Slaying the Badger
No thread on this. No one else watched it?
I really enjoyed it. Forgot what a bad ass Hinault was when he was riding. Cracking when he's baiting Lemond during post race interview whilst drinking a beer. Paul Kochli came across as a technical genius but about as good at psychology as a tree stump. Andy Hampsten still an utter dude.
I always found the 86 Tour a strange one - Everyone remembers it but the racing wasn't actually that interesting.
I really enjoyed it. Forgot what a bad ass Hinault was when he was riding. Cracking when he's baiting Lemond during post race interview whilst drinking a beer. Paul Kochli came across as a technical genius but about as good at psychology as a tree stump. Andy Hampsten still an utter dude.
I always found the 86 Tour a strange one - Everyone remembers it but the racing wasn't actually that interesting.
Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
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Not seen it but will give it a watch.0
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Can't seem to find it on catch up. When and where was it on please?0
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It was on ESPN several times in the week after the Tour. Of course if you're lucky it may be available in full on YouTube. It might be worth having a lookjohnboy183 wrote:Can't seem to find it on catch up. When and where was it on please?Twitter: @RichN950 -
If on espn then that will explain why I can't find it! Don't have it! But will check YouTube. Thanks
Edit: just found it http://youtu.be/elo5_iNEjRo0 -
^^Invoice is winging its way to you as we speak,
^^ 0 -
Great watch.
I still don't get Hinault's tactics. With a 5 minute lead, the race was almost over.It's a little like wrestling a gorilla. You don't quit when you're tired. You quit when the gorilla is tired.0 -
I guess you never competed at a level of sport were the mentality is to not just win but to dominate to the point of humiliating your opponent/s. it becomes a game, sometimes a bit of fun as Hinault himself says.Timoid. wrote:Great watch.
I still don't get Hinault's tactics. With a 5 minute lead, the race was almost over.
There can be a psychological need to do this.
To win easily and not bust yourself up is no win at all..I played rugby at a decent level..easy wins bring you no satisfaction whatsoever, watch sports events where the win is close and the competitors are all out compared to easy wins..the body language is massively different.
To compensate you push yourself harder and harder because somehow winning easy without busting a gut looks like a lesser victory (to those not competing especially & that in turn can play on you the winner)
You go into overdrive to absolutely annihilate your opponents both physically and mentally. Taking your foot off the gas can and does lead to losing focus which has being shown in sport time & time again, the psychology of still going all out when you're in front can be the sole difference between winning & losing..0 -
I gave this a watch this morning (I'm sure it must count as prep for a presentation) and was surprised how much I enjoyed it seeing as I'm not a big fan of Greg.
The main thing I took away from this was that Greg is quite a simple guy (not stupid simple but more naive) and maybe wasn't the best at reading his team and rivals but was blessed with the heart, lungs and legs to compensate. He seems very much the same today judging by his Lemond on Tour shenanigans (well, not the physical part).
Was also interesting his interactions with his wife (quick to contradict but then willing to accept she remembered the events more clearly). This 'memory' loss kind of hinted at some of the issues raised by Lance and Landis. His 'car-crash' story didn't help in changing my thinking either.
Regardless of how he has been over the past 15 years, he was one hell of a racer and deserves his place in cycling history.
EDIT: Forgot to mention the Look pedal deal. Must be spitting chips he didn't get his $1 per pair sold.Life is unfair, kill yourself or get over it.0 -
2014 Tour De France and Forza Nibali. :roll:tonyf34 wrote:I guess you never competed at a level of sport were the mentality is to not just win but to dominate to the point of humiliating your opponent/s. it becomes a game, sometimes a bit of fun as Hinault himself says.
There can be a psychological need to do this.
Stage 2 he put the pressure on and Stage 5 he had them grovelling to make mistakes.
He didn't have to but he applied your theory in the mountains.Organiser, National Championship 50 mile Time Trial 19720 -
tonyf34 wrote:
I guess you never competed at a level of sport were the mentality is to not just win but to dominate to the point of humiliating your opponent/s. it becomes a game, sometimes a bit of fun as Hinault himself says.Timoid. wrote:Great watch.
I still don't get Hinault's tactics. With a 5 minute lead, the race was almost over.
There can be a psychological need to do this.
To win easily and not bust yourself up is no win at all..I played rugby at a decent level..easy wins bring you no satisfaction whatsoever, watch sports events where the win is close and the competitors are all out compared to easy wins..the body language is massively different.
To compensate you push yourself harder and harder because somehow winning easy without busting a gut looks like a lesser victory (to those not competing especially & that in turn can play on you the winner)
You go into overdrive to absolutely annihilate your opponents both physically and mentally. Taking your foot off the gas can and does lead to losing focus which has being shown in sport time & time again, the psychology of still going all out when you're in front can be the sole difference between winning & losing..
There's an assumption here that this is how all sportspeople think and behave. It isn't. Take Germany in the recent world cup who have admitted at half time against Brazil in the semis that they agreed not to humiliate their opponents.0 -
That is Greg Lemond and Bernnie Hinault among others who deserve their places in history.type:epyt wrote:Regardless of how he has been over the past 15 years, he was one hell of a racer and deserves his place in cycling history.
It's called Respect that will never apply to a 7 time Fraud who is forever not invited anymore.
Pull the Chain.Organiser, National Championship 50 mile Time Trial 19720 -
deejay wrote:
That is Greg Lemond and Bernnie Hinault among others who deserve their places in history.type:epyt wrote:Regardless of how he has been over the past 15 years, he was one hell of a racer and deserves his place in cycling history.
It's called Respect that will never apply to a 7 time Fraud who is forever not invited anymore.
Pull the Chain.
You do realise it was Greg I was referring to?
(You seem to get a bit hot under the collar where a certain someone is concerned. Unless LA/JB name names there's nothing more to be said on him/them).Life is unfair, kill yourself or get over it.0 -
I've watched it now. At the time I was very pro-Lemond as I was pro-Fignon previously but now having read and watched Slaying the Badger (and When We Were Young and Carefree along with a few other things) I find myself increasingly warming to Hinault (and going off Lemond)0
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I realised who you meant but the name did not appear in the excerpt I brought forward so for someone just reading my post then I made it clear.type:epyt wrote:deejay wrote:
That is Greg Lemond and Bernnie Hinault among others who deserve their places in history.type:epyt wrote:Regardless of how he has been over the past 15 years, he was one hell of a racer and deserves his place in cycling history.
It's called Respect that will never apply to a 7 time Fraud who is forever not invited anymore.
Pull the Chain.
You do realise it was Greg I was referring to?
(You seem to get a bit hot under the collar where a certain someone is concerned. Unless LA/JB name names there's nothing more to be said on him/them).
"Deserved his place in history" and they and many others get invited to represent cycling, or in other functions that one disgraced person will never get. (except in Texas)
I have one interest left with the Magic Man and that can only happen in a Court of Law.
I did get hot under the collar with blood pressure in 1996 when a Danish turd disgraced the sport and was followed three years latter by a USA turd doing the same thing.
This USA turd was so greedy that he continued the Fraud for 7 years and that period of time is hard to forget.Organiser, National Championship 50 mile Time Trial 19720 -
Take Germany in the recent world cup who have admitted at half time against Brazil in the semis that they agreed not to humiliate their opponents.
Yeah but (1) They'd pretty much already done that and knew it. (2) Some of them play in the same club teams or have in the past, so I think there is a professional / friendship thing not to really rub noses in it. As it happens Brazil were so bad that Germany still scored for fun in the 2nd half.
Personally I don't think cycling is like football, in cycling you can mentally destroy people for good by attacking when it suits and showing them your the boss.0 -
Watched it today, enjoyed it0
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eh wrote:Personally I don't think cycling is like football, in cycling you can mentally destroy people for good by attacking when it suits and showing them your the boss.
Yet you can let them win and everyone just shrugs.“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
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really enjoyed this - the book of the same name is also great - this seems such a great period of pro cycling
i think Greg comes across as a great bloke and Hinault has mellowed over the years.
NB - the rapha film with Greg is also worth a watch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJVRDoaIyLsSunny Days - De Rosa - King RS Action Azzurro lumina
Rain - Winter - Wilier - xp izoard "petacchi"
Classic - 1999 De Rosa - Planet - Aluminio0 -
Just watched this. Cracking documentary, really enjoyed that. I rather like Hinault's attitude and the angle of shot just accentuated the badger look...
Random question, no podium girls in the 80s?0 -
ITV4 Tonight (Thurs 04/09) 8pm“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0
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What a great piece of TV. My views in the 80s were not entirely as they are now.
Insofar as one can be 'for' or 'against' a rider, I was for Le Blaireau and against LeMond. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.
I slightly resented the brash North Americans coming into a broadly European sport. I now have a much more positive view of LeMond, whilst retainng a great respect for Hinault, whose son Brian became a pop musician and record producer of some note.
In later years (post-shooting) I slightly resented the way GL 'cheated' with fancy bars and geometry on the final ITT when he beat Fignon. To my mind, he was cheating, even though he wasn't. More yanks coming over with their fancy gear and unholy technology.
What a difference in equipment! Look pedals on the cutting edge, no helmets and sleek steel frames. Gear levers on the downtubes... and the cars were all 505s and 604s. Proper cars.
Also, despite rather liking la Vie Claire at the time, I'd had no idea that B Tapie was behind it. I knew of him only through football. A thorough crook, but he does come across as rather charming and convincing.
And finally, the closing observation that EPO was changing everything. I was one of those who marvelled at the new speeds and put it down to superior training regimes.... which in a way it was. But not as I imagined it...
All in all, a wonderful piece of television.
Nostalgic? Moi?0
