Helmet cams and lights unsafe?

supaquikrik

Hi all, first post on here so be gentle.
As an mtb rider and motorcycle rider of many years I have always understood that a helmet should be of a smooth rounded design with nothing to catch and twist the helmet so that it wil skid or slide in the event of an impact. It concerns me that so many riders now are fixing GoPro cams and lights to their helmets. I have had brambles strong enough to catch and pull my bars out of my hands, imagine if they caught a fixture on a helmet. I personally will never attach anything that sticks out to my lid, the helmet is smooth and round for a reason!!!

rockmonkeysc

Those mounts snap off very easily in an accident. Some helmets are starting to come out with integral mounts as well now.

Clockworkmark31

If brambles pull you to one side, I would say you are going too slow and off line.

However I understand what you are saying about motorcycles.

The fixture on the helmet is the weakest link and should break off easily enough not to cause too much distraction.

Struggling to see your point here, as the speed you are traveling at plus your mass will always be greater than something attached to your helmet. Even if you did have some horrific incident the attachment to your helmet will break off first before causing you injury.

Jonesinamilion

I'm a H&S person with a limited knowledge on biking; this is what my logic tells me for what it's worth.

Any impact that contacts the fixed object WILL increase the localised pressure in that area that could cause the helmet to fail in the event of the impact.

Any PPE should not be modified but a biggy that ppl ignore is making sure that it's fully secured, a helmet that comes off is no good whatsoever. Also crucial to dispose of any helmet that has been involved in a impact or sustained damage.

petriodet

Don't be stupid the are safe all a gopro held by is a little sticky pad it'll come off way before it damages you, as for light they are on the top of your helmet so it would have to a freak accident. Of course this is irrelevant to me as I don't crash.

/ Jk, crash at least 3 times this year.

Jonesinamilion

petriodet wrote:

Don't be stupid the are safe all a gopro held by is a little sticky pad it'll come off way before it damages you, as for light they are on the top of your helmet so it would have to a freak accident. Of course this is irrelevant to me as I don't crash.

/ Jk, crash at least 3 times this year.

Agreed on that front but there are plenty of ppl making their own mods involving tie wraps & ally torches etc... That will "test" a helmet to its limits.

Clockworkmark31

Without stepping on anyone's toes.

But you chose a helmet and adjust it to fit you. All of the attachments that you place on the helmet will break off easily enough. Even if you cable tie an attachment to your head. The weakest link will break first and that will not be your neck or the helmet.

Jonesinamilion

I think this sums up all points made...

http://velonews.competitor.com/2014/02/bikes-and-tech/technical-faq/technical-faq-are-helmet-cams-saf_318000

cooldad

Ask Michael Schumacher.

Clockworkmark31

Jonesinamilion wrote:

Any impact that contacts the fixed object WILL increase the localised pressure in that area that could cause the helmet to fail in the event of the impact.

Correct and the object will fail first as it is the weakest point.

Clockworkmark31

cooldad wrote:

Ask Michael Schumacher.

That would say to me that the point where the camera was attached didn't come in to sufficient force with the ground to break it off. If it did it would have fallen off.

Jonesinamilion

Clockworkmark31 wrote:

Jonesinamilion wrote:

Any impact that contacts the fixed object WILL increase the localised pressure in that area that could cause the helmet to fail in the event of the impact.

Correct and the object will fail first as it is the weakest point.

If I wanted to break my plastic / polystyrene helmet by hitting it with my aluminium torch, I could do it.

If I wanted to break my aluminium torch by hitting it with my plastic / polystyrene helmet, I could not do it.

Clockworkmark31

You could break either one, either way.

Jonesinamilion

Clockworkmark31 wrote:

You could break either one, either way.

I beg to differ... But that's what forums are all about

rockmonkeysc

I've never heard a reasonable argument from a health and safety person. They all like to vastly exaggerate risks. I occasionally ride with a h&s manager who complains very strongly everytime we get to a fun trail.

Clockworkmark31

Jonesinamilion wrote:

Clockworkmark31 wrote:

You could break either one, either way.

I beg to differ... But that's what forums are all about

Have a deeper and darker look in to Science.

Jonesinamilion

RockmonkeySC wrote:

I've never heard a reasonable argument from a health and safety person. They all like to vastly exaggerate risks. I occasionally ride with a h&s manager who complains very strongly everytime we get to a fun trail.

H&S gets a bad press, it should be a good dose of knowledge with a generous helping of common sense... Proportionate is one of my favorite words!

Uncontrolled risk is bad, controlled risk is good.

Clockworkmark31

Where do you draw the line of proportionate?

In a sense everything is uncontrolled, and H&S go too far without listening to common sense.

Sorry just my experiences.

veronese68

Jonesinamilion wrote:

RockmonkeySC wrote:

I've never heard a reasonable argument from a health and safety person. They all like to vastly exaggerate risks. I occasionally ride with a h&s manager who complains very strongly everytime we get to a fun trail.

H&S gets a bad press, it should be a good dose of knowledge with a generous helping of common sense... Proportionate is one of my favorite words!

Uncontrolled risk is bad, controlled risk is good.

There's the rub. It's often implemented by morons that are lacking in common sense so doesn't do what it should.

Clockworkmark31

Don't get me wrong,

I do agree with H&S in certain areas where previous managers are too incompetent to understand the risk.

But as far as I am concerned in this case the attachment to a helmet would break off before causing damage to someone.

If you disagree with me, then prove me wrong

Jonesinamilion

Good H&S saves lives and prevents much suffering whether that's in leasure, at home, public sector, construction, retail...

Bad H&S can be obstructive, costly and therefore often ignored.

In short, WHEN I chose to wear a helmet, I would definitely consider wearing a cam / light in line with a reputable manufactures instructions if it could easily break away to leave almost no protruding object that could compromise the external strength. I most certainly would not modify a helmet, use any mods that wrapped inside it, drill it, tie wrap or fix any solid object that would not easily detach in the event of even a modest impact.

Long live health and safety

Clockworkmark31

cyd190468 wrote:

Jonesinamilion wrote:

Clockworkmark31 wrote:

Jonesinamilion wrote:

Any impact that contacts the fixed object WILL increase the localised pressure in that area that could cause the helmet to fail in the event of the impact.

Correct and the object will fail first as it is the weakest point.

If I wanted to break my plastic / polystyrene helmet by hitting it with my aluminium torch, I could do it.

If I wanted to break my aluminium torch by hitting it with my plastic / polystyrene helmet, I could not do it.

Not sure how this is relevant. The combined object (helmet and light/camera) will fail at the weakest point. Most manufacturers make the mounts as light weight as possible and many of them use rubber o-rings to secure torches into the mount. So unless you have created your own very over-engineered mounting system it would seem highly unlikely for the light/camera to remain attached to the helmet in a crash. The Schumacher one is different as he was in snow so the force applied may have been lessened by the snow but prolonged because of the mount not failing. Without seeing his helmet it's hard to tell.

Thankyou for expressing my point. The object will fail in it's weakest location.

cooldad

Replace snow with mud and ask Schumacher.

But as I understand it, the camera punched a hole through the helmet. Probably followed by his head.

rockmonkeysc

Mountain bike helmets are designed to take point loads, unlike most other helmets.

cooldad

Except for the holey bits? Pointy things would fit right in.

FishFish

The helmet issue that bothers me is the cooling vents because last year I got a wasp stuck in one and it stung me so badly that I jumped in front of a train and died.

cooldad

We should be so lucky.

JBA

1. What an odd and somewhat pointless first post from the OP.

2. Attach whatever you want to your helmet. It's your choice.

3. If you have a crash, get injured and the injury can definitely be attributed to whatever was attached to your helmet then remember it was your choice.

rockmonkeysc

On the subject of stuff getting through vents I have seen a stick go through a vent and under someone's scalp. He did squeal a bit, we left his helmet on for the medics to deal with.
I have also crashed with a mate following, he also came off and landed with my brake lever jammed inside his helmet!

poah

my camera broke off in my crash in april. no damage to the area where the camera was. would the camera cause damage if you hit the ground at a particular point it's likely to.

Clockworkmark31

cooldad wrote:

Replace snow with mud and ask Schumacher.

But as I understand it, the camera punched a hole through the helmet. Probably followed by his head.

Not heard that one before, too much of a media blackout on the whole thing.