Demise of I.S. / Post mount brakes on 'road' bikes?
sb88
Posts: 37
Demise of I.S. / Post mount brakes on 'road' bikes?
Wondering what people's thoughts are on the implications of the introduction of Shimano's flat mount disc format for road (based) bikes...
Is this the end of I.S. post mounts on road frames and thus the beginning of the end for I.S. / post mount brakes designed to work with road drop bar levers? (Already a small selection - mainly Avid BB7 or TRP Spyre).
I thought that the post mount / I.S. with post-mount adaptor might remain a popular format for touring / CX bikes, especially steel ones, as it looks easier for bike manufacturers to add an I.S. mount on to a normal chain stay, rather than build it into the tube itself, but have seen today that Genesis' 2016 steel bikes have a cast flat mount dropout...
http://www.genesisbikes.co.uk/bikes/road/frames/equilibrium-disc-931-frameset
There are a lot of steel-oriented traditionalists (including myself!) who have reluctantly bitten the disc brake bullet and bought decent steel disc-braked road bikes in the last couple of years (OK, not road-road bikes, but drop-bar 700c bikes - call them what you want) with the expectation of them lasting years, only to see this new 'standard' flooding the market.
I'd be less annoyed if I'd bought a carbon/alloy bike that I expected to replace in 3-5 years, but I like to buy hardy steel bikes with the intention of making them last longer (my last steel frame managed 2 months before meeting a car bumper, but my dad's old Fuji and Dawes have lasted 30 years).
My expenditure hasn't been too hefty (a Planet X Kaffenback frame set, plus new disc wheels based on MTB hubs and Avid BB7 road brakes) compared to some of the Genesis models I see people riding round here (especially the Ti or stainless steel models!) but if this sort of set up dies out I'll be annoyed - some frames might live on with flat bars and MTB disc calipers, but generally a frame bought for drop bar use would be too short in the top tube for flat bar use.
Anyone have any ideas on where this might be going next - Surly showing no signs yet of going to flat mount on their drop-barred disc bikes. Any hope that I.S. / post mounts and quick releases might persist on less race-oriented bikes? Are the drop-lever compatible I.S/post mount brakes on their way out?
Makes me tempted to get canti-posts brazed on and give the disc-brake market the middle finger I was tempted to give it before I caved...
Feel free to suggest if there's a more appropriate forum for this topic.
Wondering what people's thoughts are on the implications of the introduction of Shimano's flat mount disc format for road (based) bikes...
Is this the end of I.S. post mounts on road frames and thus the beginning of the end for I.S. / post mount brakes designed to work with road drop bar levers? (Already a small selection - mainly Avid BB7 or TRP Spyre).
I thought that the post mount / I.S. with post-mount adaptor might remain a popular format for touring / CX bikes, especially steel ones, as it looks easier for bike manufacturers to add an I.S. mount on to a normal chain stay, rather than build it into the tube itself, but have seen today that Genesis' 2016 steel bikes have a cast flat mount dropout...
http://www.genesisbikes.co.uk/bikes/road/frames/equilibrium-disc-931-frameset
There are a lot of steel-oriented traditionalists (including myself!) who have reluctantly bitten the disc brake bullet and bought decent steel disc-braked road bikes in the last couple of years (OK, not road-road bikes, but drop-bar 700c bikes - call them what you want) with the expectation of them lasting years, only to see this new 'standard' flooding the market.
I'd be less annoyed if I'd bought a carbon/alloy bike that I expected to replace in 3-5 years, but I like to buy hardy steel bikes with the intention of making them last longer (my last steel frame managed 2 months before meeting a car bumper, but my dad's old Fuji and Dawes have lasted 30 years).
My expenditure hasn't been too hefty (a Planet X Kaffenback frame set, plus new disc wheels based on MTB hubs and Avid BB7 road brakes) compared to some of the Genesis models I see people riding round here (especially the Ti or stainless steel models!) but if this sort of set up dies out I'll be annoyed - some frames might live on with flat bars and MTB disc calipers, but generally a frame bought for drop bar use would be too short in the top tube for flat bar use.
Anyone have any ideas on where this might be going next - Surly showing no signs yet of going to flat mount on their drop-barred disc bikes. Any hope that I.S. / post mounts and quick releases might persist on less race-oriented bikes? Are the drop-lever compatible I.S/post mount brakes on their way out?
Makes me tempted to get canti-posts brazed on and give the disc-brake market the middle finger I was tempted to give it before I caved...
Feel free to suggest if there's a more appropriate forum for this topic.
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Comments
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Shimano do post-mounted hydro brakes and these still seem standard on MTB too - I'm not sure what the fuss is about? As for carbon/alloy frames only being kept "3-5 years" what's that about? And if a bike is steel or Ti, there's plenty of capability about to have it adapted to all sorts of brakes. And, if you're really worried, just buy a few sets of calipers and salt them away.ROAD < Scott Foil HMX Di2, Volagi Liscio Di2, Jamis Renegade Elite Di2, Cube Reaction Race > ROUGH0
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I have BB7 calipers than are 12 years old and still working - really depends on how long you plan on keeping the bike for and parts aren't going to disappear overnight. The whole bike industry survives on built-in obsolescence - if you're worried, buy a spare pair of calipers and tuck them away.Make mine an Italian, with Campagnolo on the side..0
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My old MTB is has 26 inch wheels, IS disk mounts, 9 speed cassette etc.
all if not obsolete, certainly superseded.
I use the old MTB most days as it's my commute/pop to town bike, so wear out and need new bits and bobs.
needs adapters for the new disk brakes I bought for it, but works fine.
road disks are in flux, but realistically I would assume that adapters for flat mounts will happen.0 -
Shimano do post-mounted hydro brakes and these still seem standard on MTB too - I'm not sure what the fuss is about?
I suppose the fuss (only as far as bikes go - there are worse things in life than potential obsolescence in the bike industry
) is that until now it's been a fairly cheap and reliable system to use road-specific cable disc calipers with one's existing road levers. This relatively simple and still mechanical system has, in the last few years, tempted some of us sceptical of discs into getting them when we needed a new bike, accepting that it was going the be 'the future' and hoping that if anything, the number of options for useable callipers might increase. Whereas from this year onwards it looks like road-specific calipers will all begin to use the flat-mount fitting - yes there are a few calipers with the road lever cable pull on the market, but I'd expect to see these die out now that the road industry has its 'own' standard.
I'm aware it might be a possibility to use hydro drop levers with mtb hydro brake calipers - but this is a much more expensive and less home-mechanic-friendly system.
Hydro drop levers will probably become more affordable in the next few years... though probably coming with new issues re. number of gears the brifter units are designed for (11 or more vs. the 9 or 10 speed systems most of the decent disc-braked road/touring bikes of the last 5 years use).0 -
there's plenty of capability about to have it adapted to all sorts of brakes. And, if you're really worried, just buy a few sets of calipers and salt them away.
As far as adapting a steel/ti frame, it would seem perhaps a bit trickier to add a flat mount than adding an I.S. tab, though I'm sure we'll see it done in the near future - would need to cut off a bit of chain stay and replace the drop-out I believe. A bigger question might be whether people with bikes worth adapting are unable to anyway because of the possible spread of wider disc hubs (142mm+) and through axles.0 -
As for carbon/alloy frames only being kept "3-5 years" what's that about?
I'd certainly hope any frame I bought would last longer than 5 years. I've never owned a carbon frame and never fatally broken an alloy frame. And despite the supposed repairability of steel, I probably wouldn't buy a steel frame worth a major repair such as replacing a top tube - just decent chromoly affordable fare.
I just wouldn't buy a carbon/alloy frame and ride it often with quite the same expectation that it would, assuming no major crashes, last 20 years if I wanted it to, or allow myself to become as attached to it! I'm prepared to admit that's partly down to my absorption of popular belief surrounding the durability of the various materials...0 -
I have BB7 calipers than are 12 years old and still working - really depends on how long you plan on keeping the bike for and parts aren't going to disappear overnight. The whole bike industry survives on built-in obsolescence - if you're worried, buy a spare pair of calipers and tuck them away.
Good going! I suspect the hydro drop lever to MTB caliper will be one solution to this. And I've seen some people using MTB cable calipers with road brifters, which isn't supposed to work. I would buy any bike, at least a steel one, with the expectation that barring major crashes, or the discovery that it doesn't fit, it could last 10+ years. Like lots of biking folk who can't afford/don't want a new race bike every 2 years, I like to have hardy stuff and look after it. 'Progress' in the market doesn't really excite me if it's going to force me to replace stuff. True, parts don't disappear quite overnight, though I don't think its uncommon to find a shop has run out of something, say they expect it'll be back in soon, and then find out from the distributer that it's been discontinued quietly. And if you tend to buy a bike and ignore the market for a few months/years, only dipping back in to buy when something wears out, its always a bit of a shock how quickly things move on, e.g. when I looked for a replacement internal headset for a road bike a couple of years ago, half the road bikes I saw had tapered head 1.125 --> 1.5 tubes, which I'd never seen when purchasing that bike about 18 months prior.
I wish it would stop trying to spell-correct 'calipers' .0
