Fork Up Grade

iwilldoit

My sons Whyte 604 27.5" front Suntour XCM 30 suspension are utter crap, they are around 2 1/2 months old and keep filling with water from ridding not washing, got in touch with the bike shop and they have arranged to have them sent back for a full strip down, or work us a deal on a better pair of forks which shouldn't be hard !!

As he is only 10 what sort of forks would you recommend we look at, he has been XC racing last year and doing quite well, I don't want to break the bank as dad wants some Reba's, Sid or Revalations for his bike, it's a shame as he has a straight stem and mine is tapered and different wheel sizes.

The Rookie

Some waterproof grease under the seal works wonders on the XC range, but yes, its a crap fork anyway especially if it's not an HLO.

Does the Whyte have a 44mm head tube so could take a tapered with a new lower headset bearing?

I'd get some decent used ones off ebay (funded by selling whatever they supply as 'new'!), the older Fox are pretty good and the arch is high enough to clear a 650b tyre as well, otherwise a Suntour Raidon or Epicon to budget is probably the best you can do.

iwilldoit

The Rookie wrote:

Some waterproof grease under the seal works wonders on the XC range, but yes, its a crap fork anyway especially if it's not an HLO.

Does the Whyte have a 44mm head tube so could take a tapered with a new lower headset bearing?

I'd get some decent used ones off ebay (funded by selling whatever they supply as 'new'!), the older Fox are pretty good and the arch is high enough to clear a 650b tyre as well, otherwise a Suntour Raidon or Epicon to budget is probably the best you can do.

Got to be honest on the head tube I think it's 1 1/8" but will measure it.

Tried the waterproof grease, we went out nearly every day over the Christmas break after around 4-5 days he thought the lock out was on, when I looked it wasn't but they were very stiff, when I got home I took the bolts out of the bottom of the forks and out the water poured again, I think they were hydraulically locked.

The Rookie

I suggest you read up on headset standards, 44mm is just one type of a 1 1/8th headset.

what sort of waterproof grease are you using? Red Rubber grease is the only one that I have found comes close to being really waterproof, but then it was designed for boat trailer wheel bearings!

iwilldoit

It's Silkolene Pro RG2 waterproof grease and it is red.

Thanks for info on the Stem it's all a bit new to me would the 44mm be the OD of the bearing, but will do a search on the net, Sheldon might have the answer for me.

The Rookie

44mm, otherwise know as ZS44, zero stack or semi integrated, the bearing sits pretty much inside the headtube in a 44mm diameter hole, the lower one can be replaced by an 'old fashioned' style external cup to cope with a tapered steerer.

Stem is the bit holding the handlebars on by the way, presume you mean the steerer tube?

iwilldoit

Stem is the bit holding the handlebars on by the way, presume you mean the steerer tube?

Yes your right, I'm more used to enduro motorbikes

larkim

Son's 2011 XCM forks were so well filled with water over Christmas that they literally froze solid! Grease, and storing the bike upside down (simply to let the water out the way it got in) sometimes worked for us, until we gave up on trying.

iwilldoit

larkim wrote:

Son's 2011 XCM forks were so well filled with water over Christmas that they literally froze solid! Grease, and storing the bike upside down (simply to let the water out the way it got in) sometimes worked for us, until we gave up on trying.

Yes know what you mean, they told me at the LBS to wash it upside down, I have put some cling film around them washed all the bike then washed the top of the forks carefully afterwards, I can't understand how the seal/the seal they use doesn't keep the water out.

larkim

Interesting comment - to be honest, I'm surprised / amazed that (given the forces / vibration / context of MTB'ing) seals on any range of forks keep their durability! I suppose fundamentally the construction of XCM forks means that there is always some slight play in the stancions compared to the fork body, and over time a rubber seal is bound to perish a little.

I took them apart about 18 months ago with a view to seeing what I could do, and had so much trouble screwing them back again that I swore never to do it again!

iwilldoit

larkim wrote:

Interesting comment - to be honest, I'm surprised / amazed that (given the forces / vibration / context of MTB'ing) seals on any range of forks keep their durability! I suppose fundamentally the construction of XCM forks means that there is always some slight play in the stancions compared to the fork body, and over time a rubber seal is bound to perish a little.

I took them apart about 18 months ago with a view to seeing what I could do, and had so much trouble screwing them back again that I swore never to do it again!

These forks are only 2 1/2 months old, I have ridden off road motorbike enduro for around 20 years, my knock about bike good old trusty Honda XR never had fork seals in 12 years of some fair abuse and those seals have to hold air and nearly 500ml of oil in them, but as you say it's most probably the tolerance between stantion and slider I will have to check on the next draining :shock: Any rate fair play they are poor forks to say the least

WishIstartedYounger

Hello. Not one to normally post but was interested to read your post so took the time to register. I had also bought my son a Whyte 604 and was very disappointed with the fork and the lack of any practical use it offered a 45kg lad (you get what you pay for at this price). I bit the bullet and ordered a reba solo air tapered fork (50% discount on chain reaction and no I'm not promoting them) with a Hope type H ec44/40 bottom headset on a bit of a gamble knowing I could return.The whole setup fits like a glove without raising the front end at all. Just playing with the right psi at the moment but its nice to see the fork actually working. Oh and the bonus is it is nearly 1kg lighter. Quite an investment over the original price but considering my own spend relieves the guilt somewhat and now provides him with a proper useable mountain bike.

iwilldoit

WishIstartedYounger wrote:

Hello. Not one to normally post but was interested to read your post so took the time to register. I had also bought my son a Whyte 604 and was very disappointed with the fork and the lack of any practical use it offered a 45kg lad (you get what you pay for at this price). I bit the bullet and ordered a reba solo air tapered fork (50% discount on chain reaction and no I'm not promoting them) with a Hope type H ec44/40 bottom headset on a bit of a gamble knowing I could return.The whole setup fits like a glove without raising the front end at all. Just playing with the right psi at the moment but its nice to see the fork actually working. Oh and the bonus is it is nearly 1kg lighter. Quite an investment over the original price but considering my own spend relieves the guilt somewhat and now provides him with a proper useable mountain bike.

I was heading down that route but to be honest we couldn't really justified new forks for him so looking as sh ones but nothing was turning up in the ball park figure we wanted to spend, so I contacted the LBS who we bought it off and they said leave it with us and we will see what we can do, they got back to me and they could supply and fit some Suntour Radion air forks for a very good price, I have to be honest I didn't want another set of Suntour forks but several people on here have said they are a lot better than the old ones so we going to have them fitted this Saturday.

The LBS is Stan's Cycles in Shrewsbury and to be honest their service has been excellent.

iwilldoit

Just an update sons new forks fitted look very smart, while I was there I mentioned there seems to be a bit of play in the BB and fair play to Stan's cycles they fitted a Shimano XT BB as they hadn't got one the same as the bike came with Foc so big thank you to them.

WishIstartedYounger

Always good to get the help of a good bikeshop. Hope he enjoys the ride. Upside of the new rockshox forks is that my son is now faster and has more control, downside is I gotta keep up !