Bike Fit
Sutton_Rider
Posts: 493
Take the cost out of the equation. What's the best type of bike fit to eliminate most if not all little niggles, pains and general discomfort , a man with a plum bob, a tape measure and some knowhow or a computer driven system? If its the latter which one? Any recommendations in Lincolnshire, Norfolk, Cambridgeshire area?
0
Comments
-
I think it comes down to the fitter - if the fitter isn't particularly trained properly or sufficiently experienced, then whatever system is used will result in a fit which is unsatisfactory. Adrian Timmis operates outside of your region (Barton Under Needwood) but he is very highly rated and knows what he is talking about (from my experience).0
-
+1 for Adrian Timmis, I had a fit with him in January and haven't changed a single thing on my bike (s - two different sized frames) since. My mate has had two - a Retul at Planet X where the fitter had to abandon the fit after an hour, because the measurements the machine gave were horribly uncomfortable and he didn't have a clue what else to do, and another at a local 'performance centre' where he said he was happy, but the first ride out had to raise the bars because he wasn't comfortable, then fiddled with other bits and pieces so the fit was pretty much a waste of money.0
-
I remain unconvinced about computer-based bike fit systems. I had a fit at WyndyMilla by an experienced fitter and it's easily the best investment I've made in anything cycling related. I just don't think you can beat experience and a good eye.0
-
It depends more on the skill and experience of the person doing the fit. Most people with a bit of research and a couple of weeks of controlled tweaking can get a decent enough bike fit themselves. Only if you have preexisting injuries or do serious mileage at speed would a professional bike fit help more.0
-
Take the cost out of the equation. What's the best type of bike fit to eliminate most if not all little niggles, pains and general discomfort , a man with a plum bob, a tape measure and some knowhow or a computer driven system? If its the latter which one? Any recommendations in Lincolnshire, Norfolk, Cambridgeshire area?
Giuseppe Giannecchini who has regular bike fitting clinics at Artisan Cycles in Much Hadham. He doesn't use fancy lasers or anything. Just experience and a good eye.
Not far from Cambridgeshire http://artisancycles.co.uk/fitting.php0 -
Another vote for Adrian Timmis, worth travelling to get a fit done with him. As well as getting my bike fit spot on the custom footbeds he made for my shoes really have been a game changer for me on long rides. Plus you get an excellent cup of coffee and can stare at all the memorabilia in the shop while you wait.
Travel up and make a weekend of it, you won't be disappointed.http:\\www.thedecliningcyclist.wordpress.com
One mans battle with mediocrity and his declining physical powers.........0 -
This is a very polite and thoughtful thread. I tend against Bike Fit, largely because my cycling pre-dates it and I used my 'old school' methods to set up various friends and my own children - at various ages and stages - and all seem OK with the plum-line and furrowed brow approach.
A turbo trainer helps with the 'good eye' method, as before having one I was getting people to sit on their bike with feet on pedals and one shoulder or elbow on a handy wall.
It is clear even from watching TV coverage of the pro-peloton that few people set their machine up in the same way - even if they are the same height and proportion.
I like to use a basic static fit for seat height, then use the patella plum line for saddle reach, then base stem length on the 'can you see the front hub when on the hoods' method and bar height on comfort and preference.
Cleat position is an odd one and it can take a long time to get right. Luckily, for many riders there are several 'right' positions.
If you are racing, you are probably in a club. Good clubs have a smattering (or more) of wise old rouleurs who will be happy to spend a few miles watching you and make suggestions. They may not be quite the right suggestion, but they will add to your knowledge. Similarly, if the club runs turbo sessions an older and wiser member might have a peep when you're doing a piece and make the odd helpful comment.
If none of that worked, I might be tempted to look at a professional Bike Fit... Just as if after three poor attempts at trying to choose wall paint that didn't clash with my curtains I'd consider paying for the services of an Interior Design Consultant. Or if I couldn't work out a fashion 'look' I'd speak to a personal shopper.
It isn't rocket science and there is rarely a 'right' answer, although there may be one or two wrong ones.
Most of the cyclists I know in the 45-75 age group have never and would never use Bike Fit. Many I know between 35 and 45 either have or intend to. Many of them didn't cycle in their youth and indeed started only in their thirties. They might do the odd sportif, but are not in a club and don't want to join one. Maybe for that group, a Bike Fit makes very good sense.
For many, the kindly eye of an old sweat at the club will be fine - allied to a sense in the rider of what feels right.
These views may elicit dissent, but as in all other matters there is no point. I am right and dissenters are wrong.0 -
This is a very polite and thoughtful thread. I tend against Bike Fit, largely because my cycling pre-dates it and I used my 'old school' methods to set up various friends and my own children - at various ages and stages - and all seem OK with the plum-line and furrowed brow approach.
A turbo trainer helps with the 'good eye' method, as before having one I was getting people to sit on their bike with feet on pedals and one shoulder or elbow on a handy wall.
It is clear even from watching TV coverage of the pro-peloton that few people set their machine up in the same way - even if they are the same height and proportion.
I like to use a basic static fit for seat height, then use the patella plum line for saddle reach, then base stem length on the 'can you see the front hub when on the hoods' method and bar height on comfort and preference.
Cleat position is an odd one and it can take a long time to get right. Luckily, for many riders there are several 'right' positions.
If you are racing, you are probably in a club. Good clubs have a smattering (or more) of wise old rouleurs who will be happy to spend a few miles watching you and make suggestions. They may not be quite the right suggestion, but they will add to your knowledge. Similarly, if the club runs turbo sessions an older and wiser member might have a peep when you're doing a piece and make the odd helpful comment.
If none of that worked, I might be tempted to look at a professional Bike Fit... Just as if after three poor attempts at trying to choose wall paint that didn't clash with my curtains I'd consider paying for the services of an Interior Design Consultant. Or if I couldn't work out a fashion 'look' I'd speak to a personal shopper.
It isn't rocket science and there is rarely a 'right' answer, although there may be one or two wrong ones.
Most of the cyclists I know in the 45-75 age group have never and would never use Bike Fit. Many I know between 35 and 45 either have or intend to. Many of them didn't cycle in their youth and indeed started only in their thirties. They might do the odd sportif, but are not in a club and don't want to join one. Maybe for that group, a Bike Fit makes very good sense.
For many, the kindly eye of an old sweat at the club will be fine - allied to a sense in the rider of what feels right.
These views may elicit dissent, but as in all other matters there is no point. I am right and dissenters are wrong.
^ Basically this.0 -
This is a very polite and thoughtful thread. I tend against Bike Fit, largely because my cycling pre-dates it and I used my 'old school' methods to set up various friends and my own children - at various ages and stages - and all seem OK with the plum-line and furrowed brow approach.
A turbo trainer helps with the 'good eye' method, as before having one I was getting people to sit on their bike with feet on pedals and one shoulder or elbow on a handy wall.
It is clear even from watching TV coverage of the pro-peloton that few people set their machine up in the same way - even if they are the same height and proportion.
I like to use a basic static fit for seat height, then use the patella plum line for saddle reach, then base stem length on the 'can you see the front hub when on the hoods' method and bar height on comfort and preference.
Cleat position is an odd one and it can take a long time to get right. Luckily, for many riders there are several 'right' positions.
If you are racing, you are probably in a club. Good clubs have a smattering (or more) of wise old rouleurs who will be happy to spend a few miles watching you and make suggestions. They may not be quite the right suggestion, but they will add to your knowledge. Similarly, if the club runs turbo sessions an older and wiser member might have a peep when you're doing a piece and make the odd helpful comment.
If none of that worked, I might be tempted to look at a professional Bike Fit... Just as if after three poor attempts at trying to choose wall paint that didn't clash with my curtains I'd consider paying for the services of an Interior Design Consultant. Or if I couldn't work out a fashion 'look' I'd speak to a personal shopper.
It isn't rocket science and there is rarely a 'right' answer, although there may be one or two wrong ones.
Most of the cyclists I know in the 45-75 age group have never and would never use Bike Fit. Many I know between 35 and 45 either have or intend to. Many of them didn't cycle in their youth and indeed started only in their thirties. They might do the odd sportif, but are not in a club and don't want to join one. Maybe for that group, a Bike Fit makes very good sense.
For many, the kindly eye of an old sweat at the club will be fine - allied to a sense in the rider of what feels right.
These views may elicit dissent, but as in all other matters there is no point. I am right and dissenters are wrong.
Or, instead of all that messing about, when you may or may not end up with a decent fit, taking advice from people who may or may not know what they're talking about, you could have just paid a professional in the first place and you're not left wondering.
People spend a fortune on bikes and 'upgrades', yet a decent fit is peanuts compared to the price of say, a decent set of wheels that make next to bugger all difference.0 -
Thats how i setup the wifes bike, got it roughly right and went out for over an hour. Watching her showed the saddle and bars were a little too high but after that and upgrading the brakes she has been fine ever since. No strains or injuries and no complaints.0
-
It depends more on the skill and experience of the person doing the fit. Most people with a bit of research and a couple of weeks of controlled tweaking can get a decent enough bike fit themselves. Only if you have preexisting injuries or do serious mileage at speed would a professional bike fit help more.
This. The technology behind Retul et al is fantastic, but if it's just used to create yet more (albeit technically more advanced) generalised fitting systems, it's being wasted. Ultimately an experienced eye is what is required. What I find most concerning is that new cyclists are being misled into believing that they have to pay out in order to be basically comfortable on their bikes. Many of the 'bike fit wow' threads I read around here seem to be people that didn't bother in the first place and therefore the fitter has made drastic changes, or people that have needed minor changes that probably wouldn't have been necessary had they put the effort in in the first place.0 -
This is a very polite and thoughtful thread. I tend against Bike Fit, largely because my cycling pre-dates it and I used my 'old school' methods to set up various friends and my own children - at various ages and stages - and all seem OK with the plum-line and furrowed brow approach.
A turbo trainer helps with the 'good eye' method, as before having one I was getting people to sit on their bike with feet on pedals and one shoulder or elbow on a handy wall.
It is clear even from watching TV coverage of the pro-peloton that few people set their machine up in the same way - even if they are the same height and proportion.
I like to use a basic static fit for seat height, then use the patella plum line for saddle reach, then base stem length on the 'can you see the front hub when on the hoods' method and bar height on comfort and preference.
Cleat position is an odd one and it can take a long time to get right. Luckily, for many riders there are several 'right' positions.
If you are racing, you are probably in a club. Good clubs have a smattering (or more) of wise old rouleurs who will be happy to spend a few miles watching you and make suggestions. They may not be quite the right suggestion, but they will add to your knowledge. Similarly, if the club runs turbo sessions an older and wiser member might have a peep when you're doing a piece and make the odd helpful comment.
If none of that worked, I might be tempted to look at a professional Bike Fit... Just as if after three poor attempts at trying to choose wall paint that didn't clash with my curtains I'd consider paying for the services of an Interior Design Consultant. Or if I couldn't work out a fashion 'look' I'd speak to a personal shopper.
It isn't rocket science and there is rarely a 'right' answer, although there may be one or two wrong ones.
Most of the cyclists I know in the 45-75 age group have never and would never use Bike Fit. Many I know between 35 and 45 either have or intend to. Many of them didn't cycle in their youth and indeed started only in their thirties. They might do the odd sportif, but are not in a club and don't want to join one. Maybe for that group, a Bike Fit makes very good sense.
For many, the kindly eye of an old sweat at the club will be fine - allied to a sense in the rider of what feels right.
These views may elicit dissent, but as in all other matters there is no point. I am right and dissenters are wrong.
Or, instead of all that messing about, when you may or may not end up with a decent fit, taking advice from people who may or may not know what they're talking about, you could have just paid a professional in the first place and you may or may not end up with a decent fit
FTFY.0 -
. By professional I meant someone who knows what they're talking about and comes recommended, rather than someone who has had a two day Retul course. I mentioned in my first post that a mate of mine has had two fits and still changed things, and recommended Adrian Timmis (as have several others in the thread).0
-
Timmis, like plenty of others like him, is an old racer that has spent lots of time on bikes. He's good, but there are plenty of old guys at cycling clubs that can fit you to a bike in much the same way.0
-
I hear what people are saying about experience negating the need for a proffessional fit, but in my case the opposite was true. I would class myself as a fairly experienced rider (raced as a junior on and off road, always ridden for leisure and pleasure), but after a few years of riding mostly off road I found I was struggling when I returned to road riding regularly and bought a new bike.
Back in the day I was either a 21.5' frame or a 51/52 cm but on buying a nice new compact carbon bike I found the sizing and geometry seemed to have changed a bit while I hadnt been looking! Combined with my aging bones and joints not being as flexible as they once were I found I just couldnt get comfortable eneough to ride for more than 2 - 3 hours, and any changes I made seemed to make it worse.
I needed a fresh pair of eyes and somebody who knew what they were looking for to take a look at my position. As i'm not a member of the local club getting the local sages to look wasnt an option. Adrian at Cadence Sport tweaked just about every aspect of my fit, not by much - my saddle went back and up a cm, he swopped my stem for a slighly shorter one and suggested a different shape of drop bar to give me a more comfortable hand position.
Combined with the shoe footbeds and the adjustments Adrian made to by cleat position it really was the best money i've spent on cycling for years.
The bike really did feel and seem to fit much better, I had the best summer that year on the bike that I'd had for years and really got some good miles and rides in, due in the most part to not struggling with back ache and neckpain after every ride.http:\\www.thedecliningcyclist.wordpress.com
One mans battle with mediocrity and his declining physical powers.........0 -
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19702145#p19702145]Simon Masterson[/url] wrote:Timmis, like plenty of others like him, is an old racer that has spent lots of time on bikes. He's good, but there are plenty of old guys at cycling clubs that can fit you to a bike in much the same way.
Simon have you had a fit with "Timmis"? If you have then you will know that not only has he spent a lot of time on bikes, he also has access to a fair bit of specialist equipment that is probably not available to those old guys at cycling clubs. This equipment (like the variable angle and length stem) lets him try different positions that it is pretty hard (and slow) to do without it (it takes a fair bit of time to try several different length stems). If things are really bad (or you don't yet have a bike and are seeing him before buying one), he has a special bike fitting rig that lets him adjust pretty much everything on the bike to get a good fit. Oh and he has a big selection of saddles that you can try to find a good one. He also has access to video capture and other tools that makes it easy for him to compare changes and explain to you exactly what he is seeing and why he is making a change.
Yes an experienced club mate may be able to help and may come up with a good fit. But with a good fitter you are paying for more than just experience and a good eye.0 -
It would be interesting to see the on bike positions of these guys who say they can achieve a bike fit themselves. As one person mentioned "Most people with a bit of research and a couple of weeks of controlled tweaking can get a decent enough bike fit themselves."
Who wants "decent"? I'd ridden for years in what I thought was a good position. I eventually went to see Giuseppe as part of getting a new custom bike and it turned out my position was "decent". He tweaked it so my position was "right". I felt more comfortable, felt more planted on the bike and so was more confident on technical downhills. I also used to come down with saddle sores. I used to think it was just part and parcel of riding a bike. Turned out my saddle was too high. I've never had them since.
So people are quite welcome to fiddle about for weeks to achieve a "decent" fit. Or for the price of a premium cycle jersey, you could get it done "right" in a couple of hours.
However. Choose your fitter carefully.0 -
Sorry to butt in, has anyone used the Sowerby brothers in Mirfield for a bike fit? They are not far from me and i hadn't heard of them til recently but i'm contemplating having a bike fit myself. Would be good to get some feedback on here first.0
-
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19702145#p19702145]Simon Masterson[/url] wrote:Timmis, like plenty of others like him, is an old racer that has spent lots of time on bikes. He's good, but there are plenty of old guys at cycling clubs that can fit you to a bike in much the same way.
Simon have you had a fit with "Timmis"? If you have then you will know that not only has he spent a lot of time on bikes, he also has access to a fair bit of specialist equipment that is probably not available to those old guys at cycling clubs. This equipment (like the variable angle and length stem) lets him try different positions that it is pretty hard (and slow) to do without it (it takes a fair bit of time to try several different length stems). If things are really bad (or you don't yet have a bike and are seeing him before buying one), he has a special bike fitting rig that lets him adjust pretty much everything on the bike to get a good fit. Oh and he has a big selection of saddles that you can try to find a good one. He also has access to video capture and other tools that makes it easy for him to compare changes and explain to you exactly what he is seeing and why he is making a change.
Yes an experienced club mate may be able to help and may come up with a good fit. But with a good fitter you are paying for more than just experience and a good eye.
Of course he does, and it's a great resource. The point is that in many if not most cases (i.e. excluding special requirements), some basic measurements, and/or a good eye, and dare I say it books, can get you basically comfortable on a bike - 90-95% of the way there, if you will.0 -
A bike fit isn't just about comfort, it's about finding the most efficient set up to enable you to ride to your potential.
After my bike fit I noticed the bike handled better, I could get more speed out of it and I lasted longer before fatigue set in. And it was comfortable to ride.0 -
Thanks guys for all the interesting replies. Before I posted the question I thought most would come down in favour of a computerised fit. That doesn't seem to be what is reflected here. So a man or woman with a plumb bob, a rule and a lot of experience looks like being the best way to go.0
-
. By professional I meant someone who knows what they're talking about and comes recommended, rather than someone who has had a two day Retul course. I mentioned in my first post that a mate of mine has had two fits and still changed things, and recommended Adrian Timmis (as have several others in the thread).
I know someone who had a Timmis fit that didn't work for him. In the end a local shop told him the position was all wrong, made some changes, end of problems. Obviously many are happy with him but then many are happy setting their bike up themselves.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
My wife uses cyclefit. They were the first ones out there to put bike fitting on the map and have invested in time and tech. They use the computer method with a lot of human input. My wife recently revisited them for a pressure mapping to try to solve some saddle issues. The tech that was used didn't exist a few years ago and it worked for her. Cadence always seem to have favourable reviews. You may have to travel. For us the money spent @Cyclefit was an investmentM.Rushton0
