we believe it.

bianchimoon

Having said that, it seems most if not all manufacturers do NOT void warranty if used on a trainer

shipley

That repair looks great - they are local to me so I've bookmarked it !

I worried about putting expensive bikes on an inflexible turbo which I use 3 times a week so bought a cheap crappy old alloy frame and a bag of bits from eBay. It was cheap as chips and is worry free and I couldn't care less about noises, squeaks or sweat dripping on it.

It's the the perfect solution for me.

bobmcstuff

Bobbinogs wrote:

I wonder if the proliferation of technology led turbo training (Zwift, trainerroad, etc.) will force manufacturers to start thinking about the warranty exclusions they have? I am firmly in the "The risks of frame damage through turbo use are minimal" camp, but if I was about to drop £5k on a bike with the warranty cover then excluded I might cross off certain makes to avoid any possible claim issues.

Then again, I haven't got £5k so that's that sorted :-)

If I had 5k for a bike I would also have a turbo bike...

colinsmith123

Maglia Rosa wrote:

Bobbinogs wrote:

This usually comes up at the start of winter with particular concern coming from posters with carbon frames. In general, there is some confusion because, whilst there are thousands and thousands of riders out there who regularly use a turbo without any issues whatsoever, there are still some manufacturers who specifically exclude turbo use in terms of warranty cover, e.g., from Specialized:

High performance carbon road bikes are a really bad idea on indoor trainers. The fixing of the rear chainstays in one place and the biting of the clamp creates all kinds of twisting forces from odd angles, that can, over time, be really bad for a lightweight frame.

Personally, I have never had a problem but then my turbo bike (which happens to be a Specialized) is alu.

EDIT: Good idea above about greasing/lubing the clamp points which are the probable source of squeaking

If you ever watch any pro cycling events you will, from time to time, see the riders sat on turbos warming up before the race. They probably can spin at a speed that us mere mortals can only dream of. I have been at events where they sit there spinning at some ludicrously high resistance then jump off, change the QR on the rear wheel and ride the same bike off to the start line so its obviously not likely to have done any damage to the frame if they are about to compete on it.

Personally I have ridden all my carbon and alu bikes on my turbo (TACX Sartori) with no issues at all.

My Spesh Roubaix cracked around the Zertz inserts. I sent it back via LBS. Spesh UK response, it has either been crashed or used on a turbo for which we do not cover under warranty. As it had not been crashed, but had been used on a turbo, I used the Etixx Quickstep team on turbos argument, as I have a similar turbo. Guess what? The frame sits in the shed, awaiting 1. the skip or 2. the carbon frame repairer.