Body protection for Road cycling after an accident

Seynodien74

Hi,

While descending the famous Semnoz pass in the Alps (23kms at 11%), I slid due to gravels on the road freshly asphalted, and was injured: collarbones and elbow fractures, hand nerves + triceps muscle severed, and 3 floating ribs broken, and abrasion on skins.
Even if I was driving at 40 Km/h, I can assure that we can go "fast" on the road (up to 70 KM/h in the descent of the Alps for example.

So today, I am seeking for light "body protection" to protect us on the road.... just because ridicule never killed anyone :?
Personaly I have this opinion for just 3 months as my arm and elbow are now buit with metal ans screw.

Just to let you know, thanks to my helmet (it „was“ a Specialized Propero) I am still alive. But I have been injured on the temples. So when searching on the net I found that POC Octal Avip Mips cover largely temples.
I feel free to share with you a link related to a Swedish study regarding Helmets protection: http://www.folksam.se/polopoly_fs/1.139790!/Folksam%20bicycle%20helmet%20test%202015.pdf As you can see, the the octal AVIP MIPS is on the stage....just behind a first airbag! So I hope that the Octal will solve the issue I had, and will buy one.

BTW, I am also looking for protections for the elbow and also for the hip.
The problem with automatic pedals is that you are not able to release immediately the pedals during and accident, so you slide with your bicycle. The net effect is that I was totally injured on the left side.

For MTB/Downhill/descent…. We can find lots of protections. But I did found nothing related to roadcycling…. The integration of protectors around the Hip is a vastly more difficult because by their nature the protectors are bulky and will impede movement in the area that moves the most in cycling.

Are you aware of a specific "light" protections for Road cycling? Any trick for the hip?

Please let me know which apparels could fit well to road cycling and if you will release shortly such products.

Thanks in advance for your reply on this.
Best regards.
Jean-Philippe

ddraver

The simple answer is that they don't exist. There may be some MTB pads that are marketed for cross country riding - by which the really mean slow trail riding. They would be insanely warm for almost any other part of road riding and (from my experience with them on the MTB) inevitable end up slipping after a few kms of normal riding (ie not descending). Plus, they are only really designed to stop grazes or cuts and would nt have helped with the broken bones...

The closest I can think of is some really new stuff (last Eurobike) that has been released for E-bike use but again this is not designed for real road riding.

Seynodien74

Thanks Ddraver for your reply on this.

While contacting the Swedish cie POC Sport (which was first focus on Ski protection), here was their answer: "The Air series of protectors are the lightest and most flexible ones we make. They were conceived for trail and cross country mountain bikers who were looking for protection they could wear during the entire ride, and not only during the descents. As for road biking, I could definitely imagine that they would be a good match, especially if you are targeting a longer and faster alpine descent.

I feel free to share with you what I found (the short is just for skin abrasion to be honest) :
- a bib short from Scott ( Scott (Scott RC ProTec bib shorts )
- I may have found for Elbow from POC sport (Joint VPD Air Elbow),
- if somebody is looking for a jersey protection : from Scott and Poc sport (AVIP Back protection Jersey)

Anything else?

Bobbinogs

Sorry to hear about your off, very sobering indeed. Hope all goes well in the recovery. Shows all the talk about "at least the bike was OK" to be the complete guff that it is.

FWIW, I think any kind of body armour will miss the mark and that the best things to keep you safe will be a) ensure that you have fully recovered (bones can take a long time to heal) and b) be both confident as a rider...and cautious as a rider (getting the right balance between the two is the trick).

When I broke my collarbone badly, after 10 weeks I was back out on the road but I did ensure I got my consultant's advice first, which was "Don't fall off".

Seynodien74

You are right Bobbinog.
Personally, before moving to the east of France (closed to the Alps), I have been working in Paris for 18 years. To avoid 1:30 h traffic jam on the morning and the evening, I change my car for a 400 cm3 Scooter, and was really "confident as a rider...and cautious as a rider" as you said.

BTW, I am both hurried to be back on a new bike, but also really anxious. To be honest, 3 weeks ago I went back to the pass (by car). I was surprised that my legs were trembling!

Answering your question: My bike (a Specialized Roubaix Expert) has been broken. So I think I will select a Cannondale Synapse.
All the best.

pblakeney

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19741948#p19741948]Seynodien74[/url] wrote:

Just to let you know, thanks to my helmet (it „was“ a Specialized Propero) I am still alive.

Phew!
That's a relief. I thought I was getting messages from the grave there.

ddraver

I think the guy from POC may not be the most balanced person to speak to here though. Yes those sorts of pads will be better than full on DH pads but I think over a long ride you'd find them very annoying...

Seynodien74

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19742052#p19742052]PBlakeney[/url] wrote:

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19741948#p19741948]Seynodien74[/url] wrote:

Just to let you know, thanks to my helmet (it „was“ a Specialized Propero) I am still alive.

Phew!
That's a relief. I thought I was getting messages from the grave there.

:twisted:
No this is just to mention that I am alarmed at seeing many cyclists without any helmet. But I am not ready to wear the Airbag Helmet, pointed in the above study (look at the video, it's amazing !
http://www.hovding.com/how_hovding_works/

grenw

Lightest elbow protection I've seen (I have a pair in the garage) are 661 Rhythms. They are pretty much like arm warmers with a bit of chamois pad sewn into them. Might just take the sting out of a fall but not much else. I guess they'd be okay on a road bike. Never worn them for ages

Assos will also sell you ferociously expensive (even for them) hip padded bibs. I think they run to close on £300. Anything more would be awful on the road, I could never get on with knee pads even on the mtb. To hot, sweaty and restrictive

frisbee

Clipless pedals release brilliantly well in a proper violent crash.

If you slide out you'll stay with the bike even if you have flats.

Seynodien74

My previous Look released well and you could tighten the screw.
But I bought in June the new Look Keo Blade 2 CR Carbon. These one cannot be tightened (carbon strip).

BTW, as I silded on the road, I beleive that the pedals protected me: no crash on the knee and leg.

FatTed

Don't know anything about this stuff, Bib shorts and jersey.
https://www.dragginjeans.net/cycle/friction-cycling-jersey/flypage.tpl.html

sloppyschleckonds

I tend to wrap myself in cotton wool before going out, works wonders.

kajjal

You might want to post this in the mountain bike section of the forum as many more will be using body armour etc.

But to be honest it would be unlikely to protect you from the unfortunate accident you had. Best thing to do is just take it easier and be more cautious now you have preexisting injuries.

mamba80

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19742360#p19742360]Kajjal[/url] wrote:

You might want to post this in the mountain bike section of the forum as many more will be using body armour etc.

But to be honest it would be unlikely to protect you from the unfortunate accident you had. Best thing to do is just take it easier and be more cautious now you have preexisting injuries.

Why? the op is after road protective clothing and the post above seems to fit the bill for abrasion resistant stuff, mtb 's tend not to worry bulk etc

i ve oft wondered with todays modern materials why such clothings isnt more readily available.

kajjal

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19742366#p19742366]mamba80[/url] wrote:

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19742360#p19742360]Kajjal[/url] wrote:

You might want to post this in the mountain bike section of the forum as many more will be using body armour etc.s

But to be honest it would be unlikely to protect you from the unfortunate accident you had. Best thing to do is just take it easier and be more cautious now you have preexisting injuries.

Why? the op is after road protective clothing and the post above seems to fit the bill for abrasion resistant stuff, mtb 's tend not to worry bulk etc

i ve oft wondered with todays modern materials why such clothings isnt more readily available.

I was going by the extensive list of injuries. I have witnessed many mountain bike offs in the past but nothing comes close the extensive injury list the OP suffered. You would be looking at full motor bike gear to protect against that list.

Stevo_666

There is already stuff out there which you could use. There are lightweight MTB elbow pads that should not make any real difference to an amateur road rider. I have a pair of padded under shorts for downhill but all they are is lycra shorts with some foam padding to protect your bony bits: not really restrictive but would look a bit odd if ypu didnt wear anything over them.

It depends how much you value injury protection I guess.

Here's a couple of examples of what I mean:
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ixs-flow-elbow-guards-2016/rp-prod88346

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/661-sub-shorts-2015/rp-prod113567

diy

There is quite a bit in the motorcycle world for this purpose. Alpinestars do some lightweight armour



see vid.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IZQuIiWh_ZY

The Knox Top Urbane Air is similar too.

you could go up a size on your jersey and wear this underneath. Abrasion protection is a tough one as there really isn't much that is lighter than cow or kangeroo hide.

Its going to be hard to protect the clavicle with anything other than motocross armour.

Giraffoto

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19743378#p19743378]diy[/url] wrote:

. . .
Its going to be hard to protect the clavicle with anything other than motocross armour.

Clavicles (and collar bones) don't often get broken by something hitting them directly, it's usually a particular type of fall onto an outstretched arm, so padding your collar bones won't help much.

diy

With all the stupid cycling inventions being launched on crapstarter, its about time someone thought of some innovation to introduce some basic abrasion resistence and armour in to road cycling clothes.

Standard kit, probably has less ability to resist friction than paper and even just something 1/2mm thick could disperse the impact better.

FatTed

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19744053#p19744053]diy[/url] wrote:

With all the stupid cycling inventions being launched on crapstarter, its about time someone thought of some innovation to introduce some basic abrasion resistence and armour in to road cycling clothes.


This
.
https://www.dragginjeans.net/cycle/friction-cycling-jersey/flypage.tpl.html

ManOfKent

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19744053#p19744053]diy[/url] wrote:

With all the stupid cycling inventions being launched on crapstarter, its about time someone thought of some innovation to introduce some basic abrasion resistence and armour in to road cycling clothes.

Standard kit, probably has less ability to resist friction than paper and even just something 1/2mm thick could disperse the impact better.

I'm not sure it's that simple though. A clubmate fell off a few weeks ago and had a grazed elbow (among other injuries) but his jersey was undamaged.

I met a guy 18 months ago who was trying to design kevlar inserts to protect hips and elbows, aimed at crit racers, but I'm not sure whether he got anywhere with it.

Giraffoto

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19745773#p19745773]ManOfKent[/url] wrote:

I'm not sure it's that simple though. A clubmate fell off a few weeks ago and had a grazed elbow (among other injuries) but his jersey was undamaged.

I did something like that a few months ago - bruised my elbow, blood all over the inside of my jersey, but no actual damage. Elbow, hip and knee pads would be the way to go, the latter two could probably be built into 3/4 crops. Would the same stuff as the chamois pad is made of do the job?

Seynodien74

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19743593#p19743593]Giraffoto[/url] wrote:

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19743378#p19743378]diy[/url] wrote:

. . .

Clavicles (and collar bones) don't often get broken by something hitting them directly, it's usually a particular type of fall onto an outstretched arm, so padding your collar bones won't help much.

Exact!
Clavicle and collarbones have been broken due to the first (but really high) impact on the elbow.
In fact, when I saw the gravels on the bend, it was too late to slow down. FYI, my GPS shows that I was "just" at 38 KM/H.
Feel free to share with you some photos:

Used slightly the brakes but the back wheel jammed. I crossed the road straight forward and reached the side of the road. I was still on the bike, hands clutched on the handlebars, but tires bursted on the stones... I crushed on the stones.

Seynodien74

Same for the bike: a bit broken


After the impact, I released the pedals, and could get up.
As you pointed Giraffoto, it really hurt on the elbow first and secondly on the clavicule, then the hip and head :!:
While my arm was bleeding, and even if I had a pain (dull) in my collar bones, I much more focused on my elbow than the calvicule!

Seynodien74

Even if I was cycling 'slowly' on this descent (this 23 Km descent start at 11% up to 6%), I will be extremely coutious in the future!

Anyway, I feel free to share with you some products found that 'could' feet to cycling. Please do not hesitate to give your feedback on this and update the list accordingly.

Helmet:
As you can see in the picture, my Specialized helmet did the job (saving my 2 neurons ). The own part of my head that has been hurt is the temples. Amazingly very few helmets cover this part!
Refering to the Swedish study (first post), I will order a POC Octal AVIP MIPS which covers this part of the temples. http://www.pocsports.com/en/product/1973/octal-avip-mips

Elbow:
1° Contacted Race Face with regards to this: http://raceface.com/guards/arms/indy-elbow/.
Told me that it combines the unrestricted mobility of the Race Face Charge Elbow pad with the added impact protection of D3O, but this is focused to ENDURO, not to road cycling: speed but also impacts ARE not the same.

2° Told me to try specific rollers' equipments: http://der-rollenshop.sportkanzler.de/navi.php?a=17343&a2=21712, which is also based on the asphalt. BTW, speed is a bit different. Any feedback?

3° dragginjeans.net/index.php or a similar product from Scott Sport: scott-sports.com/global/fr/products/2417145024009/Maillot-SCOTT-RC-Pro-Tec-s-sl
But this has no effect to the impact, just the abrasion.

4° http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/fr/fr/coudieres-ixs-flow-2016/rp-prod88346 or similar from POC: http://www.pocsports.com/en/product/2142/joint-vpd-air-elbow could be the "lightest" products that could absorb the impact.

HIP: same as above you can find 2 different products:
Abrasion: dragginjeans.net/cycle/knicks/view-all-products.html or from Scott Sport scott-sports.com/global/fr/products/2417175024007/Cuissard-SCOTT-RC-Pro-Tec-%2B%2B%2B/

Lightweight Hip Protection
http://www.pocsports.com/en/product/1393/hip-vpd-2-0-shorts ==> but you can see this is a large hip protection (one piece)

http://sixsixone.com/bike/protection/body/evo-short-w-chamois or this one http://sixsixone.com/bike/shorts/short: made of 2 differrent pieces of protection

http://www.scott-sports.com/global/fr/products/2275450001006/Sous-short-protecteur%C2%A0SCOTT-Missile%C2%A0

Specific to rollers: http://der-rollenshop.sportkanzler.de/Ennui-Protection-ST-Boxershorts_1 :very small but thick protection

Please add.

northcliff66

Didnt someone produce bib shorts with kevlar material side panels?

EBEB

I wear, in training, a combination of light motorbike and MTB armour, mainly Alpinestars. Often elbow pads. Knee pads in the few weeks before races, as you don't want a stupid graze getting in the way.

It is pretty hot and weighs quite a lot, but who cares for training? You also get funny looks, but again, who cares (and now there are at least two of us). Yours was quite a big bang though, so I am not sure it would stop all of that.

The one piece of advice I would give is regarding the upper armour and back protector; your back will sweat like hell and it will stick. I spent ages trying to get it off after a particularly hot cycle. Wear a thin wicking heat transfer thing between it and your back. You'll know what I mean if you ever get back from a long cycle, soaked and covered in sweat only to find you can't get your armour off.

I suppose I could also say 'buy some hand washing detergent'. You can't put the armour in the machine and it gets soaked in sweat.

Incidentally, I bought a POC Trabec Race MIPS after my last crash. Not designed for road cycling, but I don't really care. I wanted maximum protection, without going full face downhill type

Bobbinogs

OP You may want to take a step back and think about all this. Cycling is inherently a dangerous sport. If you really need to avoid any impact injury at all then cycling is not the sport to be pursuing since all this protection stuff is really just piffing in the wind...you could go out wrapped like the Michelin man and still break a collarbone by sticking your arm out instinctively when falling.

If you look at the pros and cons and still decide you want to cycle outdoors then have a chat with your consultant and agree a reasonable timeframe to return. This may involve indoor training for 6 months (or even a year) to keep your interest and some fitness and then a gradual return to the sport with very safe well planned rides in good weather NOT ridden at full gas or to the extent when one gets a bit ragged. Learn to take corners smoothly, brake conservatively, read the road, stay confident...it all helps to sway the odds in your favour. Perhaps then after another 6 -12 months you can start upping the ante...but your consultant may advise you that certain injuries will never be able to take an impact again and therefore you will need to weigh up the risks against the benefits.

Good luck with your recovery.

Seynodien74

Thanks Guys,
I am ok now, still 3 times a week in doing physiotherapy, but I am really keen to buy my next cycle. The Cannondale Synapse is waiting at the store
And the gift for Christmas is ... the Wahoo Home Trainer QuickR snap :P

Among all sports tried in the past, cycling is one of the 2 best sports I've done (second one is rawing in double or quad on the lake).
BTW Bobbinog, I won't stop cycling because I had a studpid accident, life if too short. Let's imagine this incredible playground :the Alps
To better understand, this is where I live :

So I won't renounce cycling just at my first fall.
But as you pointed, I must not fell again on my elbow because the biceps which has been severed cannot be titched up again. :? Same for my clavicule which has now some titan and screws.
This is only why I would need some protections for the next 6 / 8 months.

Seynodien74

@Ebeb,
As I go at work on 400 CM3 scooter, I fully agree with you, bike protections are great armors, but it is awfull in summer.