Avid Elixir 1's rubbing

big_chris-2

The rear disc brake on my GF's bike is rubbing to the point where it's more or less on all the time. You can only spin the wheel a couple of rotations before it stops. The feel at the lever too is as if the brake is already on, you don't actually feel it bite at any point. It's a new bike purchased a few months ago but only ridden recently for the first time.

There's no pad adjustment at the lever, and I've tried undoing the caliper mount bolts and pulling the brake on then doing them up again but no joy. Other suggestions I've seen are to take wheel & pads out and push the pistons back with a tyre leaver, or to release a small amount of fluid from the system as it feels like there might be too much in there.

Any suggestions? Bike is a Boardman Fi Comp MTB, brakes are Elixir 1's.

Chunkers1980

Take it back before you doing anything to it.

big_chris-2

It was Halfords and a fair old drive to get to the store I bought it from so wondering if there's any quick fixes I might be able to try first?

Chunkers1980

Pushing the pistons home is all I'd do if it is new.

Cracking them open will mean you've messed with them and have less come back.

big_chris-2

So wheel out, pads out, push both pistons back as far as they'll go with a tyre leaver?

kajjal

Have a look to see if the rotor is bent.
Also try setting the pad clearance up by eye rather than using the pull brake on loosen callipers method.
My rear exlixir 1 brake rubbed unless I set it by eye due to a slightly uneven action.

big_chris-2

It's a new bike so hopefully not bent! It doesn't rub in places either, just feels like there's too much fluid perhaps. The lever feel is as if the brake is already on before you pull it, there's no free lever travel then a bite as you get with the front brake.

Will try setting it by eye though to rule it out.

markhusbands

I have had similar issue with my elixir 3s, mine are locking on as well, I've figured out what mine is, on Saturday I left my bike out in the sun for an hour about to go on a ride, and both front and rear brakes were locked up, avid are well known for locking up in the heat,so I've ordered a bleed kit to try and sort it as I've air in the hoses.my bikes not that old either.

big_chris-2

You could be onto something there, the brakes on my bike (Elixir CR) were pretty much 'on' when I got my bike out on Sat in the hot weather and I had to back the pads off using the adjuster. I've found this with hydro brakes in the past too whereby in very cold weather the lever goes all the way to the bar before it bites - not sure if the fluid expands/contracts due to temperature?

In any case, tried removing pads and pushing pistons back but made no difference. The pads seem to be very close together and there's only very minimal movement when applying the brake as the pads are so close already. The lever still feels as though the brake is already on when you pull it. Am I looking at a bleed to resolve?

markhusbands

I'm personally going to bleed mine, my bikes less than 8 months old. But I guess you don't know how long the bikes been sat in a warehouse etc, the bikes no good if the brakes are going to lock on hot days as the only quick fix on this as I did is opening the bleed port on the lever but that isn't a permanent fix, mine is also still stiff at the lever like the brake is on. I'm going to bleed mine as soon as my bleed kit comes from amazon

cooldad

Bleeding removes air for squidgy brakes.

big_chris-2

Any ideas what my next move is then? Let a little fluid out? Or let the pro's take a look?

markhusbands

Well I'm working on mine this weekend or as soon as I get my kit, I'll let you know if their is any improvement, I've read that because of the hot weather the air which is in the hoses expands as now my bikes in the shade the brakes are fine. It's your call on what you do , by letting a little fluid out to free the rear wheel everytime the bikes used, eventually the bike will need a bleed anyway. I've never done a bleed myself, so hopefully I'll do it proper first time round,

mattv

It's a regular avid thing. They are not bled correctly. Letting fluid "out" is pointless, it'll only come out the reservoir not the closed system.

big_chris-2

How would I go about letting a bit of fluid out to see if it helps?

*edit

Just seen above post, looks like a full bleed after all then?

marcus'73

Might not be the cheapest solution but the easiest fix is to just buy a set of Shimano brakes to replace the Avid ones!!! I've lived with all the classic Avid problems for years on two bikes in a row, I took them in to various LBS's and although they usually fixed them in the short term the problems always came back.

big_chris-2

Hmmm... bit extreme for now I think, will see if LBS can sort first.

Out of interest though, Shimano brakes now seem to come as lever & caliper only and you spec the disc separately... would say the Deore brakes work with the Avid rotors?

cooldad

Yes.

big_chris-2

Do you need to specify rotor size when buying the brakes, or the calipers fit all rotor sizes? Can get a set of Deore brakes for £70 from CRC which is tempting...

marcus'73

You buy a set of bled brakes and then the adaptors are what you spec to match your disc size.

I've still got the Avid discs at the moment and they are working fine. I had to stick a couple of washers on the front Shimano adaptor mount as Avid's rotor size is 182mmm rather than 180mm. On the rear I've still got the 160 mm Avid adaptor and it all lined up so easy and so far (4 rides in) no need to spend ages fettling the alignment everytime you remove a wheel.

big_chris-2

And do you find them an improvement over the Avids? This is the Mrs' bike and she won't notice the difference as she's not exactly a hardcore rider, but I can't have her riding on a bike with the back brake on all the time!

Would prefer to get the Avids fixed but if I spend a bunch of money getting them right then it happens again, it might make sense to just spend £70 on the Deores now.

marcus'73

I really liked the Avids for feel and modulation but I'd just had enough over the last 4 years! The consistancy of the Shimano brakes is the good thing, I really gave them a workout at Afan last week and they were feeling the same at the end of the ride as at the beginning - though I'm still struggling to adapt to the change in lever length. My GF has Deore's on her bike and the complete lack of maintenance in the last two years was what sold me on Shimano.

big_chris-2

Do you get pad/bite adjustment on the Deore brakes?

kajjal

My wife's bike has slx disc brakes which were great to use and didn't rub if you took a wheel out and put it back in again. That's why I upgraded to XT's which have been much better.

Initialised

BiG CHRIS wrote:

You could be onto something there, the brakes on my bike (Elixir CR) were pretty much 'on' when I got my bike out on Sat in the hot weather and I had to back the pads off using the adjuster. I've found this with hydro brakes in the past too whereby in very cold weather the lever goes all the way to the bar before it bites - not sure if the fluid expands/contracts due to temperature?

It's not the fluid, it's air dissolved in the fluid. When it heats up it becomes bubbles so you get brakes jamming on and feeling spongy. If bled correctly there will be very little air in the fluid so this wont be a problem on new brakes. But hoses aren't 100% air or water tight, it can move through and over time the fluid will absorb ait. What you need to do is de-gas the fluid rather than a full bleed. You can do this by de-gassing a syringe full of fluid, attaching it to the lever and degassing the line in the same way.

big_chris-2

I think it's off to my LBS then, they'll do it for less than £20 and I don't have any syringes or fluid, nor do I have any idea how to go about doing it!