Disc brakes vs Campag Veloce & pedals

schlepper

As a newbie, I've a few questions I'm going to try to roll into one post:

- I'm looking at the Genesis Equilibrium as an all round bike. For more or less the same money I can go for the disc brake option but with Tiagra groupset, or Campag Veloce. Heart is saying Campag, head is saying disc brakes. Any thoughts from those with more experience which will suit me better?

- My riding will be a mix of a relatively short commute (c7miles each way), club runs, pootling with kids. I want to get SPDs, especially for the more serious road riding. What are the views on the double-sided mountain bike pedals vs just SPDs?

Thanks

Simon Masterson

The choice mainly comes down to preference - I like Campag, but either option will work perfectly well. For many, it seems to be about the lever shape and shifting style; though even this I definitely would not prioritise over disc brakes - if you are dead set on having them.

As for SPDs, not sure I understand the question, but the double sided ones are fantastic for road cycling, particularly commuting in traffic. Some find that having a larger platform (as on the single sided ones) seems to improve comfort, whereas others do not.

schlepper

Simon Masterson wrote:

...
As for SPDs, not sure I understand the question...

sorry, to clarify, what I meant was, I'm tempted by the double sided ones, for just the reason you said about traffic etc. It was whether that pay off is worth it, if I am doing longer road rides, might I be better off just having proper road SPDs?

ugo.santalucia

Double sided SPD are absolutely fine... I have a pair of XT on my bike

cookeeemonster

Get disc brakes with tiagra over rim brakes with campag - no question - rim brakes are freaking awful in the wet.

As for double sided spd's - do you mean one side spd the other side flat? (For normal shoes) I never got on with those to be honest. It's a pain when trying to clip in sometimes when you catch the pedal and don't get the right side (always happens when you're trying to get away quickly from lights) As for the flat side, they naturally sit on the bottom of the pedal so it's a bit of a faff using them, though you can make it work

ugo.santalucia

cookeeemonster wrote:

As for double sided spd's - do you mean one side spd the other side flat?

THose are clearly not double sided SPD... double sided have two SPD untis, one per side... MTB pedals to make things easier

schlepper

ugo.santalucia wrote:

cookeeemonster wrote:

As for double sided spd's - do you mean one side spd the other side flat?

THose are clearly not double sided SPD... double sided have two SPD untis, one per side... MTB pedals to make things easier

My fault for being unclear, as u/CookeeeMonster is right, I was talking about one side spd and the other flat.

Thanks to all for responses. It seems I should go for head over heart, unfortunately.

g00se

Go with heart - it's always the best way with choosing bikes Calipers do work, especially with decent pads.

fatdaz

I've just built up an Equilibrium disc for Winter riding and personally I am loving the disc brakes in the wet. In the dry my (Ultegra) rim brakes on my main bike are as good as the discs but in the wet I much prefer the discs. I would say discs are a better option if you are going to be riding in the wet and/or you're not a confident descender but an awful lot of people use rim brakes all year round without issue.

Ergonomically I prefer Shimano shifters to Campag but that's a personal preference and others will think the other way round

I fitted pedals with SPD on one side and flat on the other to my single speed which I use for messing about with the family. It seemed like a great idea to have a choice of footwear when riding into town. After a handful of rides I swspped them for normal, double sided, SPDs as I found the pedals annoying and I can walk around perfectly happily in SPD shoes

arthur_scrimshaw

I'd agree with g00se, go with what you like the best. My winter bike has disc brakes and I've always been a bit ambivalent about the advantages of this (apart from the fact it makes fixing a puncture a bit easier and a lot cleaner) as with well adjusted and decent pads I've never felt a big difference in stopping performance compared to my 'normal' bikes but then I've never had to make an emergency stop (because of my awsome spider senses obviously) Until last week when a Range Rover pulled out in front of me (on the disc braked bike) at a junction and just stopped. It was wet and I had about 25 feet to stop, no chance of avoiding and was doing 17 mph. I stopped about 5 feet short of the car and had unclipped a foot before I stopped (I think in anticipation of going down) Not sure what that proves but I'm pretty sure the discs made a difference. But that's one event in 5 years of commuting?

ugo.santalucia

If your budget is sound you can buy a Genesis disc frameset and a campagnolo groupset... I run mostly Campagnolo on my disc bike and with 11 speed cross-breeding the two makes is fairly straightforward. You just need a decent guy to build it for you if you don't know how...
Plenty of lovely geeks who would build you a bike for a crate of beer (here is one)...

schlepper

ugo.santalucia wrote:

If your budget is sound you can buy a Genesis disc frameset and a campagnolo groupset... I run mostly Campagnolo on my disc bike and with 11 speed cross-breeding the two makes is fairly straightforward. You just need a decent guy to build it for you if you don't know how...
Plenty of lovely geeks who would build you a bike for a crate of beer (here is one)...

Now that is very interesting, because that's what I was thinking of doing and spoke to a bike shop about it who specialise in Genesis. There was a fair bit of teeth sucking and they said it would be tough.

Having thought more and more about this, and played around with Ribble's bike config tool, I think I'm going with the heart (not as said above the head) and will do the Campag Veloce. The low end Genesis disc is a chromolly frame, not steel. Going up to a steel disc takes it to c£1500 which is more than I want to spend. I did try to talk my self into spending it, arguing (to myself) that I'll end up upgrading the wheels which will bring by Equib 20 up to close to £1500. But eventually even I saw sense and have decided against it.

As tempting as Ugo's idea is, I think for my first bike I'd be over reaching somewhat. I'm getting the Equib 20 w/Campag. Definitely. Maybe. Well, I think so...

ETA the reason for playing with Ribble's tool was to see if I could get the 525 with discs, which it doesn't seem you can yet. If I could have done, i might have gone with that option. Also, not very keen on the current 525 colour scheme. Fickle I know. But you've probably already realised that about me.

Simon Masterson

Just so you know, ChroMoly is steel - it's just that the term is often used to refer to bog standard steel tubing.

schlepper

Simon Masterson wrote:

Just so you know, ChroMoly is steel - it's just that the term is often used to refer to bog standard steel tubing.

Ah, ok thanks for clarification - glad I posted to the beginners forum! But given the bog standard point, still not that keen on it.

Simon Masterson

schlepper wrote:

Simon Masterson wrote:

Just so you know, ChroMoly is steel - it's just that the term is often used to refer to bog standard steel tubing.

Ah, ok thanks for clarification - glad I posted to the beginners forum! But given the bog standard point, still not that keen on it.

I'd agree - typical frames of that ilk tend to be nice enough to ride, and a reasonable weight - so nothing like the gaspipes of old - but not particularly special either. I haven't tried them but I've read that 520 and 525 are decent enough.

il_principe

cookeeemonster wrote:

Get disc brakes with tiagra over rim brakes with campag - no question - rim brakes are freaking awful in the wet.

/quote]

Cobblers. Go for the Campag. Tiagra is horrible anyway, Veloce is a far better gruppo. This business of rim brakes being censored in the wet is utter b0ll0cks. Good brakes and good brake pads and you'll have no trouble. I run Chorus and Record brakes on my road bikes. Currently commuting on Chorus with Swisstop Green pads (while the commuter is repaired), no issues at all in the rain. Also never had any issues descending mountains in the wet with rim brakes either.

Simon Masterson

Il Principe wrote:

This business of rim brakes being censored in the wet is utter b0ll0cks. Good brakes and good brake pads and you'll have no trouble. I run Chorus and Record brakes on my road bikes. Currently commuting on Chorus with Swisstop Green pads (while the commuter is repaired), no issues at all in the rain. Also never had any issues descending mountains in the wet with rim brakes either.

This, exactly. It makes me laugh when people complain about their brakes - they've come on leaps and bounds in recent years. Anyone that thinks that their modern brakes aren't very good should go for a ride in torrential rain on a bike with Weinmann brakes and steel rims.

janwal

How about SRAM on the planet x London Road?
http://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/CBPXLDNRIV ... -road-bike

cookeeemonster

Il Principe wrote:

cookeeemonster wrote:

Get disc brakes with tiagra over rim brakes with campag - no question - rim brakes are freaking awful in the wet.

/quote]

Cobblers. Go for the Campag. Tiagra is horrible anyway, Veloce is a far better gruppo. This business of rim brakes being censored in the wet is utter b0ll0cks. Good brakes and good brake pads and you'll have no trouble. I run Chorus and Record brakes on my road bikes. Currently commuting on Chorus with Swisstop Green pads (while the commuter is repaired), no issues at all in the rain. Also never had any issues descending mountains in the wet with rim brakes either.

My experience with rim brakes the last couple years is that after a day or two in the wet (or even on the first day of rain) they make that shushing noise and are markedly censored at stopping compared to in the dry - I rarely do emergency stops thankfully but theres always a ped in london who'll walk out in front of you in the rain without looking or a black cab stop suddenly in a bus lane (with double red lines) which will test how good your brakes are - I think they are cr*p, am interested in how yours are so different? (genuine question)

I find that I spend ages (relatively) trying to clean the rims every week or even every few days when it rains a lot just to keep them at a reasonable level...pretty sick of it which is why I've ordered a disc bike. Also I use swisstop green pads which while good still have their problems.

backo

the main reason I have bought a disc cx for winter commuting was because of the performance of rim brakes in the wet during the winter. Dont get me wrong they would work fine monday/tuesday after the bike had been washed at the weekends but come the back of end of the week with the amount of carp on the bike/rims etc from winter riding then braking would be an issue. There were times where you would have to wait for a few seconds at least before the brakes start to acutally bite!! when you look at the pads which should be red, blue green or whatever colour..... they are black with gunge......disc brakes dont have this problem at all, they work just as regardless..

Yes I could wash my bike everyday when I get back home on it but washing it every week is enough for me.

The summer is a different story, and my bikes with rim brakes will come out for the commute.

samsbike

Personally I would go with the disc option if you are commuting and doing infrequent winter rides. Also be realistic on how much you will really do if commuting. I have a 18mile commute each way and realistically 2xdays a week cycle commuting is enough for me in the winter (Although I will stretch to 3 if am having a particularly good time).

You can always upgrade the groupset later, but you cant upgrade the frame for discs. Not entirely true, you can upgrade the frame, brakeset and wheels but its a lot more expensive, so the other way around is easier.

With regards to the build, if you can buy a frameset with the headset and BB attached, then you can bolt most of the bits on yourself and leave the cabling to the Lbs.

However buying all the bits new can add up more to just the cost of the bike, unless you can get some stuff secondhand in good nick.