All Change - Silly Idea?
essex-commuter
Posts: 2,188
Currently commute on a CX bike with BB7 discs, mudguards, rack and pannier.
I'm getting bored.
Thinking of getting a new road bike and commuting with a back pack / messenger bag, no guards and no rack. If it's raining when I leave I will use the bike with guards. My commute is a quiet A road, a couple of villages and country lanes. Too hilly for a fixed.
I need something to rekindle my love of commuting.
Silly idea?
I'm getting bored.
Thinking of getting a new road bike and commuting with a back pack / messenger bag, no guards and no rack. If it's raining when I leave I will use the bike with guards. My commute is a quiet A road, a couple of villages and country lanes. Too hilly for a fixed.
I need something to rekindle my love of commuting.
Silly idea?
0
Comments
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As long as you're keeping the wet weather bike too then nothing silly about it
Just N+1, good work.0 -
Running two bikes? That's far too sensible.
Get the fixed, that's more in the silly idea ball park.0 -
Running two bikes? That's far too sensible.
Get the fixed, that's more in the silly idea ball park.
If I buy another I will be running 5 0 -
What's the advantage of moving to a bike without guards, and to carrying weight on your back? Surely that's a retrograde step?
If you don't like panniers and a rack, then get a saddlebag.
If you're not keen on mudguards, then just use raceblades, and only clip them on when you need them.1938 Hobbs Tandem
1956 Carlton Flyer Path/Track
1960 Mercian Superlight Track
1974 Pete Luxton Path/Track*
1980 Harry Hall
1986 Dawes Galaxy
1988 Jack Taylor Tourer
1988 Pearson
1989 Condor
1993 Dawes Hybrid
2016 Ridley Helium SL
*Currently on this0 -
I run 5 bikes ....
I use 3 of them for commuting (well, I did far more before a new mouth to feed turned up ...!)
best road bike set up for road riding, old road bike with guards, CX bike with rack and guards ...
The bike I ride depends on the weather - sometimes I take the CX because I feel guilty that I haven't ridden it as much as I should ....0 -
Get a motorbike. Seriously - it is a nice alternative to a cycle commute. Can carry more and is fun.0
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I ditched my rack and panniers and don't regret it. I keep the guards on most of the time though. Back doesn't get too sweaty with a pack, but the amount of spray from the road without guards is too much for me.What's the advantage of moving to a bike without guards, and to carrying weight on your back? Surely that's a retrograde step?0 -
Carradice SQR slim / tour, revolutionised the way I look at commuting.
That's it, I have no idea why people commute with panniers, it's overkill.0 -
I ditched my rack and panniers and don't regret it. I keep the guards on most of the time though. Back doesn't get too sweaty with a pack, but the amount of spray from the road without guards is too much for me.What's the advantage of moving to a bike without guards, and to carrying weight on your back? Surely that's a retrograde step?
I too ditched my rack and panniers, and I don't regret it. I've never looked back since I moved over to a Carradice saddlebag. None of the disadvantages of panniers and racks, since it's out of the wind, and doesn't require a vast meccano structure attached to your bike.1938 Hobbs Tandem
1956 Carlton Flyer Path/Track
1960 Mercian Superlight Track
1974 Pete Luxton Path/Track*
1980 Harry Hall
1986 Dawes Galaxy
1988 Jack Taylor Tourer
1988 Pearson
1989 Condor
1993 Dawes Hybrid
2016 Ridley Helium SL
*Currently on this0 -
I didn't like the feeling of the weight being on the bike, especially slung out over the back. It doesn't bother me on a backpack. Does the seat pack feel better being a bit further forward?
I ditched my rack and panniers and don't regret it. I keep the guards on most of the time though. Back doesn't get too sweaty with a pack, but the amount of spray from the road without guards is too much for me.What's the advantage of moving to a bike without guards, and to carrying weight on your back? Surely that's a retrograde step?
I too ditched my rack and panniers, and I don't regret it. I've never looked back since I moved over to a Carradice saddlebag. None of the disadvantages of panniers and racks, since it's out of the wind, and doesn't require a vast meccano structure attached to your bike.0 -
I didn't like the feeling of the weight being on the bike, especially slung out over the back. It doesn't bother me on a backpack. Does the seat pack feel better being a bit further forward?
I ditched my rack and panniers and don't regret it. I keep the guards on most of the time though. Back doesn't get too sweaty with a pack, but the amount of spray from the road without guards is too much for me.What's the advantage of moving to a bike without guards, and to carrying weight on your back? Surely that's a retrograde step?
I too ditched my rack and panniers, and I don't regret it. I've never looked back since I moved over to a Carradice saddlebag. None of the disadvantages of panniers and racks, since it's out of the wind, and doesn't require a vast meccano structure attached to your bike.
I think a lot depends on the bike, the Road SS I had was a light sharp angled thing, managed with courier bag and no guards, on wet days kept speed down and over 3 miles was enough to remain presentable.
The old MTB I tend to ride on the gravelly paths more so mudguards are needed, it's a heavier and slacker angles so even with lots of rubbish in the paniers is barely noticeable, years back had a hybrid and the frame would flex!
But even heavily loaded 8KG and more no noticeable flex. Though bit of a heavy lump though park gates etc.0 -
I didn't like the feeling of the weight being on the bike, especially slung out over the back. It doesn't bother me on a backpack. Does the seat pack feel better being a bit further forward?
I ditched my rack and panniers and don't regret it. I keep the guards on most of the time though. Back doesn't get too sweaty with a pack, but the amount of spray from the road without guards is too much for me.What's the advantage of moving to a bike without guards, and to carrying weight on your back? Surely that's a retrograde step?
I too ditched my rack and panniers, and I don't regret it. I've never looked back since I moved over to a Carradice saddlebag. None of the disadvantages of panniers and racks, since it's out of the wind, and doesn't require a vast meccano structure attached to your bike.
There's no doubt that it's noticeable, but from my experience, a lot less noticeable than having the load on your back. Like all things, it depends how heavy your load is. In my saddlebag, I carry:
Pump, tools and spare inner tube
Shoes
Towel
Trousers
Shirt
Deodorant
Socks/Underwear
Overshoes
Wallet/phone/keys
and if I'm going for a lunch run: running shoes, socks, shorts and top.
All up, with running kit, it weighs about 5kg. On my back, over 14 miles each way on my commute, this would be murder. When I'm out of the saddle, having a saddle bag is noticeable. On the flat, a lot less so.
However, the difference between a saddlebag and panniers is stark, especially in windy conditions, where panniers can act like sails, whether they're full or empty. A pannier rack is an extra kilo or so on its own too.1938 Hobbs Tandem
1956 Carlton Flyer Path/Track
1960 Mercian Superlight Track
1974 Pete Luxton Path/Track*
1980 Harry Hall
1986 Dawes Galaxy
1988 Jack Taylor Tourer
1988 Pearson
1989 Condor
1993 Dawes Hybrid
2016 Ridley Helium SL
*Currently on this0 -
SHOES?! Surely leave under desk? I was extremely glad to not have to commute in shoes. That's a large portion of weight there0
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SHOES?! Surely leave under desk? I was extremely glad to not have to commute in shoes. That's a large portion of weight there
The thing is, if the weight is on the bike, it really doesn't matter that much how much it weighs. I've done tours in the past with an all up weight (including me) of 110kg or so (touring bike weight 12kg, 76kg of me, and 22kg of tent and luggage), and once you get up to speed, you're not that much slower than on a road bike.
Even on my normal commute, I'm currently commuting on a bike that weighs 12kg (gaspipe framed Dawes Chevron), and with me at 76kg, and my saddlebag at 5kg, I'm looking at an all up weight of 93kg. Whether it's 93kg or 92.5kg without shoes makes no real difference - it's under 1% of the total weight, which is hardly a 'large proportion'!1938 Hobbs Tandem
1956 Carlton Flyer Path/Track
1960 Mercian Superlight Track
1974 Pete Luxton Path/Track*
1980 Harry Hall
1986 Dawes Galaxy
1988 Jack Taylor Tourer
1988 Pearson
1989 Condor
1993 Dawes Hybrid
2016 Ridley Helium SL
*Currently on this0 -
Fair enough. I guess it's just more faff and fuss to pack and roll into your saddle bag and gets your clothes dirty. Personally I'd love to commute with nothing! Fingers x'd the new office allows it0
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Nothing like a couple of days on public transport to re-kindle the joy of commuting by bike.
I find.0 -
Nothing like a couple of days on public transport to re-kindle the joy of commuting by bike.
I find.
No PT to where I work but yes I can imagine that would soon revert me back.
Didn't help that I treated myself to a 'mid-life crisis' car (as everyone calls it) last year so driving in isn't even a pain!0 -
SHOES?! Surely leave under desk? I was extremely glad to not have to commute in shoes. That's a large portion of weight there
The thing is, if the weight is on the bike, it really doesn't matter that much how much it weighs. I've done tours in the past with an all up weight (including me) of 110kg or so (touring bike weight 12kg, 76kg of me, and 22kg of tent and luggage), and once you get up to speed, you're not that much slower than on a road bike.
No, it is a lot slower (unless you are either bloody fast on a loaded bike or bloody slow on a road bike!). But it doesn't feel any harder. You just cover less ground. But of course, as with all changes, you do notice it for a short while until you get used to it.
I either use a backpack (quite like the insulation it gives in winter!) or a Carradice Audax. As the weight of that is between the wheels I would expect the impact on handling to be less than that of rear panniers. But unless you are carrying shopping home with you or a computer, I really can't see why anyone would need anything bigger than a Carradice saddle post bag anyway.
And yes - why bring shoes in every day?!Faster than a tent.......0 -
SHOES?! Surely leave under desk? I was extremely glad to not have to commute in shoes. That's a large portion of weight there
The thing is, if the weight is on the bike, it really doesn't matter that much how much it weighs. I've done tours in the past with an all up weight (including me) of 110kg or so (touring bike weight 12kg, 76kg of me, and 22kg of tent and luggage), and once you get up to speed, you're not that much slower than on a road bike.
No, it is a lot slower (unless you are either bloody fast on a loaded bike or bloody slow on a road bike!). But it doesn't feel any harder. You just cover less ground. But of course, as with all changes, you do notice it for a short while until you get used to it.
I either use a backpack (quite like the insulation it gives in winter!) or a Carradice Audax. As the weight of that is between the wheels I would expect the impact on handling to be less than that of rear panniers. But unless you are carrying shopping home with you or a computer, I really can't see why anyone would need anything bigger than a Carradice saddle post bag anyway.
And yes - why bring shoes in every day?!
Going uphill, it will be slower. Going downhill, it will be faster (more potential energy to convert into kinetic energy), and on the flat, there is no difference at all. All in, it really doesn't make that much difference. It's not the weight necessarily that slows you down, it's the wind resistance from all the panniers, plus the fact that you'll probably be running heavy touring tyres like Schwalbe Marathons.
As for the shoes, I sometimes work out of my city offices, so storing the shoes in my Green Park offices could be a problem. I'm always happier knowing I've got them on me..... and given how much my full rig weighs, the extra weight makes no difference. Everything fits into a Carradice Nelson very easily - even my shirt (folded well).1938 Hobbs Tandem
1956 Carlton Flyer Path/Track
1960 Mercian Superlight Track
1974 Pete Luxton Path/Track*
1980 Harry Hall
1986 Dawes Galaxy
1988 Jack Taylor Tourer
1988 Pearson
1989 Condor
1993 Dawes Hybrid
2016 Ridley Helium SL
*Currently on this0 -
I have gone the other way to using a rack- I suspect that my injuries from my accident were exacerbated by having a backpack with my computer etc in it on my back at the time.RIP commute...
Sometimes seen bimbling around on a purple Fratello Disc or black and red Aprire Vincenza.0 -
[quote="Rhodrich"
Going uphill, it will be slower. Going downhill, it will be faster (more potential energy to convert into kinetic energy), and on the flat, there is no difference at all. All in, it really doesn't make that much difference. It's not the weight necessarily that slows you down, it's the wind resistance from all the panniers, plus the fact that you'll probably be running heavy touring tyres like Schwalbe Marathons.
As for the shoes, I sometimes work out of my city offices, so storing the shoes in my Green Park offices could be a problem. I'm always happier knowing I've got them on me..... and given how much my full rig weighs, the extra weight makes no difference. Everything fits into a Carradice Nelson very easily - even my shirt (folded well).[/quote]
1/2mv^2=mgh and thus the m cancels out; you have more potential to covert but the velocity you gain is the same as you need to get a greater mass to the same speed. There is an argument regarding forces - a heavy bike will have the same amount of wind resistance but a greater force due to gravity; the net force remaining is higher for the heavier object and the acceleration is slightly higher (a=f/m). But the gains going downhill are massively outweighed (pun) by the loses at traffic lights and uphills - in both these situations the energy usage is proportional to the mass0 -
The past few years since I've started cycling I've had various bikes of various weights with variously weighted wheels/tyres etc (nothing proper light as yet though) and yes, I agree it makes a big difference depending on the type of riding.
Being into road bikes its tempting to take advice from the fair weather weekend riders forum...a big mistake if you're mostly commuting. Blasting away from the lights 60 times a day takes its toll with a heavy bike with heavy wheels...you'll be wasted by midweek (I was anyhow) and this is where lighter bikes/wheels/tyres can help up to a point.
As for the luggage argument...started with panniers on the hybrid...switched to a carradice for the first road bike (much better)...then bought a rucksack when I needed something to carry a laptop in...and due to getting a bike with a carbon seatpost last november I only ever use the rucksack now. It's perfectly fine especially in winter.
But whats more aero - a slimish rucksack or a carradice saddlebag that sticks out either side of you?0 -
SHOES?! Surely leave under desk? I was extremely glad to not have to commute in shoes. That's a large portion of weight there
The thing is, if the weight is on the bike, it really doesn't matter that much how much it weighs. I've done tours in the past with an all up weight (including me) of 110kg or so (touring bike weight 12kg, 76kg of me, and 22kg of tent and luggage), and once you get up to speed, you're not that much slower than on a road bike.
Even on my normal commute, I'm currently commuting on a bike that weighs 12kg (gaspipe framed Dawes Chevron), and with me at 76kg, and my saddlebag at 5kg, I'm looking at an all up weight of 93kg. Whether it's 93kg or 92.5kg without shoes makes no real difference - it's under 1% of the total weight, which is hardly a 'large proportion'!
You can buy cycling shoes that look like office shoes with spd cleats. Shoes are bulky to be carting around twice a day. I went from rack and pannier to backpack and enjoy the difference. As a previous poster says, the stop start of commuting makes a difference, especially over the course of a week, when thewhole package of rider, bike and luggage is lighter.0 -
SHOES?! Surely leave under desk? I was extremely glad to not have to commute in shoes. That's a large portion of weight there
The thing is, if the weight is on the bike, it really doesn't matter that much how much it weighs. I've done tours in the past with an all up weight (including me) of 110kg or so (touring bike weight 12kg, 76kg of me, and 22kg of tent and luggage), and once you get up to speed, you're not that much slower than on a road bike.
No, it is a lot slower (unless you are either bloody fast on a loaded bike or bloody slow on a road bike!). But it doesn't feel any harder. You just cover less ground. But of course, as with all changes, you do notice it for a short while until you get used to it.
I either use a backpack (quite like the insulation it gives in winter!) or a Carradice Audax. As the weight of that is between the wheels I would expect the impact on handling to be less than that of rear panniers. But unless you are carrying shopping home with you or a computer, I really can't see why anyone would need anything bigger than a Carradice saddle post bag anyway.
And yes - why bring shoes in every day?!
Going uphill, it will be slower. Going downhill, it will be faster (more potential energy to convert into kinetic energy), and on the flat, there is no difference at all. All in, it really doesn't make that much difference. It's not the weight necessarily that slows you down, it's the wind resistance from all the panniers, plus the fact that you'll probably be running heavy touring tyres like Schwalbe Marathons.
No, it does. The time you lose going uphill is tens of minutes (eg over 3000ft per hour down to 2000ft per hour on equivalent climbs, road bike vs loaded tourer - that's a lot if you are climbing 2-4000 feet) - going downhill you claw back a few minutes but less than you expect because of the drag (I managed a maximum speed of 46 mph on my 4200 mile tour of Norway - and that was with a following wind and this in mountainous terrain. Most of the time I was nowhere near this but on my road bike I would have been in the high 40s to mid 50s plenty of times) - as you say, that is down to the wind resistance but one comes with the other.
Of course, I might be a very slow tourer and a disproportionately fast road bike rider but that wasn't what we found from talking to other tourers (or overtaking them!) - virtually the only time we were overtaken was as a consequence of our lengthy lunch breaks! I'd say my touring speed is a good 33% slower than my unloaded road bike speed. That's a huge difference.Faster than a tent.......0 -
Carradice SQR slim / tour, revolutionised the way I look at commuting.
That's it, I have no idea why people commute with panniers, it's overkill.
I used to use a backpack but changed to a Carradice SQR slim which is much less noticable and does not seem to catch the side wind as much as panniers do. I tend to carry wet weather gear, socks and a folded shirt, tools (inner tube, pump, repair kit etc) along with mobile phone, wallet, kindle and often lunch with no problems. I can also fit my laptop computer in and/or papers from the office to read at home. I found that I sweated too much with the packpack, both on the back and under the shoulder straps, even though it was one that held the contents away from my back.0
