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The Rt DisHon Odious Fat Slug Heath PM

mr_goomr_goo Posts: 3,755
edited August 2015 in The cake stop
Anyone surprised by the news in last the 24 hours? I'm not. At the end of last year I (correctly as now transpires) predicted to my friends that Heath would be revealed as the highest profile child abuser.
Just a shame that yet again another vile creature is 7 feet under long time, before the revelations come to light.
Always be yourself, unless you can be Aaron Rodgers....Then always be Aaron Rodgers.

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  • ballysmateballysmate Posts: 14,790
    Anyone surprised by the news in last the 24 hours? I'm not. At the end of last year I (correctly as now transpires) predicted to my friends that Heath would be revealed as the highest profile child abuser.
    Just a shame that yet again another vile creature is 7 feet under long time, before the revelations come to light.

    We won't bother waiting until any evidence is disclosed then? :roll:
  • mr_goomr_goo Posts: 3,755
    Anyone surprised by the news in last the 24 hours? I'm not. At the end of last year I (correctly as now transpires) predicted to my friends that Heath would be revealed as the highest profile child abuser.
    Just a shame that yet again another vile creature is 7 feet under long time, before the revelations come to light.

    We won't bother waiting until any evidence is disclosed then? :roll:

    Correct. Guilty until proven innocent.

    My wife met him in the late 90s and thought he was a slimey creep. And that is before this news.
    Always be yourself, unless you can be Aaron Rodgers....Then always be Aaron Rodgers.
  • ballysmateballysmate Posts: 14,790
    Anyone surprised by the news in last the 24 hours? I'm not. At the end of last year I (correctly as now transpires) predicted to my friends that Heath would be revealed as the highest profile child abuser.
    Just a shame that yet again another vile creature is 7 feet under long time, before the revelations come to light.

    We won't bother waiting until any evidence is disclosed then? :roll:

    Correct. Guilty until proven innocent.

    My wife met him in the late 90s and thought he was a slimey creep. And that is before this news.

    Well, that's different then. Why didn't you say. Must be guilty. :wink:
  • VTechVTech Posts: 4,736
    Law in this country is finished, there is no longer any such thing as innocent until proven guilty and for that we will always be on the backfoot.

    Heaven forbid anyone here ever gets wrongly accused.
    Living MY dream.
  • slowmartslowmart Posts: 4,039
    Law in this country is finished, there is no longer any such thing as innocent until proven guilty and for that we will always be on the backfoot.

    Heaven forbid anyone here ever gets wrongly accused.

    Does that include Clarkson? :wink:
    “Give a man a fish and feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and feed him for a lifetime. Teach a man to cycle and he will realize fishing is stupid and boring”

    Desmond Tutu
  • mr_goomr_goo Posts: 3,755
    Well obviously I have jumped the gun in all your opinions. Never! you cry.
    We shall see how this one plays out. But I do seem to recall that a couple of years back (during the Saville exposee) there were snippets of news about the cover up of a very senior politician.
    Always be yourself, unless you can be Aaron Rodgers....Then always be Aaron Rodgers.
  • debelidebeli Posts: 582
    I find his political legacy interesting and have read a couple of biographies. He was rather overshadowed (in legacy terms) both by the arrival of Thatcher and his own determination to stay in the Commons.

    I am of the left and found many of his views unpalatable. And although I am pro-EU, I was never the federalist he was. I found that rather too much and still do.

    As to what he got up to in his private life, I have no particular interest but always believed he was probably gay. This was neither confirmed nor disproved in any biography I ever read. He certainly faced some opposition from within the party during his time as an MP, although I assumed that to be bmore because of his modest beginnings than his orientation.

    As to the latest allegations, I find it odd (unusual) that it is whipping up a media storm and unhelpful that we are somehow behaving as if charges are going to be brought against a man who has been dead for several years and had no issue.

    There are certainly still public figures who might usefully be brought to book for disgraceful and harmful abuses of others. I am not sure why we need to spend so much time and sweat on a case that is unlikely ever to be proved or disproved.

    But the Internet disagrees with me....
  • mamba80mamba80 Posts: 5,032
    Edward Heath is dead, he cannot defend himself.
    If there is overwelming evidence fair enough but i d prefer to wait until then before passing judgment.

    imho the only think he tried to bu&&er were the miners, with v. limited success.
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 14,196
    I am much more interested in the cover up than the man himself.
    It is too late for that, although the victims will feel very differently.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • ballysmateballysmate Posts: 14,790
    I am much more interested in the cover up than the man himself.
    It is too late for that, although the victims will feel very differently.

    Very much so.
  • tangled_metaltangled_metal Posts: 4,015
    I'm old. I must be old as I remember a time when crimes of dead men weren't mentioned in the news. Evidence isn't in the public yet so not guilty IMHO until it is presented. But since the offender is dead it will not reach the courts unless those involved in the cover up (if there was one relating to this case) get prosecuted. Then through the cover up the evidence will come out I reckon.

    A man dies he then relies on family to defend his memory. Who knows what is the truth? One person has come forward to claim an offence was committed against him. No matter what is provable or what is b true I feel sorry for that person. If true he's suffered, if not true he's suffering his delusion. Either way it's not good.

    Here's hoping they'll find an MP offender who is still alive and able to defend himself. Until then I reckon we'll get more of these cases I reckon. Conspiracy in Westminster is one certainty though. Trust any MP? I'd check my watch and pockets after shaking any MPs hand I reckon. Of course those course in language and nature might say politicians have all been [email protected] us for years.
  • DeVlaeminckDeVlaeminck Posts: 6,335
    Well there have been accusations against Heath for years, I remember reading stuff linking him to the childrens home in the channel islands and Savile being implicated in that too. Certainly the way Savile (and others) was obviously protected makes it nailed on that he had friends (or at least people he could implicate) in high places. This isn't tin hat brigade stuff - there are plenty of police officers who have come out and said they were told to drop investigations into child abuse in high places.
    AFC Mercia women - sign for us
  • LookyhereLookyhere Posts: 987
    Heath maybe as guilty as sin but where is the evidence?
    however, Bill Wyman gets off with a 13yo, in his 40's, and now sits on the set of Breakfast TV advertising his latest album?
    Dont get it.
  • tangled_metaltangled_metal Posts: 4,015
    That as may be so go back to those investigations if possible. Follow the leads and prosecute those around to defend themselves. There's plenty of resources into historical abuse investigations following Saville so surely all those rumours and cops warned off cases could lead somewhere.

    The Saville case was such an overwhelming situation that it easily merits public interest to get what facts they have out. If this Heath case is true and part of a ring in the seats of power protecting abusers in high places then it needs b investigation and prosecutions. It is public interest, IMHO only, if there is enough evidence that would lead to a successful prosecution if Heath was still alive or there is a prosecution for the covering up of crimes in high places. There's enough clever cops around to root out anything worthy of public interest. In the meantime we cannot know what is true.
  • VTechVTech Posts: 4,736
    The problem most people will have who believe in the legal system is that you are meant to be innocent until proven guilty which is no longer the case.
    The Saville case has done more to discredit the legal and police system as it ever will to credit it.
    Police selling stories and info to media, allowing them to be present at "secret raids" etc etc.
    Releasing peoples information of which I personally know of one, it all adds up to a right mess.
    As a member of the public, it is not my place to know about police investigations, they are meant to be on a need to know basis until a case is put before a court and then when guilty let the cards fall where they may.
    Living MY dream.
  • arran77arran77 Posts: 9,260
    Anyone surprised by the news in last the 24 hours? I'm not. At the end of last year I (correctly as now transpires) predicted to my friends that Heath would be revealed as the highest profile child abuser.
    Just a shame that yet again another vile creature is 7 feet under long time, before the revelations come to light.

    Insider knowledge? :P
    "Arran, you are like the Tony Benn of smut. You have never diluted your depravity and always stand by your beliefs. You have my respect sir and your wife my pity" :lol:

    seanoconn
  • I am much more interested in the cover up than the man himself.
    It is too late for that, although the victims will feel very differently.

    Very much so.
    It's happened again Bally, we agree. :lol:
    Tail end Charlie

    The above post may contain traces of sarcasm or/and bullsh*t.
  • Smokin JoeSmokin Joe Posts: 5,669
    Heath maybe as guilty as sin but where is the evidence?
    however, Bill Wyman gets off with a 13yo, in his 40's, and now sits on the set of Breakfast TV advertising his latest album?
    Dont get it.

    By the time it came out that Wyman had slept with Mandy Smith when she was under age (14 I believe) they had already been married. In such cases it is generally deemed to not be in the public interest to prosecute.
  • LookyhereLookyhere Posts: 987
    Heath maybe as guilty as sin but where is the evidence?
    however, Bill Wyman gets off with a 13yo, in his 40's, and now sits on the set of Breakfast TV advertising his latest album?
    Dont get it.

    By the time it came out that Wyman had slept with Mandy Smith when she was under age (14 I believe) they had already been married. In such cases it is generally deemed to not be in the public interest to prosecute.

    Probably not in the public interest to prosecute a member of the Rolling Stones you mean? i think any other 45yo would find himself in court.
    the "values and public interest" back then were what allowed Saville and many others to carry on on they did.
  • finchyfinchy Posts: 6,689
    The problem most people will have who believe in the legal system is that you are meant to be innocent until proven guilty which is no longer the case.

    I fully support the principle of "innocent until proven guilty", BUT, if you have a legal system that turns a blind eye to certain types of allegation, especially allegations of sex crimes against children, then the gap will be filled in, and the presumption of innocence (in the eyes of the public, not legal system) will be endangered. It's a 2-way street. The public should respect certain legal principles, but in return we should have faith in the system and in this case it's the public that has been betrayed first.
  • ballysmateballysmate Posts: 14,790
    When this story went big this week it was stated that the IPCC was investigating that an investigation was halted because a brothel keeper threatened to denounce Heath as a paedo. This woman has issued a statement refuting any such claim.
    I have no more idea than anyone else if he is guilty or not, but I would have thought that it would have been quite easy for the IPCC to ask this woman if there was any substance to the claim before they went public.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/aug/05/investigation-edward-heath-child-abuse-claims-go-national
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