Battle of the Beach 2016.

bendertherobot

Mach_6 wrote:

Hmmm, here's a question I'm pondering.... which is quicker at Pembrey.... a 450g 700x40C file tread tyre or a 330g 700x34C general conditions CX tyre? I rode the CX tyre last year and it was a bit sketchy on the loose dunes and some of the single track. Although heavier, I'm thinking the bigger volume tyre might be better in the dunes and give a bit more comfort on the single track. It's probably all in my head, but the bike definitely feels heavier with the big ass tyres on.... going to burn it around the woods tomorrow to see if I can feel a difference.

It's really interesting and I've been pondering it a lot. We know one thing, those dutch boys use very little grip at all. Bald rears and file tread or dots up front.

Last year I used Vittoria XG Pro. They were fine. Fast on the beach, ok on the dunes, good on the singletrack.

In my head I believe that my 35c tubeless G-Ones will be very fast on the beach, ok on the singletrack. But, what about the dunes. In my head I picture them being just fine. Essentially you're carving a line rather than looking for any grip per se. Indeed, a massive volume tyre here, even a bald one, would just float over. In my head anyway.

IF I could fit them I'd be running the 38c G-One (which apparently measure more like 40c).

There's almost certainly a load of science here. But, next weeks looks really very dry, drainage there is pretty much excellent. As long as there's not shed loads of rain we're looking at no mud.

tgotb

Mach_6 wrote:

It's probably all in my head

I think there's a lot in this, and Mach_6's plan to try them out is a good one.

I spent a fair bit of time this season riding around on the "wrong" tyres, to get a feel for just how much of a difference it makes; although you could tell the difference, it was subtle, and certainly a lot less significant than, say, 5psi of tyre pressure. For instance, my last race of the season (London team champs) had a long draggy climb which was quite slippery; probably 20-25% of the field were running it. I was alternating between a bike with mud tyres and a bike with intermediates (Grifos). Although the Grifos were definitely less grippy, they were still fine, and there's nothing in the lap times to suggest a difference. I then went back after the race and rode the same climb with an extra 5psi in the mud tyres, and whilst I could still get up the climb, it was definitely the hardest combination (even with the luxury of being able to choose my line). So it's definitely worth trying to choose the right tyres, but it's not going to spoil your day if you get it wrong.

I rode last year's race on 33mm file treads, and had no issues with grip anywhere. If it's as dry as forecast, I'm planning to do the same this year. I'll probably start my recce lap on something like 25psi (which is high for me) and go from there.

bendertherobot

Whilst the forecast can change at an instant it's looking like a very dry 10 days indeed now. Including the event days. So the puddle of doom will be missing one hopes. The singletrack might even prove a little dusty. Fingers crossed. Nice weather for camping as well.

imposter2.0

As long as there's not a block headwind on the beach, I'll be happy enough...

bendertherobot

If anything it currently looks like a tailwind.

bendertherobot

Going to take quite a model shift to get anything other than dry and mild temps now. And a 6 mph easterly tailwind is a very lovely bonus.

bendertherobot

Weather's unlikely to change to any significant degree now. And, at the moment, it looks like bloody perfection. 11 degrees and virtually no wind for Battle in the Dark. 13 degrees ish and almost still for Battle on the Beach. Can't bloody wait.

imposter2.0

That's ruined it. We are gonna get 5 degrees, hail and a 50kt head wind now..

bendertherobot

Imposter wrote:

That's ruined it. We are gonna get 5 degrees, hail and a 50kt head wind now..

Not a chance now. Still around 11-12 degrees and slight tailwind. And loads of sun.

bendertherobot

Everyone excited?

imposter2.0

I'm getting my usual feelings of inadequacy and self-doubt, which typically creep in before an event like this....

bendertherobot

I've never had those feelings. I know I'm inadequate, so don't ever really experience self doubt.

imposter2.0

I'm still coming to terms with mine...

bendertherobot

It's pretty dry. One small muddy stretch and one large puddle. G-one's worked really well on all but the mud so sticking with them.

bendertherobot

It's pretty dry. One small muddy stretch and one large puddle. G-one's worked really well on all but the mud so sticking with them.

imposter2.0

Colder than I thought - and slightly muddier

Great event though...

bendertherobot

I'm shattered

meanredspider

I didn't make it - was up at 4.30am but my back was hurting like hell so decided not to risk it as I've got an incredibly busy & critical week ahead.

Hope you a great time

bendertherobot

Ouch dude. Yeah, new sections a bit roller coastery so good not to risk your health.

Loved it this year. Bit stronger than last. 3.1 miles longer it seems. Absolutely lovely weather as well. 1/2 hour AFTER I finished.

bendertherobot

https://roubaixcycling.wordpress.com/20 ... nt-review/

tgotb

Thoroughly enjoyed that, and unlike last year I actually managed to complete the course! Feeling a bit battered this morning though...

Tyre combo still wasn't perfect. After puncturing last year, I went with Vittoria XNs tubeless at ~26psi. They seemed to be fast and grippy, but the rear was burping on some of the more technical sections, and I lost a bunch of places stopping to reinflate it in lap 2. Got round just inside 2 hours, according to my Garmin; no idea what sort of position that'll translate to.

For next year, I guess the options are either to run the rear at more like 30psi, use tubs, or ride an MTB (but CX bikes seemed to be such an advantage on the beach!)

bendertherobot

TGOTB wrote:

Thoroughly enjoyed that, and unlike last year I actually managed to complete the course! Feeling a bit battered this morning though...

Tyre combo still wasn't perfect. After puncturing last year, I went with Vittoria XNs tubeless at ~26psi. They seemed to be fast and grippy, but the rear was burping on some of the more technical sections, and I lost a bunch of places stopping to reinflate it in lap 2. Got round just inside 2 hours, according to my Garmin; no idea what sort of position that'll translate to.

For next year, I guess the options are either to run the rear at more like 30psi, use tubs, or ride an MTB (but CX bikes seemed to be such an advantage on the beach!)

Your position will be, in my view, very good! Results are up.

If it helps I ran the G-One's at about 50 psi. A little hard on the wrists in a few places but I do think that harder is a bit better at this event.

6wheels

Excellent review, some writers make reading so pleasant. It should be on the Homepage, otherwise not many people will read it.

bendertherobot

Thanks!

tgotb

Great writeup!

FWIW, I reckon the answer to minimising the impact of that first bottleneck is just to hammer it up the beach. I had a pretty ordinary start, but managed to gain a lot of ground by riding up the left hand side of the field (out of the wind). Couldn't bridge over to the leading group, but was near the front of the second group as we came off the beach. We weren't able to ride that first singletrack climb, but that was mostly because someone ahead fluffed it; we were definitely running rather than walking. After that, traffic wasn't really an issue until we started lapping people in lap 3.

Got round in exactly 2 hours for 60th Senior. That would have been 45th Vet if I'd entered the correct category, happy with that...

Useful feedback on tyre pressure, I think that's the answer. I'm too used to sliding around muddy playing fields at 14psi; even before I started burping air out, I was definitely clattering the rear rim over the rockier bits of the forest road...

Some of the group riding was a bit sketchy; people on imaginary aero bars in the middle of the bunch at >25mph; there was one crash just ahead of me quite early on; hope everyone was ok!

That bumpy bit along the back of the dunes, just after we turned off the beach... Ugh!

bendertherobot

TGOTB wrote:

Great writeup!

FWIW, I reckon the answer to minimising the impact of that first bottleneck is just to hammer it up the beach. I had a pretty ordinary start, but managed to gain a lot of ground by riding up the left hand side of the field (out of the wind). Couldn't bridge over to the leading group, but was near the front of the second group as we came off the beach. We weren't able to ride that first singletrack climb, but that was mostly because someone ahead fluffed it; we were definitely running rather than walking. After that, traffic wasn't really an issue until we started lapping people in lap 3.

Got round in exactly 2 hours for 60th Senior. That would have been 45th Vet if I'd entered the correct category, happy with that...

Useful feedback on tyre pressure, I think that's the answer. I'm too used to sliding around muddy playing fields at 14psi; even before I started burping air out, I was definitely clattering the rear rim over the rockier bits of the forest road...

Some of the group riding was a bit sketchy; people on imaginary aero bars in the middle of the bunch at >25mph; there was one crash just ahead of me quite early on; hope everyone was ok!

That bumpy bit along the back of the dunes, just after we turned off the beach... Ugh!

I wondered whether the answer was a Le Mans type start Would be interesting. Yeah, the issue with that bottleneck is that no matter how good the riders are someone will catch up to someone and put a foot down. And then it's like red lights on the motorway. The grass section was an effort to string us out, thing is, it's not that slow a section. Chucking some single track in would sort it but then that section would be bombed. As you say it clears out on lap 2 and 3 so it's not really a big issue. Only had one person queue jump this year.

The tyre pressure thing is fascinating. I was running only a few PSI less than I do on the road. The only part where it was really bumpy was the descent down after that bottleneck. Tough on a CX. I'd imagine doing it on a fat bike would be like a magic carpet.

cyclingsheep

bendertherobot wrote:

TGOTB wrote:

Great writeup!

FWIW, I reckon the answer to minimising the impact of that first bottleneck is just to hammer it up the beach. I had a pretty ordinary start, but managed to gain a lot of ground by riding up the left hand side of the field (out of the wind). Couldn't bridge over to the leading group, but was near the front of the second group as we came off the beach. We weren't able to ride that first singletrack climb, but that was mostly because someone ahead fluffed it; we were definitely running rather than walking. After that, traffic wasn't really an issue until we started lapping people in lap 3.

Got round in exactly 2 hours for 60th Senior. That would have been 45th Vet if I'd entered the correct category, happy with that...

Useful feedback on tyre pressure, I think that's the answer. I'm too used to sliding around muddy playing fields at 14psi; even before I started burping air out, I was definitely clattering the rear rim over the rockier bits of the forest road...

Some of the group riding was a bit sketchy; people on imaginary aero bars in the middle of the bunch at >25mph; there was one crash just ahead of me quite early on; hope everyone was ok!

That bumpy bit along the back of the dunes, just after we turned off the beach... Ugh!

I wondered whether the answer was a Le Mans type start Would be interesting. Yeah, the issue with that bottleneck is that no matter how good the riders are someone will catch up to someone and put a foot down. And then it's like red lights on the motorway. The grass section was an effort to string us out, thing is, it's not that slow a section. Chucking some single track in would sort it but then that section would be bombed. As you say it clears out on lap 2 and 3 so it's not really a big issue. Only had one person queue jump this year.

The tyre pressure thing is fascinating. I was running only a few PSI less than I do on the road. The only part where it was really bumpy was the descent down after that bottleneck. Tough on a CX. I'd imagine doing it on a fat bike would be like a magic carpet.

Yeah that downhill section was a bit chattery on the CX bike but on the other downhill sections it never held me back. On the last lap I caught up to a guy on a fat bike and he glanced back before trying to drop me by really throwing himself down a great single track downhill section, reckon he was surprised I was still right on his tail by the bottom The thing that killed me (along with a general lack of fitness) was having my front mech stopped working for a lap and a half leaving me in the big ring, by the time it started working again my legs were already shot and cramping up. Awesome fun though

bendertherobot

Aye, as I said on Wordpress, go 1x! It's great and meant cleaning the bike was easier today. Easier, still took me ages flushing sand out of the drive side bottom bracket area. I continually assess strategy for this race, even though I'm not all that good, and what I think is this......prepare for a shock........and this goes for a lot of my CX as well.... if I'd just start at the front and be a bit more, well, competitive throughout rather than worrying about holding people up, I'd do much better. I'm just to darned nice.

cyclingsheep

bendertherobot wrote:

Aye, as I said on Wordpress, go 1x! It's great and meant cleaning the bike was easier today. Easier, still took me ages flushing sand out of the drive side bottom bracket area. I continually assess strategy for this race, even though I'm not all that good, and what I think is this......prepare for a shock........and this goes for a lot of my CX as well.... if I'd just start at the front and be a bit more, well, competitive throughout rather than worrying about holding people up, I'd do much better. I'm just to darned nice.

Haha, starting near the front might have been nice. I think there were only about five people behind me on the start line.

bendertherobot

cyclingsheep wrote:

bendertherobot wrote:

Aye, as I said on Wordpress, go 1x! It's great and meant cleaning the bike was easier today. Easier, still took me ages flushing sand out of the drive side bottom bracket area. I continually assess strategy for this race, even though I'm not all that good, and what I think is this......prepare for a shock........and this goes for a lot of my CX as well.... if I'd just start at the front and be a bit more, well, competitive throughout rather than worrying about holding people up, I'd do much better. I'm just to darned nice.

Haha, starting near the front might have been nice. I think there were only about five people behind me on the start line.

I think there were only 6 behind me