Hurtwood Sale
Snooze
Posts: 28
We were riding over at Peaslake today and when we got back to our cars somebody had left a note on our windscreens about the sale of a substantial proportion of the Hurtwood to a private buyer and the concern that the current access could be restricted to marked Bridleways and Footpaths. Has anybody heard about this/know more about it?
The note was from a group called Save the Hurtwood and they seem to be campaigning to delay the sale to private owners and lobby to get a public ownership package put together.
The note was from a group called Save the Hurtwood and they seem to be campaigning to delay the sale to private owners and lobby to get a public ownership package put together.
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Pretty hard to curtail access to public rights of way.......Currently riding a Whyte T130C, X0 drivetrain, Magura Trail brakes converted to mixed wheel size (homebuilt wheels) with 140mm Fox 34 Rhythm and RP23 suspension. 12.2Kg.0
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The Rookie wrote:Pretty hard to curtail access to public rights of way.......
The public rights of way i.e. the bridle ways and footpaths aren't the issue as I understand it, the issue is that currently there is a right to roam in the Hurtwood which includes mountain bikes and that a new owner could reverse or restrict this.0 -
They can only restrict it if there is no 'right', if the current owner has decided to permit it and the new owner decides not to then that is that, of course if the existing owner wanted to they could put a covenant on it to continue the current practice.Currently riding a Whyte T130C, X0 drivetrain, Magura Trail brakes converted to mixed wheel size (homebuilt wheels) with 140mm Fox 34 Rhythm and RP23 suspension. 12.2Kg.0
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I believe it's already happened - there are some trails that start on land that is accessable & ends on privately owned land (Evian for example, crosses a boundary in with the final section).
A few months ago, a group of us were shouted at and asked to leave by an angry well spoken lady from her Land Rover, making comment about how us bikers were destroying the ground, before subsequently wheelspinning off up the fireroad. I guess it's different when it's your land to do as you please.
Having ridden it for the first time in months this weekend, there is still no/very limited signage to suggest it's private, no angry toffs this time though
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The Rookie wrote:Pretty hard to curtail access to public rights of way.......
As said - there are a huge number of trails which aren't ROWs, they just exist. So yes, access could easily be revoked. Pretty worrying actually.
There's a news article about it I read yesterday, didn't say anything else though.0 -
Background info on current public access to the Hurtwood can be found here:-
http://friendsofthehurtwood.co.uk/
According to the flyer that was left on my car there was an article in the May 2015 edition of the Shere, Peaslake and Gomshall Parish Magazine in which Ms Handa Bray, Lord of The Manor, Shere Manor Estate says "As the Hurtwood is common land, the sale will not affect the public right of access (on the footpaths and bridleways) which is protected by law - but we do not know exactly how it will affect the wider public access as it is enjoyed at the moment all over the land. That will depend on the purchaser and we can't give you any details about that as we don't yet know ourselves"
i.e. the current access we enjoy to the Hurtwood sounds like a "permission" that a new owner could revoke, hence the concern and my original question asking if anybody had more information as the flyer was the first I'd heard about a sale and I ride there 2-3 times a week.0 -
Hob Nob wrote:I believe it's already happened - there are some trails that start on land that is accessable & ends on privately owned land (Evian for example, crosses a boundary in with the final section).
A few months ago, a group of us were shouted at and asked to leave by an angry well spoken lady from her Land Rover, making comment about how us bikers were destroying the ground, before subsequently wheelspinning off up the fireroad. I guess it's different when it's your land to do as you please.
Having ridden it for the first time in months this weekend, there is still no/very limited signage to suggest it's private, no angry toffs this time though
Winterfold Forest (where Evian is) is private land (and always has been as long as I have been riding over there), although I am not sure of the exact boundaries are (I thought all of Evian was on private land). As you say there is very little signage and also all of the car parks around Winterfold are signed as Hurtwood Control which you would think gives you the same access as in the Hurtwood. I have been told that the owner is anti mountain biking and have heard several stories about riders being shouted at and chased off the land.0 -
Yes, most of Winterfold is owned by Jim McAllister, who is rather against any sort of open access. That said, there are a number of trails on his land which do exist, although get trashed periodically - Three Amigos, Switchbacks etc. I thought his land was largely bordered by the top of Barhatch Road, Hound House Road and a line somewhere down Evian.
Handa Bray owns the Hurtwood, and it's that land that's up for sale. If that is to McAllister then I'd suggest you can say goodbye to virtually all of the trails!0 -
Did you just copy and paste my post? :?0
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It's a spammy thing. Contains an img file or something. If you 'Quote' the post you can see it.njee20 wrote:Did you just copy and paste my post? :?
Nick explained it once but I'm still confused. I found this:
http://webmasters.stackexchange.com/que ... n-my-forumI don't do smileys.
There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda
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Parktools0 -
Weird! Gone now anyway.0
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If access is dodgy now then will it get worse? Or could the new owner allow more freedom?
To be fair if it is private land with no right of way then the owner can do what he wants. They could have other plans for the land which aren't going to work with free access, such as shooting or a nudist resort.
There is some law which protects which protects unofficial access which has been freely allowed for many years. The British Mountaineering Council used this to protect access to an area of a cliff at Wintours Leap in Gloucestershire which was on private land with no right of way but access had been unchallenged for decades.Transition Patrol - viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=130702350 -
Access on the part that's for sale is fantastic, the rest of it is dodgy, so obviously the risk is that it all becomes dodgy.
Great shout on the protection laws though, that's good to know!0 -
I think you have to be able to prove that the landowner knew about the access and it has to have been going on for a sufficient period of time. Also, if there are signs saying the path is permissive it won't be able to be made a legal path, or if the paths are closed for a day or. More a year0
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They had to prove that the access had been regularly used for a long time. It's up to the land owner to prove that they tried to prevent or restrict access during that time.Transition Patrol - viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=130702350
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I reported it.njee20 wrote:Weird! Gone now anyway.I don't do smileys.
There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda
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Parktools0 -
More information on Pedal and Spokes Facebook page:-
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Pedal-an ... 11995780600 -
More information on the Hurtwood Ranger site here.
https://hurtwoodranger.wordpress.com/20 ... -for-sale/
It appears that bike access will be solely at the discretion of the new owner(s)0 -
Well of course it will, that's the whole issue! :?0
