Giant: Carbon frame crack

bjr

Hi All,

I was wondering if I could get your advice/experience on the following matter...

At the weekend I was cleaning my bike (Giant Defy Advanced 2, carbon frame) when I noticed a small crack in the seat tube. I contacted the Giant shop that I purchased it from (in April 2013, so it is less than a year and a half old), and they said bring it in immediately.

I have newer wheels on my bike, so I was changing them back to the original ones, and while doing this I found another crack in the arch at the top of the seat stays (underneath the rear brakes). When I brought the bike in, the guy in the shop looked at the first crack, though about it and decided that it was just in the lacquer. Then I showed him the second one, and immediately he said - "that's definitely a crack - no question. new frame needed"

Everything seemed fine - he told me that it would all get sorted and it was all covered by the Giant Warranty. It could take a few days or a few weeks to get the new frame depending on availability but that it would get sorted and I wouldn't be out of pocket (apart from a few quid to rebuild the bike, perhaps)

But a few hours later, the shop got in contact and said that they sent Giant-UK photos of my bike and the cracks, and that they claim from the photos that it is just cosmetic damage, and that was the end of the matter. I discussed this at length with the shop mechanic, who admitted that he still thought it was a crack, but that he wasn't an expert (back-tracking slightly), but that Giant-UK's word was final. We have agreed that he will go back to them, and press the issue but he believes that it is pointless.

But now I am in the situation that I don't know what to do or what I should accept. I think it's a crack (although how do I really know if the carbon is cracked?), the bike shop mechanic thinks it is a crack (the only qualified Giant person to look at it), but Giant-UK say it's not after having looked at a photo. He said that I could send it to get checked out properly by Giant, but that if it isn't cracked then they will slap me with a hefty bill.

So what should I do? After being told by a Giant mechanic that he thinks it's cracked, I have lost confidence in the bike. How can I go down a hill at 30-40mph with that on my mind? How can I enjoy that bike, knowing that it's potentially cracked and could leave me in a right heap on the ground at any point in time? It feels to me like Giant-UK are trying to get out of their responsibility, but that the shop mechanic was just being honest.

Apologies - I don't have photos as the ones I took are too large to add as attachment. I'm not looking for advice on the photos anyway, but it would be nice to show them.

Has anyone had any experience with Giant, or any similar experience of this nature. Anyone got any advice on what I should do next?

Many thanks (from a worried bike owner)

sods_law

I would suggest next step is get a second opinion from another Giant dealer (might be a bit of drive), or from another reputable retailer.

Explain your dilemma and am sure they will help.

It is easy to reduce photo size, seeing the photos would help perhaps?

lawrences

When I read the dealer had declared it was a crack straight away I almost laughed. that's pretty foolish thing for him to say.

If I was you I would keep on pressing and ask them to accept that if the frame fails they are liable for any injuries.

bjr

Hi.

Thanks for your replies. Here is the photo of the original 'crack'. I can almost believe that this is not a crack of the frame, because the second one is much worse. You cannot feel this crack on the surface, whereas the second one feels like you could cut yourself on it, and it is about 3-4 times longer. Unfortunately I don't have a photo of the second one yet, as (rather ironically) before I went into the shop I thought this was the most serious one!)

I too was surprised that he said it was a crack straight away, and he later said that he regretted saying it (although he then said that he still believed it was a crack!). But that just goes to show that he definitely believes that it is cracked, and not just paint work.

As regards Giant-UK agreeing they accept liability for any injury... that's a good idea - except that I will be the one injured (or worse!)

Taking it to another Giant shop will just result in a conversation with Giant-UK, with presumably the same result!

I'm going to push pretty hard on this, and will keep you updated!

lawrences

That one doesn't look too serious, from what you're saying of the other it sounds like you're doing the right thing pushing it. Quite worrying you can feel the second crack.

meagain

Point Giant to this:

"GIANT WARRANTY
Giant warrants for the original owner only the frame, rigid fork, or original component parts of each new Giant
brand bicycle to be free from defects in material and workmanship for the following specified periods:
Warranty of lifetime for -
• The bicycle frame, except on models intended for downhill purposes." etc

and firmly state your intention to pursue this by all possible means. If on balance you are pretty sure it IS a crack, then get an independent expert opinion - you should in due course be able to include the cost of this in a damages claim against Giant (or the owner of the shop where you bought it if not actually owned by Giant.

Get everything in writing. If the mechanic will not repeat what he has said, remind him that if goes to court he will have to choose between the truth and perjury!

the_fuggler

Have you spoken directly to Giant in the UK? They're usually pretty helpful.

bjr

Update: Here is the actual picture that the bike shop sent to Giant-UK. It's not a very clear picture and this is what Giant-UK made their decision on - which is pretty poor in my opinion. It is difficult to tell fro the picture, but you can feel the edge of the 'crack' if you run your finger along it. It is completely different to the original crack. (see previous photo)

When inspecting the bike, the mechanic found another crack on the chain stay near where it joins the seat tube. I can't comment on what this crack is like, as I did not notice it. But it is good to see that the mechanic had a proper look at the frame.

I said that I am not just going to take their word for it based on a photo inspection, and I am not going to take the frame away, so they have agreed to send it back to Giant for a full inspection at no cost to me regardless of the outcome. So I think this is a reasonable step. If the frame is not cracked then I am satisfied (although I'd rather not have all these cracks appearing), and if the frame is cracked, then I will get a replacement.

Just a shame I will be without a bike for the next few weeks with the weather being so good, but I will live with that!

dnwhite88

That's the real reason behind n+1 glad to see they are taking you a bit more seriously

kev77

Fella

My seat tube cracked also above the front mech to me it looked like the lacquer had cracked

I took it to my local Giant dealer, it was sent to Giant UK I think in Leicester who x-rayed the frame and replaced it with a better frame as the original frame they had no stock of

I paid LBS Giant £100.00 to rebuild it so the warranty was honoured

Hard to understand why the frame hasn't been sent from your local Giant to Giant UK as mine was?

Hope you get sorted

rickeverett

isnt that second crack just where the flex in the fork has cracked the paint and clearcoat ????

lawrences

I can't even see a second crack.

bjr

lawrences wrote:

I can't even see a second crack.

Exactly. Its a terrible photo, but believe me there is a crack. And to think, this is the photo Giant-UK made their assessment on when they said that there was definitely no crack.

I'm satisfied that if it gets checked out properly that it will either be OK, or I get as new frame.

bjr

rickeverett wrote:

isnt that second crack just where the flex in the fork has cracked the paint and clearcoat ????

Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. If they check it out properly, then I guess we will know. But it's not actually the fork. It's the seat stay.