Reach difference between flat bars and drop bars?
After a lot of tinkering over months, I discovered that my 57cm frame with drop bars is a bit too reachy, but on flat bars - it feels perfect. I have also got a 48cm frame where it is perfect with drops, but on flat bars it does not have enough reach!
This might sound silly, because in general no one ever puts flat bars on a road frame, but it is something that is barely discussed, or it gets cries of "Just get a commuter bike" or other such stuff.
My lower back is so bad I pretty much have to be on flat bars, there isn't any option where thats concerned and I use a Ritchey adjustable stem with it set as high as it goes.
So then what exactly is the reach difference these days - now we have those long brake hoods?
Back in the 80s and before, no bike had brake hoods like that, you could literally only fit your thumb there. Now the drops are miles further forward because of the extension to the hoods. I swear to god I never see anyone talking about this on here, or anywhere, or about the flat bar difference. Maybe because there isn't any one answer but there is a ballpark figure.
I estimate it to be 13cm between drop bars and flat bars - which is one hell of a lot of reach difference since everyone's reach from stem to sit bones is under 100cm. A 13cm difference is a 17% reach difference for me. So if you swap to flat bars, you're automatically going to need to be sat 13cm back! The stem never went up or down, it only went back (regardless of the fact that it causes you to be sat more upright). You're making the distance between the handlebars and the saddle less.
I ended up on a 50mm stem on my Triban 3 with drops and it still didn't fix it. :roll:
I am selling my carbon frame
it was perfect with drops on it, but with flat bars, no chance. Back on my Triban (57) now and its so much more comfy (on flat bars).
I measured the reach exactly, on the 48cm frame on flat bars the reach is 740mm to a certain area on my saddle, then I measure on the Triban frame (57cm) and that distance is now 755mm - with it feeling perfect on the reach. Thats also with the saddle on the Triban right in the middle of the clamp, on the 48cm it was about 1cm back from that. So really its created 25mm more reach over the 48cm frame.
I bet you if 100 people went to 100 bike shops for a road bike and said "I will be using flat bars on this" they wouldn't think 'This guy now needs to be on a bigger frame', or would they?
The first rule about flat bar reach is you do not talk about flat bar reach!
Now, if that difference is 13cm then what does that equate to in terms of actual frame size difference? If a 57 is perfect on flat bars and a 48 feels the same reach on drops there's the answer - 9. So if you were on a 60cm on flats, if you put drops on, that frame would need to be a 51cm frame. Unreal.
This might sound silly, because in general no one ever puts flat bars on a road frame, but it is something that is barely discussed, or it gets cries of "Just get a commuter bike" or other such stuff.
My lower back is so bad I pretty much have to be on flat bars, there isn't any option where thats concerned and I use a Ritchey adjustable stem with it set as high as it goes.
So then what exactly is the reach difference these days - now we have those long brake hoods?
Back in the 80s and before, no bike had brake hoods like that, you could literally only fit your thumb there. Now the drops are miles further forward because of the extension to the hoods. I swear to god I never see anyone talking about this on here, or anywhere, or about the flat bar difference. Maybe because there isn't any one answer but there is a ballpark figure.
I estimate it to be 13cm between drop bars and flat bars - which is one hell of a lot of reach difference since everyone's reach from stem to sit bones is under 100cm. A 13cm difference is a 17% reach difference for me. So if you swap to flat bars, you're automatically going to need to be sat 13cm back! The stem never went up or down, it only went back (regardless of the fact that it causes you to be sat more upright). You're making the distance between the handlebars and the saddle less.
I ended up on a 50mm stem on my Triban 3 with drops and it still didn't fix it. :roll:
I am selling my carbon frame
it was perfect with drops on it, but with flat bars, no chance. Back on my Triban (57) now and its so much more comfy (on flat bars).I measured the reach exactly, on the 48cm frame on flat bars the reach is 740mm to a certain area on my saddle, then I measure on the Triban frame (57cm) and that distance is now 755mm - with it feeling perfect on the reach. Thats also with the saddle on the Triban right in the middle of the clamp, on the 48cm it was about 1cm back from that. So really its created 25mm more reach over the 48cm frame.
I bet you if 100 people went to 100 bike shops for a road bike and said "I will be using flat bars on this" they wouldn't think 'This guy now needs to be on a bigger frame', or would they?
The first rule about flat bar reach is you do not talk about flat bar reach!
Now, if that difference is 13cm then what does that equate to in terms of actual frame size difference? If a 57 is perfect on flat bars and a 48 feels the same reach on drops there's the answer - 9. So if you were on a 60cm on flats, if you put drops on, that frame would need to be a 51cm frame. Unreal.
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Very odd post Manc!
What are you trying to achieve here?
If you completely change the setup and geometry of a bike, the setup and geometry of the bike will be completely changed. This is hardly a surprise. Looking for a quick figure to tell you the conversion between a road bike with drop bars and a road frame with flat bars is pointless. Any figure will be of no use to anyone. There are too many variables. Stem length, bar reach & hood position on the drops and the stem length, bar rise/sweep and length of the flat bar.
What you could do is figure out the reach YOU want from a reference point (the BB is probably the most sensible) to the hand position on a flat bar but anything else is pointless.0 -
Ai_1 wrote:Very odd post Manc!
Not unusual though...0 -
Particularly since just rotating your hand 90 degrees from the flat bar position to the hoods extends your reach, by a little under 5cm in my case, even if you don't otherwise change hip angle or wrist pronation.0
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Just do what we used to do in the late 70's early 80's; flip up your drop bars so the drop is now at the top. Retro cool.Big Red, Blue, Pete, Bill & Doug0
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:shock: Absolutely baffled by this post :shock:0
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No, they'd look more than a little confused and then sell you a hybrid because that's what you want.Manc33 wrote:I bet you if 100 people went to 100 bike shops for a road bike and said "I will be using flat bars on this" they wouldn't think 'This guy now needs to be on a bigger frame', or would they?0 -
If I got a hybrid, I would be in the exact same situation if I ever wanted to put drop bars on it - needing a smaller frame.
Isn't it down to the makers of flat bars to produce flat bars for road bikes that end up about where hoods do on drops?
They should make both, so you have the option. The option would say something like "Direct swap". Change the bars on your bike without changing your bike.0 -
Manc33 wrote:They should make both, so you have the option. The option would say something like "Direct swap". Change the bars on your bike without changing your bike.
I look forward to seeing the Manc33 bike brand in the near future with this exciting feature - this time next year, Manc33, you'll be a millionaire!
But seriously, the number of people who want to swap between drops and flats is so small as to be of zero interest to the monster that is the bike industry.0 -
True, but they think we are all racing or riding up mountains.
Not one person I know takes part in road bike racing - but everyone I know owns a bike.
Every bike made with drop bars is made with racing in mind.
Its kinda silly. Its like Ford making only cars that are made for racing.0 -
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Manc33 wrote:Not one person I know takes part in road bike racing - but everyone I know owns a bike.
And do they want to change between flats and drops on a regular basis?Manc33 wrote:Every bike made with drop bars is made with racing in mind.
Utter ****ocks - I've several bikes with drops that are not in the least bit made with racing in mind. (edit - x-post with Veronese68 and that lovely Longstaff!).0 -
You continue to baffle.Manc33 wrote:If I got a hybrid, I would be in the exact same situation if I ever wanted to put drop bars on it - needing a smaller frame.
Isn't it down to the makers of flat bars to produce flat bars for road bikes that end up about where hoods do on drops?
They should make both, so you have the option. The option would say something like "Direct swap". Change the bars on your bike without changing your bike.
Why is it up to anyone to cater for your relatively unusual modification preferences?
You could go to a bike designer and say:
"I'd like a bike for fast road riding equipped with drop bars, here are my dimensions"
You would get a design A with suitable frame geometry.
Equally you could go to them and say:
"I'd like a bike for fast road riding equipped with flat bars, here are my dimensions"
You would get a design B with suitable frame geometry.
The geometry of design A and design B would NOT be identical.
If you want a frame to do both jobs it will be compromised in one or both configurations.
You're asking that handlebar manufacturers provide a product that compensates for deficiencies in frame geometry caused by you procuring the wrong frame for your purposes. When using a frame for a purpose other than that which it was designed and sized for, you'll generally end up with compromises or deficiencies. That's the downside of making do.
I recently converted my slightly oversized cyclocross bike into a TT bike (don't laugh!) in order to do some training in the TT position and find out if I can ride comfortably on extensions and a forward saddle position. I didn't go into that expecting the frame would be suitable or expecting that someone else should have figured out the geometry for me. I had a look at the figures, it looked feasible so I tried it and it's actually worked out much better than I expected.
If you want a flat bar bike. Buy a flat bar bike or buy one which you have determined can be suitably converted. If you want to convert a bike you bought and sized as a drop bar bike, accept you bought the wrong bike. Figure out if it can be made to work and if not, sell it on and buy something that will do the job.0 -
Okay.....I'm finished trying to make rational arguments.Manc33 wrote:True, but they think we are all racing or riding up mountains.
Not one person I know takes part in road bike racing - but everyone I know owns a bike.
Every bike made with drop bars is made with racing in mind.
Its kinda silly. Its like Ford making only cars that are made for racing.
I've marked a couple of errors in your post in red.
This is all nonesense. Drop bars are not pretentious racing wannabe accessories. They're simply the most versatile and comfortable bar configuration for many purposes from touring to commuting to fitness riding and also for road and cyclocross racing. In my experience, most people who switch from flat to drop bars on a properly fitted bike, never want to go back. Flat bars are simply not as comfortable or versatile for most purposes where low speed manoeuverability is not the primary objective.
Dammit - I've gone and tried to talk sense to you again! :roll:0 -
After a lot of tinkering over months, I discovered that my 57cm frame with drop bars is a bit too reachy, but on flat bars - it feels perfect. I have also got a 48cm frame where it is perfect with drops, but on flat bars it does not have enough reach!
57cms and 48cms?
So two completely different size frames?
How about buying the right size of bike for the you, and equipping it with the bars you like?
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A lot of nonsense Manc33... give it a cutleft the forum March 20230
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