TDF ITT & Rainbow stripes - Wiggo? (edited)

tom3
tom3 Posts: 287
edited May 2014 in Pro race
No question, Froome will lead the team and on form Wiggo has to be in the team to support him.

With the ITT does he ride for the stage win, or as a domestique will it be treated as a rest day?

Secondly, I think Wiggo's main target all year has been the TT rainbow stripes. The one he has actually kept stum about being a real target. Anyone else think this?
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Comments

  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,241
    If he's there he'll ride it to win. It's the penultimate stage - there's not much point in saving yourself for just the Paris stage.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • tom3
    tom3 Posts: 287
    RichN95 wrote:
    If he's there he'll ride it to win. It's the penultimate stage - there's not much point in saving yourself for just the Paris stage.

    runs off to check the stage ordering this year. Yep, silly question!
  • RonB
    RonB Posts: 3,984
    Don't worry, if it was the stage before the Hautacam he would be trying to win it as well :wink:
  • Daz555
    Daz555 Posts: 3,976
    He'd be looking to win the TT no matter what day it took place on and Tony Martin is probably the only guys who could get in the way of a victory.

    Wiggo not picked yet for the Tour of course so not really worth worrying about.
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  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    Why does Wiggins *have* to be at the Tour?
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • mroli
    mroli Posts: 3,622
    If you want someone to ride high pace for a long period of time to discourage attacks on the early part of a climb - there probably would be no better person than Wiggins to do that? Have a "pure" climber for the top part to support Froome?
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  • tom3
    tom3 Posts: 287
    iainf72 wrote:
    Why does Wiggins *have* to be at the Tour?

    To take over the Mick Rodgers role from 2012. A clear void was left in 2013 without Rodgers and the team was visibly weakend.
  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    Wiggins would be very capable at the Tour. But would he work for Froome? Would Frome trust him? Does he need the stress of him being in the squad.

    It's not like Sky are talent-lite and couldn't get another good guy in the squad

    If I was Froome and I saw what Wiggins did in P-R over the cobbles, I'd be nervous about allowing him on "my" squad, as he could nick a few minutes on the cobble stage
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • TMR
    TMR Posts: 3,986
    I'd like to see Wiggins in the SKY TdF squad as a loose cannon. Think Contador to Armstrong when they both rode for Astana. Could make for some hilarious TV from the DS car..."Brad! WTF are you doing? Stop attacking Froome Dog" etc. :mrgreen:
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,163
    Wiggins seems to have his head sorted and relishing not being the focus in the team. I actually think he'll do a very good job for Froome. If the worst happened and Froome crashed out there's no reason why Wiggins couldn't get a top 10 but beyond that I don't think he'd have any GC ambitions with the strength of climbers in the field this year and him being at a far more natural weight. I'd say the cobbles are a good reason for having him there, he's the sort of rider who can keep Froome out of trouble or help him get back if he does have a problem.
  • milton50
    milton50 Posts: 3,856
    iainf72 wrote:
    Wiggins would be very capable at the Tour. But would he work for Froome? Would Frome trust him? Does he need the stress of him being in the squad.

    It's not like Sky are talent-lite and couldn't get another good guy in the squad

    If Sky had a full squad then I think they would come down on the side of "it's not worth the stress and the constant press questioning"

    The problem is though that Porte is in dire form, Kennuagh has hardly raced and is now ill, they probably don't want to pick EBH if he's moving on, Cataldo and Siutsou will have the Giro in their legs, Henao's been sidelined. Four of those riders were major domestiques for Froome last year.

    So all of sudden the potential Tour squad is looking depleted. I wouldn't say light but it's potentially weaker than it was last year.

    So it is a decision they have to make given the form Wiggins seems to be in. I think they will probably still leave him out but it is not an easy decision.
  • woody1545
    woody1545 Posts: 322
    Yeah, I think Sky need him from a cycling and (unfortunately) a marketing point of view.

    He's in good form physically and mentally and Sky need a better squad than last year if they are going to compete with Contador and Saxobank.
  • Remarkable
    Remarkable Posts: 187
    iainf72 wrote:
    Wiggins would be very capable at the Tour. But would he work for Froome? Would Frome trust him? Does he need the stress of him being in the squad.

    It's not like Sky are talent-lite and couldn't get another good guy in the squad

    If I was Froome and I saw what Wiggins did in P-R over the cobbles, I'd be nervous about allowing him on "my" squad, as he could nick a few minutes on the cobble stage

    That's very true, but it would be good for Sky to have a Plan B. I doubt they would want a repeat of 2011..and does Froome really have the last say as to who is in the squad? I doubt Brailsford et al would be told what to do by a rider.
  • r0bh
    r0bh Posts: 2,382
    Agree with previous 3 posters; a lot of key Tour domestiques currently have uncertain form. And let's face it last year's Tour team wasn't exactly strong, certainly not compared to 2012. Wiggo seems to be in good nick and I think he would actually prefer a support role rather than having to deal with the pressures of being leader.
  • gsk82
    gsk82 Posts: 3,570
    i can't see any way barring injury that wiggins won't be in the team. i also think they'll have the strongest team there after last year's mess. not having a rider drop out injured (EBH), 2 more riding with big injuries (stannard and thomas) and another missing a time cut (Kyrienka) will help to. I'm sure any team would love to have Froome, Wiggins, Porte, Thomas, Kennaugh, Nieve, Lopez, Kyrienka plus one more at the tour.
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  • graeme_s-2
    graeme_s-2 Posts: 3,382
    Pross wrote:
    Wiggins seems to have his head sorted and relishing not being the focus in the team. I actually think he'll do a very good job for Froome. If the worst happened and Froome crashed out there's no reason why Wiggins couldn't get a top 10 but beyond that I don't think he'd have any GC ambitions with the strength of climbers in the field this year and him being at a far more natural weight. I'd say the cobbles are a good reason for having him there, he's the sort of rider who can keep Froome out of trouble or help him get back if he does have a problem.
    I saw something the other day that said he was starting the Tour of California at the same weight he started the 2012 TdF, which surprised me. Maybe it's nonsense as part if talking him up for ToC.
  • Turfle
    Turfle Posts: 3,762
    There are question marks over most of the potential Tour team.

    I reckon Froome would ideally want Porte, Lopez, Nieve as his final 3 in the mountains, but Porte is all over the place, Lopez had a 'mare at last year's Tour, and Nieve - while obviously an experience 3 week rider - has never done it in the Sky train. When it all shakes out, I think Wiggo might well end up as #2.
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 19,310
    iainf72 wrote:
    If I was Froome and I saw what Wiggins did in P-R over the cobbles, I'd be nervous about allowing him on "my" squad, as he could nick a few minutes on the cobble stage


    Flip side of course is that what Wiggins did in P-R over the cobbles makes him a very attractive super domestique
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  • Remarkable
    Remarkable Posts: 187
    Graeme_S wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    Wiggins seems to have his head sorted and relishing not being the focus in the team. I actually think he'll do a very good job for Froome. If the worst happened and Froome crashed out there's no reason why Wiggins couldn't get a top 10 but beyond that I don't think he'd have any GC ambitions with the strength of climbers in the field this year and him being at a far more natural weight. I'd say the cobbles are a good reason for having him there, he's the sort of rider who can keep Froome out of trouble or help him get back if he does have a problem.
    I saw something the other day that said he was starting the Tour of California at the same weight he started the 2012 TdF, which surprised me. Maybe it's nonsense as part if talking him up for ToC.

    Yep, Wiggins himself said it during the pre race Press Conference.
  • tom3
    tom3 Posts: 287
    Remarkable wrote:
    Graeme_S wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    Wiggins seems to have his head sorted and relishing not being the focus in the team. I actually think he'll do a very good job for Froome. If the worst happened and Froome crashed out there's no reason why Wiggins couldn't get a top 10 but beyond that I don't think he'd have any GC ambitions with the strength of climbers in the field this year and him being at a far more natural weight. I'd say the cobbles are a good reason for having him there, he's the sort of rider who can keep Froome out of trouble or help him get back if he does have a problem.
    I saw something the other day that said he was starting the Tour of California at the same weight he started the 2012 TdF, which surprised me. Maybe it's nonsense as part if talking him up for ToC.

    Yep, Wiggins himself said it during the pre race Press Conference.

    He is getting that 'gaunt' look back in his face I noticed. Not quite as ripped everywhere else yet but a few weeks to go.
  • TMR
    TMR Posts: 3,986
    TailWindHome wrote:
    iainf72 wrote:
    If I was Froome and I saw what Wiggins did in P-R over the cobbles, I'd be nervous about allowing him on "my" squad, as he could nick a few minutes on the cobble stage


    Flip side of course is that what Wiggins did in P-R over the cobbles makes him a very attractive super domestique

    He is a TdF winner, why should he demean himself by being a domestique?
  • Macaloon
    Macaloon Posts: 5,545
    Even if there were some questions about Wiggo's sporting contribution to the team, the commercial value of having the country's first Tour winner Grand Departing alongside the defending champ, in Yorkshire, is irresistible for both team and rider. And I think on current form he'd be a definite pick for cobbled/windy stage protection.

    Given the incentives, and Froome's confidence, I doubt there's a boat to be rocked in the unlikely event of Wiggo going green.
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  • woody1545
    woody1545 Posts: 322
    Yeah, I think Sky need him from a cycling and (unfortunately) a marketing point of view.

    He's in good form physically and mentally and Sky need a better squad than last year if they are going to compete with Contador and Saxobank.
  • DeVlaeminck
    DeVlaeminck Posts: 9,031
    It's a difficult one because the suspicion must remain that Wiggo is not going to give Froome 100% on every stage. If Wiggo should somehow get in a situation to get a minute or two over Froome what happens, say a split in the peloton and Wiggo makes the front group or Froome has a bad day or a crash, do they call Wiggo back or play him as a second card?

    I doubt Froome wants him there, even though there will be times Wiggins would be invaluable, but I'd guess the management will pick him and offer him the carrot of the individual time trial to keep him focused on the team. My guess is that it'll work out well and Wiggins will play the loyal domestique though my hope is he is bang on form and trys to win it himself.
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  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 19,310
    TMR wrote:
    TailWindHome wrote:
    iainf72 wrote:
    If I was Froome and I saw what Wiggins did in P-R over the cobbles, I'd be nervous about allowing him on "my" squad, as he could nick a few minutes on the cobble stage


    Flip side of course is that what Wiggins did in P-R over the cobbles makes him a very attractive super domestique

    He is a TdF winner, why should he demean himself by being a domestique?

    Depends wether or not you see it as demeaning I suppose.

    Cancellara is/was a multiple world champion and arguably the best classics rider of his generation. He still found time in July to support Frandy
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  • deejay
    deejay Posts: 3,138
    A bit like Stephen Roche did in the Giro, or what Cunego did in another Giro.
    Organiser, National Championship 50 mile Time Trial 1972
  • TMR
    TMR Posts: 3,986
    TailWindHome wrote:
    Depends wether or not you see it as demeaning I suppose.

    Cancellara is/was a multiple world champion and arguably the best classics rider of his generation. He still found time in July to support Frandy

    I see the argument you're trying to make, but think that comparison is apples and oranges. Wiggins raison d'etre is GC. I think it's a bit crap that having won the race he would be asked to support someone else. It's obviously a choice for him and what he can stomach though.
  • salsiccia1
    salsiccia1 Posts: 3,725
    TMR wrote:
    I think it's a bit crap that having won the race he would be asked to support someone else.

    Why is it? If one of his team mates has a better chance of winning, he should support him. That's what being in a team is about.
    It's only a bit of sport, Mun. Relax and enjoy the racing.
  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    Wiggins said a couple of months ago that ultimately it's Froome's team and he'll have final say.

    I suppose the question for Brailsford will be, do you want a harmonious but slightly weaker team, or a team that could explode but is stronger.
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,241
    iainf72 wrote:
    Wiggins said a couple of months ago that ultimately it's Froome's team and he'll have final say.

    I suppose the question for Brailsford will be, do you want a harmonious but slightly weaker team, or a team that could explode but is stronger.
    They got a Dauphine to find out. If that goes Ok then Wiggins will be on the team. I'm sure others will be persuading Froome that Wiggins's pros outweigh the cons.
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