I want to do a 100 mile ride, but. . .

Sutton_Rider

Sorry JGSI that's not an option. I would sooner get the bus.

fudgey

I also get a sore arse after an hour or so, i have done a couple of 85mile rides and this year will crack the ton.
I bought a selle italia slr flow a couple of months ago but still get discomfort.

I have only been out on the bike twice this year, and last week done 40 miles but got cramp after 26 and struggled lke hell to get home... But the cramp took my mind off my arse at least!

I have recently put a 15mm shorter stem on with zero degree angle which has moved the bars back and up slightly.
Didnt notice much benifit from that tbh. Its 18mm less reach and 12mm higher.

I am 180cm, 12st and ride a colnago acr in a 52S.

I did feel quite stretched on the bike hence the shorter stem. On my last ride i also dropped the seat a few mm so i could pedal with my heels on the pedals without stretching.

Going to go out tomorrow so will see how i get on as it is, failing that i have 25mm of spacers under the stem so could try dropping that next but i though that you wernt supposed to have too much weight on your arms?
My mate commeneted that i do 'sit' on the saddle, where as he says that he 'perches'.

Maybe i need to get a stem of similar length but with a -8 degree angle and lower it?

Bobbinogs gave me this link which may help some people?
http://alex.phred.org/stemchart/Default.aspx

Sutton_Rider

It sounds like you and I Fudgey are going down the same road. I've also tried an SLR it's great for numb nuts, but not good on the sit bones. I'll be interested in a follow up after your ride. Although the saddle is flat I've just notched the nose down one to try it today following comments on this thread. I have the stem pointing up at the moment, I might try flipping it. I think I may also be sitting on the saddle rather than perching on it.

Dandelionclock30

Your not wearing underpants under your shorts/tights are you? they can cause discomfort.

Sutton_Rider

Omar Little wrote:

Your saddle looks to be pointing up a bit, try leveling it and see if that improves things

I did try it just a notch nose down today and did 43 miles, it does seem a little better, but I wouldn't want to take it any further. Thanks Omar.

olake92

It look to me like your saddle is too far forward and tilting up, bars rotated up too much and the reach is too short. Obviously, I've not seen you on the bike and have no idea what your overall physical condition is like. However, my idea of what a bike fit 'should' look like doesn't mix with your own setup. Personally, I would try (providing your saddle height is correct) to level off and lower your saddle a bit and move it back so it is more like 5-10cm behind the BB. Your effective saddle height would stay the same but you're just rotating it around the BB. This would lengthen the reach too. Don't worry about lowering the bars too much as the longer reach accounts for this.

For me, the no. 1 culprit looks like the fore/aft position of your saddle along with the reach; the saddle seems very far forward and the handlebars are not further forward to accommodate this. I think moving the saddle back would encourage you to tilt your pelvis more. Perhaps a bit of stretching of the hamstrings, glutes and back would facilitate this as well.

That's just my take on it.

EDIT: You said you feel stretched out already, how stretched out is that? Can you post a pic of you on the bike? I find that going from a reach of 56 to 57cm feels HUGE, but after a few rides I'm good.

Sutton_Rider

Sorry what's a BB?

fudgey

Sutton Rider wrote:

Sorry what's a BB?

BB = bottom bracket. The bit the cranks are attached to.

Just about to go out, but only going to be a 20 odd miler so will see how i get on.

NeXXus

A bike being "the right size" when you had to swap the stock stem for one 40mm shorter, slammed saddle and bars rotated back would definitely point in the direction of the bike being the wrong size!

Sutton_Rider

The bike is the correct size. The bike shop took measurements, the bike fitter confirmed it. It is without doubt the correct size. I didn't have to have the shorter stem I wanted it, as it felt more comfortable. Also when on the hoods the handlebars hide the front axle from view. The saddle is more or less in the middle of its adjustment range and was adjusted for KOPS. As I rarely ride on the drops the bars are rotated to a comfortable ridding position, but should the mood take me I can go on the drops.

fudgey

I am not sure how scientific this is but i made no adjustments since my last ride
24 miles in 1h 30m
After a while i started feeling like my arse was going numb. Got slight tingling, not pins and needles in my left foot too. It was a flat ride so every now and again i got out the saddle to stop the tingling.
I was a bit uncomfortable so was trying to move about and see what felt better.
At one point i placed my forarms on the bars to really lean forward and that actually put very noticable less weight on my arse.

Once i got home i took a couple of the spacers out from under the stem, i cant take any more out without cutting the steerer tube down. So the bars are 10mm lower but keeping with the shorter stem.
Also my handle bars were rolled back so i have set them parallel now. My seat is kevel with a spirit level and almost as far back as it can go. Just changed seat post recently for one that can be adjusted better for tilt but has zero setback.

Only been for a very short ride up the road and it feels different, will try and ride to work next week and see how i get on.
Before as i rode it today.



After



Cheers

Sutton_Rider

Sound like your making progress Fudgey. Nice looking bike too. My old bike is mostly white, what a sod to keep clean, pick up a bit of oil on the rag and next thing it's all over the bike.

Not sure if you've had a bike fit and are now moving away from those settings. The important thing is that you're comfortable. I've tried all sorts of positions, but always end up back at the bike fit settings.

My other half is a podiatrist and I mentioned about your tingling in your left foot. She said it depends where on the foot it tingles, it could be a lot of things causing it, but a trapped nerve was high on the list, maybe in the lower back. That's why it felt better shifting to those other positions.

dj58

Did you ever ride your bike with the original 100mm O.E. Giant stem? As others have said you appear to have to much weight on the saddle with your present set up. Is it that you have short torso or arm length, or are you not very flexible in the lower back?

Sutton_Rider

I rode the old bike with a 100 stem, which I changed to a 60 after about 600 miles, but I've not ridden the Defy on a 100. During the fit if felt wrong with the 100 the 60 was much better. I would say I'm fairly flexible for someone of my age. I have measured all the angles and they do seem to be right. I've tried to simulate a longer stem while riding and I don't like it.

fudgey

Sutton Rider wrote:

Sound like your making progress Fudgey. Nice looking bike too. My old bike is mostly white, what a sod to keep clean, pick up a bit of oil on the rag and next thing it's all over the bike.

Not sure if you've had a bike fit and are now moving away from those settings. The important thing is that you're comfortable. I've tried all sorts of positions, but always end up back at the bike fit settings.

My other half is a podiatrist and I mentioned about your tingling in your left foot. She said it depends where on the foot it tingles, it could be a lot of things causing it, but a trapped nerve was high on the list, maybe in the lower back. That's why it felt better shifting to those other positions.

Thanks. It is a pain to keep clean, i was hoping the mudguards would have done more tbh!
I have not had a bike fit yet, considering one tho!

I am not that flexible really, had physio on my knee a while back and i said about my left hip that is very tight. He laughed at how inflexible it was. The stretching i was doing has heleped i just need to make sure i keep it up.

Yesterday i felt numb, last time it was discomfort. I have not had the tingling for a while but it did ease with standing.
Its quite annoying as all my mates just get on their bikes and ride but i always seem to be uncomfortable.

When i was lent right forwards yesterday as i said i feel there was less weight on the saddle but i dont know how long i could stay in that position for.

My commute to work is about 40 mins so may not be long enough to get a good idea if the adjustments make much difference. I will report back with updates if you dont mind me posting on your thread.

dj58

Sutton Rider wrote:

I rode the old bike with a 100 stem, which I changed to a 60 after about 600 miles, but I've not ridden the Defy on a 100. During the fit if felt wrong with the 100 the 60 was much better. I would say I'm fairly flexible for someone of my age. I have measured all the angles and they do seem to be right. I've tried to simulate a longer stem while riding and I don't like it.

Have you always ridden bikes in an upright position? You say that you don't like riding in the drops, why is that, does it cause you physical discomfort? Try your 60mm stem in the negative position, if you have not already done so, also you can try placing one of the 10mm stem spacers above the stem and see if that helps any. The idea being to try and take some of your weight of the saddle.

Sutton_Rider

I took up riding last July at the age of 62, so I guess the answer is yes, I've always ridden in an upright position. When I first got the old bike it had a 100mm stem in the neg position. In an attempt to get comfortable I first switched the stem to pos and later changed it for a 60. Last week I did a 55 mile ride (on the Defy), apart from the sit bones hurting so were my arms. If I transfer more weight to the arms that may become worst. That's why I think the best compromise may be gel pad shorts as apposed to just foam. I see what you're getting at, as I said earlier I tipped the saddle nose down one notch and did a 44 mile ride on Saturday, no arm issues and only very slight tolerable sit bone pain. Next time out I'm going to simulate different handlebar positions and see if I can see a way forward with that.
Thanks everyone for your input.

dj58

Sutton Rider,

Buy the gel pad shorts and try them, you have nothing to loose. As a new cyclist even if you are flexible there will be a period of adjustment for you to get used to a road bike position. It may be that you just need a longer adjustment period and longer regular distances to allow your body to adapt.

If your arms ache is this because you tend to keep them in the same position for a lot of the ride? Also do you use a relaxed grip, try riding in the drops for longer periods. Just keep making slight adjustments to your handle bar position and go for a test ride, until you reach a balanced position with your weight between the saddle and bars. You may even find that eventually you will need to increase the length of the stem.

triban

Try scretching your piriformis.

http://roadcyclinguk.com/how-to/conditioning-for-cyclists-with-jo-mcrae-part-one-piriformis-exercise.html#AMX85pqxIyQscJZC.97

and

http://www.spine-health.com/wellness/exercise/stretches-and-exercise-sciatic-pain-piriformis-syndrome

i've had trouble in the past and these stretches really helped me, it felt at times like i was stting on a golf ball, but i occassionally do these stretches and its made a big difference to my comfort. only takes a few minutes - its worth a try.

fudgey

Ok, just got home from work. Done 14 miles in 48 mins av 17mph. Only my 4th time on the bike this year and was going as hard as i could.
I found that with the bars in that position above i was definately leaning forward more and found that i had to make a conscious effort to bend my elbows and lean forwards.
I noticed my biceps, not ached but i could feel them and my shoulders, and slight neck stiffness now from being on the drops on a decent.
My arse however was slightly uncomfortable but not numb like on sat. I could still slight tenderness to my sitbones from sat too.
I need to ride in to work tomorrow as i took the bike in the car as it was icy this morning and im not hero enough to risk another broken ankle!
So fingers crossed there is no frost tonight.

Sutton_Rider

Thanks for the info Triban, I'll give it a go see what happens.
Sounds like your working it out Fudgey, Good luck with it tomorrow. I did a 50 today, nice in the sunshine. I to tried stretching to hold on the further most point on the hoods, it didn't seem to make allot of difference. I did ask one of the experienced guys in our group if he thought I was ridding to upright. He said "Yes", but went on to say the more I ride the better I would feel about having a longer stem. Time will tell. I guess when you get older the body doesn't want to adapt quickly.

fudgey

Sutton Rider wrote:

Thanks for the info Triban, I'll give it a go see what happens.
Sounds like your working it out Fudgey, Good luck with it tomorrow. I did a 50 today, nice in the sunshine. I to tried stretching to hold on the further most point on the hoods, it didn't seem to make allot of difference. I did ask one of the experienced guys in our group if he thought I was ridding to upright. He said "Yes", but went on to say the more I ride the better I would feel about having a longer stem. Time will tell. I guess when you get older the body doesn't want to adapt quickly.

I dont think its just your age, i was 34 last month and it still takes ages to adapt!
I will keep the setup as it is for now and see if like you say i can adapt to it after more seat time.
Its a slow process, so stick with it. I havnt done 50+ miler for a long time, so you are doing well!!

fudgey

To add, i rode to work this morning and got a colleague to have a go on my bike.. He uses a 56cm frame and is just slightly shorter than i am and said that overall it feels pretty similar to his bike position, but maybe my seat was a touch higher than his.

I didnt feel too bad this morning, slight tenderness to sit bones still but my neck was ok. But didnt spend much time on the drops.

One thing i find is that i have to push my butt backwards onto the rear of the saddle, possibly due to the lower position as i find myself wanting to sit more upright still.

Sutton_Rider

Fudgey:
As you've said you haven't done much ridding this year. So your bum will need to get back in shape. Were you OK last year? Just as a matter of interest what shorts do you use? The problem is I have to ride for 2 hours to see if any adjustments have made any difference, its time consuming.

fudgey

Last year i done just over 1700 miles in the bike.
Biggest ride of 85 miles, dine that twice.

Id say all of that was in discomfort!
I got the bike in may, and changed the saddle in october i think after doing around 1300 miles.
At the mo i wear DHB roubaix vaeon bib tights, my shorts are BBB bibs.

I agree on the seat time, hopefully will get a long ride in in saturday. And as i am now in a different position again i need to get used to it.

dj58

http://www.britishcycling.org.uk/knowle ... ortably--0

nick-gti

what about a different seat post along the line of a thudbuster type suspension post or even a decent carbon post. finding the right pair of bib's made a big difference to my comfort levels, but I suffer more from numb bits then saddle sore.

Sutton_Rider

Interesting article DJ thanks.
The Defy 1 has a carbon post Nick. I agree finding the right bib is vital, also expensive!
I'm going to buy a bib with a gel pad, when they have my size in stock. Then over the next few weeks / months try and get comfortable in a more aggressive position, it may help when its warmer and some of the layers can come off.

Thanks Guys.

nick-gti

do you use any chamois cream?

Sutton_Rider

No - Its not a sore / friction pain. Its pressure on the sit bones.