Wheel guys. Verdict on this weight weenie type wheel.

Spartacus1981

A friend of a friend has bought these for a build. Now obviously if I was clever I'd wait for him to ride them and give me his full impression, but let's imagine that might take a while. It might not, but it might.

Company in Germany (radsporttechnik_mueller), and they also have an eBay store. They seem to make some ridiculously light wheels for what don't seem like unreasonable prices. These are what I'm taking about.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231422141619

Or these, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Laufradsatz-R ... 35e242cf28

Or these, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Laufradsatz-R ... 35e242cf23

As you can see these are pretty damn light. Tune hubs, or extralite (doesn't mean a great deal to me), cx-ray spokes, ryde rims (never heard of). Hoping someone can step in.

Riding style. Enjoy long hilly rides but also fast blasts (not fast to some ok). Weight fluctuates between 72- to 75kg max.

My one concern being these rims don't seem particularly wide when looking at more recent trends, and I wonder how comfortable, (and more importantly) safe they would be.

Feel free to chip in.

eddiefiola

The Tune build would be cheaper from here http://superlight-bikeparts.de/Tune-FRM-BOR373-Tune-BOR373-Leichtbauraeder-Lightweight-Race-wheel-Tune-wheels.

Never used either and at 95kgs I'm unlikely too

letap73

I am no wheelsmith but I personally would be very sceptical about these wheels which are probably built with weight in mind but not most likely considering reliability in the variable weather and road conditions you get in Britain.

The tune hubs are probably very light weight which would suggest a lack of robustness - mass saving at the centre of the wheel in all likelihood is pretty pointless anyway.

I have no major issue with the spokes except they are far more expensive and no better for the average rider than other Sapim spokes.

The Ryde rims I never hear about, however, I have my doubts as to whether they are better or even as good as the H Plus Son Archetypes.

All in all I probably would not buy them - you are better off trying someone like Ugo, Cycleclinic, Just riding along, Strada etc who will build robust wheels ( with greater mass) which they will stand by if anything should go wrong.

For example:
http://www.justridingalong.com/justridi ... elset.html
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Handbuilt-Ryd ... 6b39a1d6ca
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/20F-24R-Pacen ... 6b380137d9

rolf_f

letap73 wrote:

All in all I probably would not buy them - you are better off trying someone like Ugo, Cycleclinic, Just riding along, Strada etc who will robust wheels ( with greater mass) which they will stand by if anything should go wrong.

Cycleclinic will make some only slightly heavier for about £300 if I remember correctly. I made some myself for £200 in components. Even if mine don't last as long as the German ones, I can replace a lot of rims for the price difference!

stevie63

The Cycle Clinic offers a similar wheel built to approx 1375g for £350 or so. Surely this would be a better choice:

http://wodenonline.myshopify.com/collections/road-rim-brake-wheelsets/products/ryde-pulse-sprint-wheelset-from-1435g

cycleclinic

Ryde say there is a weight limit (rider + bike) I assume of 100kg but I think a 90kg limit is more sensible but that me being conservative.

I have done many wheelset with these rims and they good rims. Don't expect mega miles from the brake track if used in mixed weather, it is thin (I would not use them in the kind of winter we are having much unless you like replacing rims) and some tyres are a tight fit other are less tight but some will have trouble with all tyres on these rims. Stan's rim tape is a good idea with these rims as are tubeless tyres. Overall a good rim but not one for heavy riders or wet winters.

As for weather that german offering is a good one it does depend on the quality of the wheelbuilding. The components are fine for dry summer riding especially those wheels with the extrlite hubs (188g for a pair!!!!!) - they won't like the wet at all - it does depend on well it is all put together.

trailflow

OP what about these ? http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-shi ... 52481.html

I have a set. No complaints so far. They were a little out of true but that can be easily fixed. Hubs seem very smooth. I am also 75kg and these wheels hold up fine. They are currently at £198.27 with delivery. Import duty will be around £20/30.

Manc33

AliExpress... but I have had £200 ones that were 1350g and they were so flimsy I ended up going back to my stock wheels (that weigh 2100g).

For me to go back to those shows how flimsy the light ones were! I am all about saving weight myself but I can't even use wheels like that, they bend when cornering, you can make the rim touch the brake pad with one little finger pushing it.

Those eBay ones are all 24/28H as opposed to 20/24H.

How much more stiffness do you get from "adding" 4 spokes per wheel?

ugo.santalucia

Manc33 wrote:

Those eBay ones are all 24/28H as opposed to 20/24H.

How much more stiffness do you get from "adding" 4 spokes per wheel?

20%

Manc33

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Manc33 wrote:

Those eBay ones are all 24/28H as opposed to 20/24H.

How much more stiffness do you get from "adding" 4 spokes per wheel?

20%

On the front wheel. Back wheel its 17% :P

To me the silliest thing is cutting down spoke count, in terms of it making the wheel perform a lot differently and the extremely minimal weight saving. I know its weight saving "at all costs" with weenieism, but I can't stand riding on flimsy wheels and would rather they were "heavy".

I know you'll say "We told you all this when you were looking at cheap light wheelsets" :oops:

Now I have to say the same, either spend £600 or have flimsy wheels. The easiest route is just have heavier wheels, but sometimes you can't say that.

I don't see the point unless you're literally racing, even then you'd never race on wheels like those ones I was using anyway. Slowing down for corners because the rim might touch the brake pad, pfffffffffff. The fact that they come with warnings like "Up to 85KG rider" is off putting enough.

trailflow

Manc - Maybe your wheels were under tensioned ? are they carbon or aluminium ? also whats your body weight ?

cycleclinic

4 spokes added to a mavic open pro wheel will increase lateral wheel stiffness by a different ammount to adding 4 spokes to a a wheel with a realy stiff rim like the Kinlin XC-279.

If a wheel is flexing alot it is beacuse the components used in the wheel not just the spoke count are not "compatible". I ride a 24 spoke rear wheel that does not flex when I push hard. The frame flex's though.

So if Manc33 want's a stiffer wheel you need a wheel with a stiff rim to begin with wide helps alot here and then a hub that gives good bracing angle. Have those two things a 24 spoke rear wheel can be very stiff indeed.

I build stiff wheels that I would not want to see rider over 85kg on (light rims do not have a thick nipple bed). Why because a heavier rider might see problems. Weight limits are not limits they a rought guide at best to give an indication of which riders should not see any problems and which may see some maybe. They are normally set low for this reason.

A flexible wheel with a 85kg weight limit is just a bad wheel. putting a weight on it does not rectify that.

Spartacus1981

Thanks to everyone who's responded. Some great feedback and things to consider. To be honest I'd be lying if I said I knew about tensioning spokes or how spoke count affected lateral stiffness etc so I won't even go there. Most importantly the wheels would be safe to ride on for extended periods (mainly in nice weather), and durable. I do realise that some of these super light things are not likely to be as durable. Especially if one was to hammer about on them in the conditions we've been having recently. I wouldn't be racing on them anyway. Well maybe my mates : )

Previously I had been looking towards a set built on the Pacenti SL23's due to the wider rim so perhaps the Cycleclinic ones on eBay would be a good option for me. I had a set of Dura Ace C24 1380gm wheels and rode them into the ground pretty much. They were great wheels and never went out of true once.

How do those Novatec hubs hold up for high milage ? And has anyone tried the Schwalbe One (non-tubeless) clincher tyres on the SL23 rims ? Have the 25mm size and wondered what they'd be like to get on.

cycleclinic

Novatec A291/f482 SB-SL hubs are a bit better than the more common SB version. Think of them a cheap and light race day hubs nothing more nothing less. They will do high miles thoughs if you stick to drier roads than we have at the moment. Use them now and I have no idea how long the bearings would last but they are not intended for the very wet road and nearly constant rain we are having at the moment.

Other hubs which are heavier and have bigger bearings last longer, Think Novatec A171/F482 or Miche Primato.

I am currently using the Schwable one Tubeless 25mm tyres on my Pacenti SL23 wheelset (mine has Royce hubs they have big bearings). Mounting was not difficult but they come up at only 24mm. They seal up easily with a track pump. No CO2 needed. I used Zefal sealant but I am sure other worked. and Stans tape and there tubeless valves. Ride quality with 80psi front and 90psi rear is good. Grip is decent too. In fact for a clincher tyre they are good.
From what ugo has posted and other mine seems to be a common experience. They also have not cut yet. Each tyre is 330g though so not exactly light.