Is it worth buying an xc race style frame?

Ferrals

I'm beginning to feel that a) my bike is a touch too big for me and b) that as my interest is in xc and xc racing my 'trail hardtail' may not be the best thing for the job.

In terms of sizing, the issue I have is that to get of the back of the bike my arms are almost straight which means i have limited control (suggesting the reach could do with being a touch less? but as I already have a 50mm stem i don't want to go shorter). I also (don't laugh ) sometimes struggle dismounting on uneven ground and topple over!

The frame is (according to a bikerader review of the whyte 905 which I think shares the same frame as the 901) about 2kg. I'm not sure if that is heavy for an alu frame or not? the review suggests it is (http://www.bikeradar.com/mtb/gear/category/bikes/mountain-bikes/hardtail/product/review-whyte-905-14-47992/), while carbon frames are half the weight the cost penalty means buying one of those is unlikely.

clearly having a 66.5 head angle the handling is very different to an xc frame but i don't mind that, while I have to carve wide lines around tight swithcbacks and it wanders a touch on steep climbs I can cope with that and for general riding its great fun.

The biggest issue I have (or think i have being a bad workman!) is that the longish travel (130mm forks) mean I find the front end quite high even with no spacers, a low 10mm rise bar and 0deg rise stem. my bars are only marginally (inch or two) below the saddle. Which means I sometimes feel i want to be lower when putting the power down. Would a more xc position actually be faster or is it really just preference?

njee20

Might be, might not be.

There will be places it'll be better, and places it won't. No one solution. New frame is drastic - you could change your cockpit set up first and for far less money. Does sound like it may be the wrong size though. Drastically so if you can't dismount without falling over :?

The Rookie

Do you have an offset seatpost, if so you can shorten the cockpit by 20-25mm using an inline.

What size frame (seat tube and effective (horizontal) top tube lengths and how tall are you with what inside leg?

2Kg isn't very light for an aluminium frame, although modern ones are heavier than older ones due (partly) to the CEN test, for example my Carrera (06 - 16") frame was 1735g the latest equivalent (2012 - 18") is now 2.15Kg.

The frame geometry isn't ideal for XC racing even if it fitted, also your 130mm forks will be quite a lot heavier than something around 100mm, you'd be better off with a flipped stem, but as your stem is so short anyway, it won't make much difference.

Ferrals

Yes the seatpost is offline by 20mm. I pedal seated a fair bit though so would rather have the saddle in the 'right' position than have the saddle too far forward to reduce cockpit.

Assuming geo hasnt changed from 2014 to 2015 then top tube is 618mm (24.3 inches), seat tube is 455mm (18inches). I'm 5'7, I think my trouser leg is 29inches. I did measure heel to crotch the other night, cant remember but i think its about 32 inches. I just measured my straight arm length (centre of fist to shoulder and that is 23 inches approx (done discreetly in office!))

The Rookie

So you have a medium frame and are well below average height? I have the same trouser inside leg (and therefore the same arm length as in 99% of the population the two are tied), am a little taller (5'9") and ride a 16/17", frame is too big really, but not massively so. My last bike was ETT of 620mm, offset post (20mm) and 80mm stem (only reason I swapped from 100mm which was fine for seated riding was to make the front end a little more responsive for manualling etc)

Not sure what impact you think moving the saddle forward 20mm (pretty much the TT length difference between frame sizes) on the correctness of the pedaling position, many bikes have inline seatposts.

Ferrals

The Rookie wrote:

So you have a medium frame and are well below average height?

Who are you calling short!
Thanks, yeah I had a feeling that might be the case frame size wise (and in fact I know remember when i used to ride i used 16/17inch frames). I used the KOPS method to set my saddle fore/aft position recently, which meant, as I mentioned in another thread, that doing the elbow on saddle nose, stem to bar thing, my fingers barely reach the top cap.

I guess the thing now is for me to decide whether I actually want to change it or just lump it for what it is and put the saddle forward.

I guess if I do switch, the sooner the better as I'll get more money for the frame while its newer and 'bang on trend'!

Ferrals

The mrs went chicken oriental when I mentioned the concept of a new frame, however, if I can sell current frame and forks and a few extras for £500-600 to pay for new forks and extras I can conceivably credit card £500 on a more xc hardtail frame.
The requirements are:
Lightweight (sub 2kg current frame weight).
27.5 wheels
Internal or at least not down tube cable routing
16-17 inch frame
Designed for 100mm travel forks
Not a ridiculously steep head angle (coming off a whyte 901 with 66.5 deg ha I think something around 69 would be perfect.

Any suggestions as I'm struggling - the only thing I've found is a scott scale alu frame which has down tube cabling.

The Rookie

Nothing wrong with down tube cable routing on an XC frame, in fact it's superior to top tube routing - have you considered WHY you don't want it?

Think of the benefits, lighter weight, stiffer cable outer for better shifting and no silly downhill inner to outer entry for water to run into.

Not sure if you are asking for Frame only suggestions or a whole bike?

Ferrals

Frame only. I have light wheels and XT brakes, and run 1 by 10 with an expander and a relitviely new x9 rear mech so have all I need. My thought was if I could sell my old frame and forks to afford a pair of SID's (I tihnk £400 from CRC) a new bb and headset, and new cable etc. then I could credit card a frame. Its sort of speculative though as I'd need to find a buyer for my frame and forks a the right price first.

I don't like the mud issue with downtube routing.

cooldad

Makes no difference whatsover. Your mech is the same level anyway.

The Rookie

What mud issues? mud only causes an issue where the inner goes into an outer, on a downtube routed cable that is on the chainstay just by the rear deraileur, I NEVER had an issue on mine in 4 years. That includes the ride when it came back over 2.5Kg heavier due to mud accumulation everywhere else!

You don't need to spend anywhere near that, a Carrera 2003-2008 is a nice lightweight option, circa 1750g, has a 44mm headtube so will take a tapered or plain steerer and will take 650B as long as you are running 1x gearing, a good clean one will cost you £35. Or go for a Chinese CF frame at circa 1150g for about £250-300.

Ferrals

yeah i guess I've only had downtube mounted cables that had the old-school 'lots of sections of cable outer' style.

the light bicylce carbon frames look interesting. Shame the on-one whippet carbon is 26in or I'd ahve been tempted by that as I'm still wary of chinese brand carbon (I know its irrational as most carbon comes from similar factories).

The Rookie

My carrera had a short section of outer from lever to top of downtube and a short section from chain stay to rear mech, there was a plastic guide on the BB shell but that was never an issue.

The Whippet is pretty lardy for a CF frame to be honest.