Campag record v shimano Dura Ace

vespario

Hi, ordering a canyon today.

Can't between the campag record version or the dura ace. Only ridden ultegra so slightly nervous of the campag but like the look of the carbon.

Pro and cons?

Thanks

intheknowcycling.com

Did you like the performance of the Ultegra? The Dura Ace will feel the same. It will also be less expensive than the record. And for that amount, would also suggest you consider the Ultegra 6870 Di2. It will perform better and be less than both the groupsets you are considering. Should also ride whatever you are considering before deciding.

chippyk

I'd say Ultegra over Dura Ace for most occasions. I've Ultegra and the Campagnolo and I'm not sure if I can say one is better than the other, personal choice really. If I had to choose one, it would be the Campagnolo. it should be law that a Bianchi or Colnago have Campag IMO.

Grill

They're both fantastic groupsets so it's hard to go wrong. I'm a Shimano man myself as I prefer the shifters and the ability to source parts quicker and cheaper.

imposter2.0

Very different in terms of both hood shape and function/actuation. So the feel and usage will either suit you, or it won't. Very much a personal thing, so not something anyone else can recommend for you really...

northpole

As others have said - both groupsets are fantastic. Different aesthetics which you may have a preference on however, in my opinion the biggest differentiator is the ergo design and the logic of gear changing. Personally I much prefer the Campag logic with stubby thumb operated downshifts and finger operated levers for the upshifts. Most people have a preference on this which is the biggest contact you have with the groupsets. The other major contact you have is with the ergo hood itself - they are slightly different shapes and you may prefer one - really you need to get out for a ride to establish your preference. Perhaps you could borrow friends' bikes with different groupsets for a short ride?

Peter

mfin

Record looks great. DuraAce looks sh1t. Of course they both do what they are supposed to. If you don't like the way Campag feels in the hand for some reason (not many people say this) or how it operates then you'd have to have the sh1t looking DuraAce, if not, definitely have Record.

(Replacement cassettes will cost you more on Record, oem cablesets cheaper though I think)

cycleclinic

grill look in the right places and camag spares are available and one of the distributors does everything thing is the online retailers do not buy from these folks/brothers, they get their campag kit from i ride or chickens which do run out from time to time and they do not do the full range of spares well i ride doesn't.

buy the group you like the look of the most they are both excellent.

rolf_f

intheknowcycling.com wrote:

Did you like the performance of the Ultegra? The Dura Ace will feel the same. It will also be less expensive than the record. And for that amount, would also suggest you consider the Ultegra 6870 Di2. It will perform better and be less than both the groupsets you are considering. Should also ride whatever you are considering before deciding.

But then Chorus will perform as well as SR and costs rather less than Dura Ace (albeit there is a small weight penalty).

neilr4

I'm on the look out for a new bike for next year... always been a Dura ace fan as when I got into cycling in 89/90 I found that shimano was more user friendly, pedigree didn't mean anything to me as I was new to the sport and I simply used what I found worked the best. Heard all the arguments about campy lasting longer etc. but I have NEVER had an issue with a part failing either training or racing

At present (my only road bike!) I'm still riding an aluminium pinarello sestriere from 2002 equipped with DA 7700 9 speed. The chain gets replaced with original DA but for cassette replacement Ultegra is fine.

Been looking seriously at taking the plunge and getting campy for my new bike...... Chorus would surfice, I prefer the look of the new 4 arm Campy chainset over DA (just ugly imo!) and they've matched the long arm front derailleur of shimano so even though I find the campy mechanical shifting too heavy and noisey compared to shimano I'm thinking 'sure give it a try", my only sticking point at this stage is the brakes, find it hard to believe that the skimpy campy skeleton brakes work any bit as good as the powerful looking DA equivilant!!

Before I get set upon by a die-hard Campy fan I have always used an italian frame with shimano and found the combination to be a great one! I find that by looking at campy as an option for a new bike that I'm trying to remove obstacles that imo are inferior to shimano :roll:

Almost every new bike I see is equipped with shimano ultegra as it works flawlessy, is inexpensive and parts are very easy to get hold of should they be required. DA looks (excluding chainset imo!) and works a little better but I feel that the exclusivity factor that DA has had is somewhat gone........ When I ride my bike everything just has to work, how it looks doesn't concern me when I'm suffering. When not riding I like to look at my bike with the same enthusiasm as when I got hooked as a 16 year old, the sheer beauty of it, the sex-factor!!!

The only problem with shimano imo is that I find it has become a victim of it's own sucess, the performance difference between Ultegra and Dura ace doesn't justify the price difference which now means that a bike built up with ultegra is the most sensible option but that means riding "shimano clit", every c*nt has one, sure it does what it says on the tin but it wouldn't give ye a hard-on hence the reason I'm on the fence but leaning toward the campy side!!!

Can anyone with an UN-BIASED opinion with experience on both shimano 9000/6800 brakes and the upper end campy brakes convince me that the campy skeleton are any bit as good as shimano? :? :?

Neil.

Grill

thecycleclinic wrote:

grill look in the right places and camag spares are available and one of the distributors does everything thing is the online retailers do not buy from these folks/brothers, they get their campag kit from i ride or chickens which do run out from time to time and they do not do the full range of spares well i ride doesn't.

buy the group you like the look of the most they are both excellent.

Sure, but I'm talking about last minute emergency parts (which happens to me quite often). I can almost always get something that will sort me out, whether it be from a shop or a club mate. The advantage to being the biggest I guess.

rolf_f

Grill wrote:

thecycleclinic wrote:

grill look in the right places and camag spares are available and one of the distributors does everything thing is the online retailers do not buy from these folks/brothers, they get their campag kit from i ride or chickens which do run out from time to time and they do not do the full range of spares well i ride doesn't.

buy the group you like the look of the most they are both excellent.

Sure, but I'm talking about last minute emergency parts (which happens to me quite often). I can almost always get something that will sort me out, whether it be from a shop or a club mate. The advantage to being the biggest I guess.

That's what spares are for! Until you get enough of them that you decide to screw them all together and make a bike of them........

neilr4 wrote:

Can anyone with an UN-BIASED opinion with experience on both shimano 9000/6800 brakes and the upper end campy brakes convince me that the campy skeleton are any bit as good as shimano? :? :?

Neil.

They are caliper brakes - pull a cable, the caliper arms move, the pads grip the rims. Don't over-analyse! Engineering is more than just making the bits of metal 'look powerful'........

Grill

neilr4 wrote:

Can anyone with an UN-BIASED opinion with experience on both shimano 9000/6800 brakes and the upper end campy brakes convince me that the campy skeleton are any bit as good as shimano? :? :?

About the closest you'll come to unbiased: http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=125349

Monty Dog

If you're racing, look at what crash damage a DuraAce or Ultegra shifter looks like in comparison to a Campagnolo one and the ease / cost of repair. Generally, one can be rebuilt, the other goes in the bin.

neilr4

Rolf F wrote:

They are caliper brakes - pull a cable, the caliper arms move, the pads grip the rims. Don't over-analyse! Engineering is more than just making the bits of metal 'look powerful'........

It doesn't happen often thank god but every now and then some dumb idiot will post something that borders on stupidity :shock:

Better to say nothing IMO as your statement hasn't helped

I basically need feedback from people who have used brakes from the upper end of both manfacturer's!!

neilr4

Grill wrote:

neilr4 wrote:

Can anyone with an UN-BIASED opinion with experience on both shimano 9000/6800 brakes and the upper end campy brakes convince me that the campy skeleton are any bit as good as shimano? :? :?

About the closest you'll come to unbiased: http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=125349

Thanks Grill

paul1000

Go for what you like the look of, they will probably be very similar in performance , I've da9000 and I can't see how it can get any better without being di2, the front long lever mech is especially good, as for aesthetics you can't beat a bit of polished lol.

drlodge

I personally prefer the feel and functionality of Campagnolo shifters and believe Chorus is the best value top end grouppo.

adamfo

I don't think I could have a Ultegra chainset in the house. The hollow chain ring is two parts bonded together with a messy seam on the back !








Dura Ace has an invisible metal weld on the front. A work of engineering art. Chorus and Record are nice too in a conventional way.







(To super-size photobucket images click on the photo then click on the + symbol and click again on the + symbol)

Grill

That's because Dura Ace rings are cold forged...

mercia_man

Record and Dura Ace are both fantastic group sets. I've ridden both and would be happy to have a bike with either. I would suggest having a feel of the levers and hoods and buying the one you reckon is most comfortable. Also consider whether you prefer the button and lever positive click change of Campag or the lever and swinging brake lever lighter click change of Shimano. Record cassettes do allow a slightly lower bottom gear with a 29 cog as opposed to Dura Ace's 28.

As for brakes, Record skeletons are powerful and controllable, as are Dura Ace. You won't be disappointed with either. There's certainly no lack of power with the skeleton design. The latest Dura Ace with coated inner cables are really smooth. However, if you use carbon rims, the braking power and feel of both Record and Dura Ace will be significantly worse than with alloy rims.

My personal preference is Record. I like the more positive gear change and find (after years of using Campag) that it is easier for me to set up and maintain than Shimano. It's swings and roundabouts when buying spares. Some Campag stuff is dearer, some Shimano stuff is dearer. I've never had any major trouble buying bits for either Shimano or Campag. A big advantage for Record levers is that they can be rebuilt, as Monty Dog says.

So they are both excellent. Just buy the groupset you like the feel and look of best.

rolf_f

neilr4 wrote:

Rolf F wrote:

They are caliper brakes - pull a cable, the caliper arms move, the pads grip the rims. Don't over-analyse! Engineering is more than just making the bits of metal 'look powerful'........

It doesn't happen often thank god but every now and then some dumb idiot will post something that borders on stupidity :shock: Better to say nothing IMO as your statement hasn't helped I basically need feedback from people who have used brakes from the upper end of both manfacturer's!!

You are indeed correct. And you are that dumb idiot. If my statement hasn't helped then that has more to do with your own intellectual limitations than mine. Look into the physics of what levers do and how they work. Probably 90% of it, given decent design and execution to start with, is in the pads.

You won't see any difference between a Veloce caliper and a Super Record caliper in terms of stopping power; given the same pads and shoes. So you might as well compare Dura Ace with Veloce. I believe Shimano do engineer crapness into their lower ranges however.

Want a really useful reason to buy Campag? It doesn't matter with Campag if you forget to set the brake release lever. They work just as well in either position - you just have to reach further for the lever.

Grill

Rolf F wrote:

You won't see any difference between a Veloce caliper and a Super Record caliper in terms of stopping power; given the same pads and shoes. So you might as well compare Dura Ace with Veloce. I believe Shimano do engineer crapness into their lower ranges however.

Shimano simply trickle down. 6800 calipers are almost identical to 9000 calipers and I suspect that 5800 will stop just as well.

rolf_f

Grill wrote:

Rolf F wrote:

You won't see any difference between a Veloce caliper and a Super Record caliper in terms of stopping power; given the same pads and shoes. So you might as well compare Dura Ace with Veloce. I believe Shimano do engineer crapness into their lower ranges however.

Shimano simply trickle down. 6800 calipers are almost identical to 9000 calipers and I suspect that 5800 will stop just as well.

TBH, that's what I would assume based on logic but you do seem to get a quite a few folk claiming significant improvements as you go up the range.

Grill

Indeed, but I doubt it will be as prevalent with 11spd.

cycleclinic

I have record calipers and veloce calipers I am quite pleased with both. the record calipers modulate better (a bit) but the £30 veloce calipers really grab very well, over the bars well.

DavidJB

Buy campagnolo if you want a positive perfect shift every time and a good looking group set. Buy dura-ace if you constantly want to be fiddling with it to try and make it shift properly.

Bozman

DavidJB wrote:

Buy campagnolo if you want a positive perfect shift every time and a good looking group set. Buy dura-ace if you constantly want to be fiddling with it to try and make it shift properly.

You should do some homework. I'll give you the "good looking groupset" but the rest of your statement is a crock of 5hite.