Cytech Courses?.

www777

Hi

Interested in doing the Cytech courses that they have on offer and further a career in the cycle trade.
Just after any advice or knowledge if they are worth doing/any good?.

Thanks.

Matthewfalle

I looked at these a while ago and the advice I got from here and people in the trade was yes, very worthwhile indeed - if you can, do it. Best way to get a professional qualification.

Only a few places do them (I think offhand that there are two centres with about three locations each - do a Google, all will become clear) so check that there is somewhere convenient to do the course before you set your heart on it.

As an aside, other courses by other providers are available - do a search on here for my original post and you'll see the other suggestions.

StillGoing

Depends what you want it for. I looked at setting myself up in retirement as a small cottage industry doing a bit of servicing, repairs and builds for a small section. I didn't want a business that would evolve into something that would take over my life.

I can do everything already but don't have a qualification. I spoke with a Cytech qualified dealer about the courses and realised it would cost £1,800 just to get a bit of paper that says I'm competent to do what I already know plus the costs of two weeks of travelling back and forth. The trouble is, with your public liability insurance, if something goes wrong, even if it wasn't of your doing, the insurers are going to be reluctant to back you without that bit of paper that says you're competent. My contact also told me that unless you're a YTS, it isn't a pass or fail course and some of the numpties that attend shouldn't be let anywhere near a bike, but still get their certificate at the end.

So, if like me, you just want the bit of paper that says you're competent, it's a lot of money to waste. If you just want to learn how to do things for yourself, there are easier and cheaper ways of doing it. If you want to get in the trade, then I'd find a job with shop that pays for their staff to go on the courses.

lpretro1

Try the City & Guilds course at 'The Bike Inn' at Spalding

StillGoing

lpretro1 wrote:

Try the City & Guilds course at 'The Bike Inn' at Spalding

The Cytech qualification seems to be the one that most now recognise. C&G has lost much of its status.

mikenetic

philthy3 wrote:

lpretro1 wrote:

Try the City & Guilds course at 'The Bike Inn' at Spalding

The Cytech qualification seems to be the one that most now recognise. C&G has lost much of its status.

The C&G course curriculum was overhauled 3-4 years back, and is now very close to Cytech. It had got out of date, but when I did the 10-day C&G over the course of several weekends it was pretty decent. Even included a weekend of wheelbuilding. I think both C&G and Cytech have additional advanced modules for things like disc brake systems, advanced wheel building, suspension systems. Probably electronic shifting now as well.

One thing to be aware of is that it is properly examined, with timed evaluated sessions. We had one guy who didn't complete the course, poor fella couldn't deal with the pressure of working under the clock.

StillGoing

Good job it wasn't threading integral cables!

lpretro1

The C&G is way more practically based than the Cytech and the standard at Level 2 is higher imo

StillGoing

lpretro1 wrote:

The C&G is way more practically based than the Cytech and the standard at Level 2 is higher imo

Have you done both C&G and Cytech Technical then? If not, how can you comment that C&G is a higher standard and more practically based. In a lot of business, C&G qualifications have lost their status, probably thanks to watered down NVQs. In the days when apprenticeships were around, C&G had some merit. I'll grant you the C&G course is almost 50% cheaper and has the advantage that you can spread it over several weeks 2 days at a time. But if insurers are recognising the Cytech qualification more, (I only have the word of the few dealerships I've spoken with) then it makes sense to go with Cytech if you're looking at a business and the associated risks with public liability.

http://www.cytech.training/courses/technical-two/

http://www.cycletraining.co.uk/index.php?pg=106

mikenetic

philthy3 wrote:

lpretro1 wrote:

The C&G is way more practically based than the Cytech and the standard at Level 2 is higher imo

Have you done both C&G and Cytech Technical then? If not, how can you comment that C&G is a higher standard and more practically based. In a lot of business, C&G qualifications have lost their status, probably thanks to watered down NVQs. In the days when apprenticeships were around, C&G had some merit. I'll grant you the C&G course is almost 50% cheaper and has the advantage that you can spread it over several weeks 2 days at a time. But if insurers are recognising the Cytech qualification more, (I only have the word of the few dealerships I've spoken with) then it makes sense to go with Cytech if you're looking at a business and the associated risks with public liability.

http://www.cytech.training/courses/technical-two/

http://www.cycletraining.co.uk/index.php?pg=106

Looking at the Cytech course, the combined scope of their technical 1 & 2 is almost identical to what I covered within the C&G 1 and 2. Hub gears are an exception, but I imagine given the scope of the courses that will cover setup and indexing, rather than stripdown and rebuild.

Also, I can't see why C&G wouldn't be accepted by insurers. I can understand why insurance might be easier for Cytech, as it has a relationship with ACT (Association of Cycle Traders) so there are no doubt insurance tie-ins. However, it's not like C&G is some fly-by-night operation.

lpretro1

There is no formal requirement within the bike trade for ANY qualification - there are many good mechanics out there who've never been in the classroom in their lives. We are fully insured with no problems. Whilst I haven't undertaken the full Cytech course -didn't need to with C&G already - I have looked fully at the course syllabi. I also had some personal experience at the Level 3 and was no impressed either. A lot of the first part of Cytech is computer based - in fact they push this as a selling point - which I was not impressed with myself - personal opinion of course. Hence my comment about practical nature of course. At the end of the day holding a qualification to me is always better than not and goes a way to helping customers feel you have a given level of competence. The OP was asking for opinions and I gave mine from experience

StillGoing

mikenetic wrote:

philthy3 wrote:

lpretro1 wrote:

The C&G is way more practically based than the Cytech and the standard at Level 2 is higher imo

Have you done both C&G and Cytech Technical then? If not, how can you comment that C&G is a higher standard and more practically based. In a lot of business, C&G qualifications have lost their status, probably thanks to watered down NVQs. In the days when apprenticeships were around, C&G had some merit. I'll grant you the C&G course is almost 50% cheaper and has the advantage that you can spread it over several weeks 2 days at a time. But if insurers are recognising the Cytech qualification more, (I only have the word of the few dealerships I've spoken with) then it makes sense to go with Cytech if you're looking at a business and the associated risks with public liability.

http://www.cytech.training/courses/technical-two/

http://www.cycletraining.co.uk/index.php?pg=106

Looking at the Cytech course, the combined scope of their technical 1 & 2 is almost identical to what I covered within the C&G 1 and 2. Hub gears are an exception, but I imagine given the scope of the courses that will cover setup and indexing, rather than stripdown and rebuild.

Also, I can't see why C&G wouldn't be accepted by insurers. I can understand why insurance might be easier for Cytech, as it has a relationship with ACT (Association of Cycle Traders) so there are no doubt insurance tie-ins. However, it's not like C&G is some fly-by-night operation.

I'm not suggesting C&G is a fly-by-night operation, but it does seem to have fallen behind the Cytech qualification and probably due to the very reason you outline.

lpretro1 wrote:

There is no formal requirement within the bike trade for ANY qualification - there are many good mechanics out there who've never been in the classroom in their lives. We are fully insured with no problems. Whilst I haven't undertaken the full Cytech course -didn't need to with C&G already - I have looked fully at the course syllabi. I also had some personal experience at the Level 3 and was no impressed either. A lot of the first part of Cytech is computer based - in fact they push this as a selling point - which I was not impressed with myself - personal opinion of course. Hence my comment about practical nature of course. At the end of the day holding a qualification to me is always better than not and goes a way to helping customers feel you have a given level of competence. The OP was asking for opinions and I gave mine from experience

Yes I agree, there are plenty of cycle mechanics out there that have never obtained a written qualification and are equally as adept as someone who has. Probably more so in a lot of cases. Standardisation for qualifications has obviously not occurred to anyone so we end up with a selection and pot luck whether your insurers recognise it in the unfortunate event of a claim.

migrantwing

I also looked into a Cytech and City and Guilds qualification for bike maintenance a while ago.

A job came up at Halfrauds and I noted that they required either one of these qualifications. I already know most there is to know about bike maintenance (I could do with some more knowledge regards wheel building perhaps). The problem was that they were not willing to help pay fully or partly for my training. At £1800, yet being employed for minimum hours at minimum wage (I believe the position was for 12 hours per week) what motivation did I have to shell out all that money, which I would be reluctant to, even if I had that kind of pocket change? Unless I end up working for a team at the TDF or Giro, when am I EVER going to make that money back and/or find employment for more than minimum wage? There is no incentive whatsoever. I thought that skilled people with qualifications earned more money than unskilled workers. Seemingly not.