Mavic Cosmic Elite S WTS V Swiss Side Franc/Hadron

alpineaddict

Hi folks...

Apologies about another wheel thread...

Been riding for a while and now pushing on to come back from a long lay off due to back problems... My riding used to be between 50-100 mile routes, however I have decided to reduce that now to more pleasurable sub 60 mile routes...

I ride a 2011 Kuota Kharma and generally am using stock components on the bike, but now am starting to upgrade 1 or 2 things (Saddle, Cassette, Wheels)... As always, wheels, come into this, and seem to be the one thing everyone says will make a difference to my riding ability...

I've never raced and never will, however, I don't see that as something that should stop me wanting to/needing to invest in tools that will help me become a better/more efficient rider... I'm about 5'10 and around 75kgs in weight. I don't tend to ride 'slow', and like to push myself quite hard when I do ride anywhere... I'm not the best at it, but love been on climbs and plan on heading to the Alps this summer to take on some decent Col climbs...

The 3 wheels that I have kind of thought about are...

- Mavic Cosmic Elite S WTS
- Swiss Side Franc/Hadron

I've seen the Mavic Cosmic Elite wheels on Merlin for £299, and after reading some reviews, and posts on here, they seem to be a decent set of wheels and possible, for the price, a reasonable upgrade to my stock Shimano R500 wheels...

The second set are the Swiss Side Hadrons... They have taken some stick on here, from some, however, the reviews from tests seem to contradict some of the posts on here... I am not ashamed to admit that I like my ride to look nice (as do most, and why not eh!!!!), and these wheels look pretty nice IMO, however, again, reading reviews and speaking to the guys at Swiss Side, the wheels sound like they do perform pretty well, and would def aide my riding ability/performance...

The 3rd are again form Swiss Side, the Franc, which have had a fair bit of positivity on here... Slightly cheaper wheel than the Hadrons and potentially a better fit for what I need... Again, I have only read good things about them...

I'm not a bike Guru and don't pretend to know anywhere near as much as most on here, I tend to go with intuition, what I am told/advised and what I read... I do research what I buy, however, as stated before, I am not ashamed to admit that part of my decision will based on how they look on my bike, as well as there performance as a wheel...

I'm happy to be advised on other wheels, and I'm happy to be moaned at by those that disagree with me sating I'm partly opting for 'form over function' as wheel as performance... But mainly I hope to hear from people that can offer some friendly advice to someone that doesn't know as much as he'd like to on this topic

PS. Budget up to around £600...

Many, many thx folks in advance...

Calpol

Swiss Side are marketing these Hadron things to death at the moment. They look ok but I am not sure you need 60mm rims for everyday riding. Don't know anything about the franc model. I suspect that if you must get deeper rims then Cosmic Carbone are the best bet because people will pay you the strongest money if you sell them on. There are many people on here that know a lot about wheels but here is what I have learned

1. 23mm wide rims feel better than standard 19mm wide
2. tyres are vital to the ride quality and should not be overlooked
3. maintenance is an important factor so get something that can be fixed
4. all carbon wheels look lovely but they do not brake anywhere near as well as alloy rims in the wet and if you get caught in the rain out as I did yesterday then this is a serious issue.

If its going to be your only set of wheels then I'd get something c1500g, 23mm wide and put decent clincher tyres on them. At 75kg you are not probably requiring anything too sturdy so plenty of choices.
CERO AR30, RS81 or something built around the pancenti, hed belgium, archetype rim to name but a few options

alpineaddict

Calpol - Thx for the response... Your comment about the breaking ability of deep rim wheels is addressed on the Hadrons by still having an aluminium rim... It's not that I 'must have' deep rims, I just began to look into them, read all the reviews and test results and began to think that they were a lovely set of wheels... with good performance results as well...

Currently riding on Schwalbe Durano tyres... Again, to me they seem good tyres and read some good things about them... Only had a couple of small slides :shock: :shock:

I did think that both the Mavic Cosmic Elite's and the hadrons were slightly heavier than I had ideally wanted... Will check out the wheels you mention...

Thx again anyhow...

alpineaddict

Anyone???

ugo.santalucia

Are you following the Tour de France? Have you seen anyone on 50-60 mm rims on the mountain stages? So, that's the Hadron out of the equation... you can find wind in the mountain, you can have side winds just when you takle a hairpin... in simple words you can go down like a sack of potatoes for the pleasure of carrying bigger logos on your rims... not worth it.

Swiss side francs Vs Mavic Elite... I don't think Swiss Side are anything more than a "sticker maker"... they buy cheap components from the far east, assemble them with decent spokes, stick some arguably tasteful decals on and double the price... they are (I think) rebadged Kinlin, which are very average rims, built on very basic hubs.

Mavic at least make some of their own components. The Elite are getting a bit old now in terms of design, but they are still among the most reliable light wheels out there and most importantly well suited to the kind of riding you have in mind.

alpineaddict

ugo.santalucia - Thx dude... I think you just talked me into the wheels that I was kind of thinking about anyhow... I appreciate your 'honesty' on what you think on Swiss Side... They seem to be doing a good marketing job, aimed an folk like me in other words...

Your comments on wind etc. in the mountains was the main reason behind me doubting them, but Swiss Side argue that they are overall good wheels in all conditions and handle the winds very well... However, from reading, you seem to be a bit of an authority on wheels/bikes and certainly know oodles more than I... So I take onboard your advice, and appreciate it...

Thx again buddy...

ugo.santalucia

You don't have to believe me... look at this graph, taken from their website... if you look at it carefully, it doesn't make any sense whatsoever



Why would the drag of their shallow box rims decrease at 20 degree angle, while that of a competitor would increase? What did they choose as a reference, this?

alpineaddict

haha... Thx for this, I understand what you're saying, but the vast majority of that means little to me... :oops:

You've done enough mate to convince me that I would be wasting my money to spend that much on a sit of rims that realistically would offer me no benefit for the type of riding I will be doing...

What I need to decide upon now is if the Cosmic Elite wheels will offer me enough of a performance increase (speed, energy efficiency etc.) for the spend of £300...

ugo.santalucia

alpineaddict wrote:

What I need to decide upon now is if the Cosmic Elite wheels will offer me enough of a performance increase (speed, energy efficiency etc.) for the spend of £300...

They are what is called a "jack of all trades", but also a master of none... they are neither light, nor particularly aerodynamic... they don't thick the "service friendly" box, in terms of spares and general DIY.... I think the Ksyrium Elite are more oriented towards a "racier" way of riding... they are more of an upgrade, if you see what I mean

lawrences

That graph is pretty woeful from a scientific standpoint. They really need to say what they are testing against. Since they use the same rim profiles as competitors on all their standard wheels I can only assume it's a run of the mill high spoke count box rim.

Also did they test an 82mm tubular or clincher? Because once the Hadrons braking track has been added in it's basically an 80mm and will be hit by the winds like an 80mm. Plus the 2 big brands who make 82's that I know are Zipp and Planet X and if they are only the same aero efficiency as Planet X they need to go back to the wind tunnel.

This is all a bit off topic now you've chosen the Mavic though. Good choice btw they look nice.

alpineaddict

Cheers dude for that...

PS. just seen your bike... Sweet ride bud... The wheels look awesome, and unlike me, you're able to make full use of your deep rims, unlike me...

Think the Mavic elites are a good compromise...

lawrences

Thank you.

They do look pretty sweet but they are only ever used for racing (when I finally get the time). Even then I would leave the front off if the winds are over 15-20mph. Stock RS30's for training. The heavier the wheel the harder the training haha.

Good luck with the Mavics.

mitchgixer6

I'm riding the Cosmic Elites as my day to day wheels on my race bike. Excellent wheels, sturdy and certainty don't slow me down. They look good too.

Yes there are lighter wheels as well as wheels that are easier to work on, but if you like the look of them and you can get them at a good price then go for it m

alpineaddict

mitchgixer6 wrote:

I'm riding the Cosmic Elites as my day to day wheels on my race bike. Excellent wheels, sturdy and certainty don't slow me down. They look good too.

Yes there are lighter wheels as well as wheels that are easier to work on, but if you like the look of them and you can get them at a good price then go for it m

Thx buddy... Does anyone know about Merlin Cycles not offering UK Warranties because they purchase import Wheels?? Just regurgitating what I have been told???

alpineaddict

Quick update folks... I have dislocated and broken my ankle in 5 places so the whole cycling thing has been put to bed for some time...

Think I am still going to buy the wheels as it will give me something to look forward to and work towards in rehab... Got an operation on Tuesday to pin me back together...

Thx all for the advice tho folks... Here's looking forward to next summer...