First road: alloy Defy vs. carbon Defy/Domane

thetub

I've ridden a hybrid for 5 years, but recently moved and now want a road bike for the longer commute.

Planned usage:
- 10mi/15km each way commute
- weekend fitness
- club/sportive in the future
- all year riding (my only bike)

Desired features:
- 105 gruppo
- relaxed geo
- mudguard options
- fit for 6' with 34" inseam

Not fussed about:
- online orders (first road so wanna nail the fit)
- internal cables
- every gram of weight
- rack mount

I'd done all the research for a C2W/cash purchase and narrowed to the Cube Peloton Race, Rose Pro SL 2000 and Giant Defy 0. Couldn't try the Cube (low stock) or Rose (online). Have test ridden the Defy in ML: great fit, comfortable, Ultegra/105 was smooth, guard eyelets, looks smart. Ready to pull the trigger...

Then yesterday I went to a local bike shop who have 2015 models on sale. Defy 0 at £900, or for a bit more cash/C2W+cash, I could get a Giant Defy Advanced 2 £1150 or Trek Domane 4.3 £1350 (or a Domane 4.1 + 105 upgrade). Test rode the 4.1 in 56: also a good fit, hidden mud eyelets, smoother than the alloy Defy, Tiagra not as good so go 4.3 or upgrade.

So...

Will spending a bit more on carbon pay off as I get into the road bike?
Can I get away with running the Defy Adv. or Domane through winter?
Anyone have experience getting full guards onto these?
Do most of you guys just end up using clip-on raceblades etc. anyway?

Thanks!

tjm160

I started with the 2014 Defy 1 two years ago and have since added a 2015 Defy Advanced 1 as the new 'best bike'. The difference is like day and night. The ride is so much smoother than the Aluxx Defy 1 (now the winter/wet bike). The Advanced is much lighter and feels nicely stiff, yet soaks up any harshness in the road. Despite finding the Shimano 105 gearing perfectly adequate on the Aluxx, the Ultegra on the Advanced 1 is a most welcome step-up (although I understand that with the Shimano 5800 105 and 8600 Ultegra, the quality gap has greatly narrowed, with weight now the only real difference). The gear levers don't need to be moved anywhere near as far and the changes are fast, quiet and smooth. The mechanical disc brakes are adequate, but nowhere near as good as the hydraulics on my mountain bike and I will very likely look to upgrade to hydraulics in due course. Overall, a cracking ride and welcome step up from the Aluxx Defy 1.

The BUT; I'm very torn for wet/winter use. The Aluxx Defy lends itself to it, with dedicated mudguards and Aluxx feeling so much more robust and better suited to the grit and grime of winter. The Advanced doesn't even have mudguard fixings. I've purchased Crud Roadracers, but haven't tried them yet. Braking wise, despite the mechanical disc brakes on the Advanced not living up to expectations, they are still far better than the rim brakes on the Aluxx. I believe the upper end of the Aluxx 2016 models ('0' and possibly '1') are going to include disc brakes. If so and so long as still having the dedicated mudguard support, I would lean towards going for a 2016 Aluxx, based on the use profile you have given.

I hope this helps and best wishes with your deliberations.

dj58

You have ridden the Alu Defy and the Trek carbon bikes and say that you found the carbon a smoother ride, lots of riders start off with an aluminium framed bike as a first bike and then move onto a carbon framed bike, only you can decide which you prefer as you say it will be your only bike.

So yes as you get more into road cycling you would get the benefit of a carbon frame, particularly on longer rides and those two makes are well regarded as endurance bikes, you can use a carbon bike all year round.

The Defy Adv. 2 has disc brakes which a lot of riders on here recommend for winter/wet weather use, however the carbon Defy Adv. 2 does not have mudguard mounts. I don't know whether anyone has successfully fitted a set of full type mudguards to one of the carbon framed disc braked Defy models, I doubt it would possible as the frame does not have seat or chain stay bridges.

Giant do make specific mudguards for the aluminium framed Defy bikes, though some riders on this forum have had problems with premature failures, though they do a reasonable if somewhat noisy job.

I don't know anything about the Trek hidden mudguard mount system, or whether Trek make a specific mudguard for the Domane, have you researched that?

w00dster

As a rider of a Domane for my wet weather rides I can confirm mudguards fit it with 25c tyres. Mine is a 2013 Domane. I know later carbon Domane's are a squeeze though. Trek / Bontrager do have their own range of Mudguards. Some useful links for you...
http://www.bontrager.com/model/09150
viewtopic.php?f=40004&t=12995723
http://classiccycleus.com/home/pdw-full-metal-fenders/
http://www.discountcyclesdirect.co.uk/catalog/product.php?CI_ID=15557&O_ID=2

Before buying I'd ask the LBS to set them up with guards and the tyre of your choice. If the 105 upgrade is for full 105 (including brakes), then thats a decent buy.
You won't go wrong with either the Defy or the Domane. Both very good bikes. If the choice was mine, I wouldn't care about it being Alu or Carbon for your riding. My choice would be about whether it can take at least 25 tyres and full guards. Once you get into cycling longer rides more frequently you'll probably do what most of us do and buy a more expensive carbon bike with your other bike being used for commutes and winter rides. I would estimate that about 80% of my club have alu Defy's or Domane's as winter bikes, first bikes/commuters that are now used for this role.
For my commuter I actually prefer to have bigger tyres so I'm unable fit full guards. I'm not interested in speed for this bike I just wanted comfort and I have to admit its awesome for this role. I have 34c tyres running at a nice low pressure (about 50psi currently). For the wider tyres I can only use a clip on ass saver - but this is fine for my commutes (7 miles approx).

thetub

Thanks for the comments. I reckon the Defy Adv. is out of the running as the Domane's scope for fitting Bontrager/PDW mudguards puts it ahead.

w00dster wrote:

Once you get into cycling longer rides more frequently you'll probably do what most of us do and buy a more expensive carbon bike with your other bike being used for commutes and winter rides. I would estimate that about 80% of my club have alu Defy's or Domane's as winter bikes.

That was my original thought: get a reliable sub £1k alloy now, catch the bug, buy carbon later. However, I've done the cheaper bike thing once, already got the bug, and I doubt I'll have the £2-3k in the next few years (house move, etc.) to add a worthwhile second bike — tl;dr: whatever I buy is locked in for a few years!

I guess that's why the discounted Treks are suddenly appealing: spend more now while I can afford it.

w00dster

In that case the 4.3 will be a good buy especially for the price you mentioned. The stock 4.3 isn't full 105, you may at some stage want to upgrade the brakes to 5800 calipers but thats not something which is urgent but I'd do it before the Autumn turns wet.
Stock wheels are ok, these where on one of my bikes but I swapped them for Race Light TLR, but the standard TLR are decent enough wheels. I would see if they could do you a deal with some new tires though. The R1 the bike comes with are an ok training tyre but for normal riding and commuting at this time of year I'd be looking at the R3.
If you could stretch to it the R4 320 is a very good tyre, but expensive. Definately not a commuting tyre, only for faster rides really. (There are cheaper tyres out there, I'm just keeping with the Trek / Bontrager look of the bike)
But before leaving the shop explain to them about how important fenders/guards are and that this is the reason you are buying the 4.3, if possible get them to fit them. A few people have had difficulty in fitting them to the newer bikes.
Good luck with the purchase, let us know how you get on with it.

thetub

Thanks for those specific pointers w00dster — tyres and brakes are on my list for sure, wheels next summer.

I double-checked with LBS and the discounted bikes are coming in at:

Domane 4.1 (Tiagra): £1400 > £1150
Domane 4.3 (105): £1700 > £1350
Domane 4.5 (Ultegra-ish): £2000 > £1600

The 4.3 is hitting a sweet spot, full 105 (except brakes), nice orange design details. The 4.5 is very sleek though — matte charcoal with red details, Ultegra shifters and derailleurs — but it tips over £1500 and I think thats scoring a subconscious negative point. Objectively, is the extra £250 for the 4.5 worth it?

skmark

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19645353#p19645353]thetub[/url] wrote:

Thanks for those specific pointers w00dster — tyres and brakes are on my list for sure, wheels next summer.

I double-checked with LBS and the discounted bikes are coming in at:

Domane 4.1 (Tiagra): £1400 > £1150
Domane 4.3 (105): £1700 > £1350
Domane 4.5 (Ultegra-ish): £2000 > £1600

The 4.3 is hitting a sweet spot, full 105 (except brakes), nice orange design details. The 4.5 is very sleek though — matte charcoal with red details, Ultegra shifters and derailleurs — but it tips over £1500 and I think thats scoring a subconscious negative point. Objectively, is the extra £250 for the 4.5 worth it?

I bought the 4.3 (2015) last Aug when they first came out......£1,350 is a great deal, I only managed £1,500 at the time.

I've absolutely loved the bike and have only really made the following upgrades/changes because I can and I love a bit of fettling (who doesn't) ;

Wheels - Mavic Kysirium S
Bars / Stem Easton EA70 (wider and further reach for a better fit)
Bar Tape = Lizardskins DSP Black
Saddle - Faric Scoop Shallow Pro
Elite Sior Carbon Bottle Cages

On the future maybe/to-do list is the following;

Brake Calipers - 105
Chainset - 105
Seatpost - Easton EC90

I love the Black/White with Orange accents too.....go for it, you won't regret it.