Please help an old guy back in to have some fun.

grarea

Hi all,
I do apologise for asking for help, I have been trying to sort a bike out on my own, but my head is now spinning.
I wonder if you could help?

I used to bike a lot and now want to play again.
I will split this into two parts. A quick list of questions, then a more involved (and more boring) 'this is what I am hoping to get' section for anyone who might be half interested.

My first questions are:
1) Long travel hardtails... what are these?
2) What happens with a slack steering tube angle?
3) Aggressive hardtail? what are they and what are they actually for?
4) Trail riding?
5) XC riding?
(We just used to call it mountain biking.)
6) Can someone please explain how 'standover height' is calculated on on one's website?
http://www.on-one.co.uk/i/q/FROOVDO126/ ... al-dropout

thanks.
OK, boring section:
I am in mid 40s and used to ride a lot.
Have got back in to playing after a HUGE break Now I want to play again.
I have a budget of £500 and thought i would just buy off the peg and play, so i got a second hand, good condition Boardman pro.
I got a medium (18") as that is what everything said I should get. (I knew i shouldnt have listened to the official stuff).
Anyway, it is too big.
Zero 'gentleman clearance' for a quick decamp when things get tricky.
Thing is, the geometry fits me well otherwise as, like many I am not a 'normal' size.
Short legs.

I am currently playing in Swinley forest.
I like to have it all.
I like to cover a few miles (well, i will when i get fitter) like to throw it downhill.
Like the tricky stuff, technical ups and downs. Like the steep and log stuff too.

So I guess i want an 'all-rounder' ?
It appears that I want a shorter frame (say 16") with the same top tube as the boardman.
(It is the same as my old bike)
I prefer a shorter wheelbase for lifting over the tricky bits if poss.
Want a hardtail and 26" wheels.

So, looking at geometry, when I can find it, (I doubt that I will get it right straight away, but I want to try.)
Also I am after something 'normal' that I can upgrade.

It looks like maybe a cove stiffee, ragley piglet, on one inbred, maybe one of the 456?
Am I on the right lines do you think or just completely way off?

Then the next questions will involve the build, like can i use the forks off the boardman on say the piglet?

Well, thanks for reading and even if you havent read this far, it has helped me organise my thoughts.

cooldad

If it fits and works, stop worrying. Standover is not important.

iLukeKendall

Hi grarea,

1. Basically, hardtail MTB's with long travel forks. Travel refers to how much the fork can compress. Hardtails are usually aimed at XC (Cross Country) riders, which often don't require masses of travel, and are usually spec'd at 100mm to 120mm. Long travel hardtails usually have 140mm+ of travel, meaning they can take larger hits if being ridden in more extreme conditions with large drop offs, rock gardens etc.

2. I'm not entirely sure what effect it has, but it will affect the steering responsiveness and handling of the bike.

3. Aggressive hardtails usually have long travel forks, and will be used in more downhill-style areas. Usually they'll have a single chainring with a chainguide to prevent the chain from slipping off on bumpy terrain.

4. Riding designated man made or natural trails - manmade trails are usually graded from green through to black, depending on their difficulty. A trail bike would usually be full suspension, although you do also get hardtails.

5. XC stands for Cross Country. Moorland riding, doesn't usually involve massive jumps or drop offs like Downhill riding would involve. Usually have a larger ratio of gears to help with climbing steep hills.

As for the On-one questions, I'm not exactly sure on those, sorry!

grarea

Hi iLuke, great stuff, thanks.
Nicely explained.

Now to try and narrow things down a bit so i can find something that fits and works.

kajjal

I started mountain biking in the mid 1990's and it seems to be going the way of wind surfing where they put everything into loads of often similar categories which really confused people.

Roughly speaking there are three main styles of bikes XC, trail and downhill. XC bikes are made for covering ground quickly and while they can handle the very rough stuff other bikes make it easier. Downhill bikes have long travel suspension front and rear and are setup to go down hills at speed including very rough drops but they are not so good on the flat and very poor uphill. Trail bikes fit somewhere in the middle, a compromise of XC and downhill. Trail or XC bikes will handle pretty much any riding you are likely to find in the UK and it is more of a personal preference to which you choose.

A mid 1990's XC bike had about 60mm suspension with 26" wheels and v-brakes. An XC bike now has 120mm suspension , 29" wheels and disc brakes.

rockmonkeysc

Forget standover clearance, my plums rest on the top tube and it's just not a problem. Top tube length is far more important.
The Boardman is a great bike.

grarea

Smashing Kajjal, thanks.
I started mountain biking in the late eighties/ early nineties (same time I was windsurfing funnily enough.)
I want a mix of XC and trail. Thanks.

I gree rockmonkey, Boardman is brilliant, I love it, I am pretty gutted.
Unfortunately I have short legs and the bar is a a bit higher than resting on height.

I agree about top tube length, which is perfect on the boardman (longer torso).
The Boardman would be ideal for just plain trails and XC, but I cant resist but play on technical stuff that is too hard for me. Believe me, standover clearance REALLY matters.

I have looked at specs now on a few bikes that have 16" frames and same effective top tube as Boardman and my old Terrago, both of which suited me. (Well, a little short, but anyway.)

Looking at Ragley piglet and a bunch of On One frames.
Was hoping to transfer the gear of the Boardman, (Saves paying postage on all the parts) but the tapered forks might stump me straight off.

I seem to need a 44mm steering tube it appears......

Thanks for answering my questions though guys, they really helped.

grarea

I am beginning to realise why people dont need 'gentleman's clearance'.
They all just follow trails dont they?
Trails that have been modified and smoothed and adjusted for them. Nothing to stop you dead in your tracks when running downhill like in old quarries if you time your front wheel lift well enough.

cooldad

A lots of us ride natural stuff far more often than trail centres. I live adjoining Swinley forest but haven't ridden the marked trails for months, and even then only to show people around.

grarea

I did consider chopping bits off, i liked the boardman so much, but I am not skillful enough any more to stay on all the time.
Boy arent disk brakes great

cooldad

I am pretty rubbish and fall off a lot, and whilst I've hurt most bits, I've never yet whacked my nuts on the crossbar, and whilst you may be older than most on here, I've been riding since before you were born.
So stick with it and we can show the kids how it's done.

cooldad

ps unless you're planning on being a really old father, you don't really need them any more anyway.

grarea

I know, It was about the first time i was disappointed in them.
Truth is, I just cant stand over the frame.

A smaller frame with a longer top tube should make me much more nimble in the little tricky bits.
Will give me more confidence to throw myself at stuff as well.
I thoroughly love biking and gutted that life got in the way for so long.

Taking a week off to cornwall with the bikes next month.
Look out for me in swinley, I will be the one that sounds like a steam train at the top of the hill.

BUT I do CYCLE to the top of the hill.

batmo

cooldad wrote:

If it fits and works, stop worrying. Standover is not important.

Standover is not important, if it's not important to you. I tried a number of bikes and found it was important to me. There are degrees of everything and quite a difference between "no clearance to speak of" and "actually, that's painful!".

grarea

Yeah was important to me.
I couldnt reach the ground, on the flat let alone off road.
Anyway, I have got a frame and am transferring bits across from the boardman.
I wonder if people could help with bottom bracket questions for me please?

The frame has a threaded 73mm BB shell.
The Boardman a BB30 which is just not compatible.
Well, the boardman has a 2 speed shifter and I was just going to get rings with the same size as the boardman to start with.
Now........
1) There is no reason i cant just get a triple ring set is there and change two of the rings and add a guard?
2) To save costs I am using an old shimano front mech. It was from a triple, but I assume I can adjust it.
3) Bottom Bracket. Spindle length. Do these still vary? How do I find out how much I need sticking out for the cranks or is it standard?

4) Could anyone tell me if I am making any obvious errors before I buy parts please?

Actually should I start a new topic with it?

Thanks in advance for your help.

felix.london

Batmo wrote:

cooldad wrote:

If it fits and works, stop worrying. Standover is not important.

Standover is not important, if it's not important to you. I tried a number of bikes and found it was important to me. There are degrees of everything and quite a difference between "no clearance to speak of" and "actually, that's painful!".

It's not important to me...I can't think of a single time when I've had to stand with both my feet flat on the ground while straddling the bike.

Angus Young

felix.london wrote:

It's not important to me...I can't think of a single time when I've had to stand with both my feet flat on the ground while straddling the bike.

cooldad wrote:

I am pretty rubbish and fall off a lot, and whilst I've hurt most bits, I've never yet whacked my nuts on the crossbar

A friend of mine did and he almost bled to death through his cøck as a result (and I'm not joking here). He left blood all over the back of the taxi that took him to hospital and a trail of blood through A&E. He had a long stay in hospital and had to wear a bag for several months afterwards. Sometimes stand over does matter.

felix.london

that has made me feel very queasy indeed!! f.that!!...poor guy

The Rookie

But you can crash your bits into the top tube even if you have standover, in fact I'd suggest to hit it that hard, standover or not he was going to hit it that hard regardless, I have more standover on one bike (plenty) than the other (slightly negative) yet the one I have 'winded' myself on is the one with clearance.........

Angus Young

The Rookie wrote:

But you can crash your bits into the top tube even if you have standover, in fact I'd suggest to hit it that hard, standover or not he was going to hit it that hard regardless, I have more standover on one bike (plenty) than the other (slightly negative) yet the one I have 'winded' myself on is the one with clearance.........

Sure, an inch or two of extra stadover might not have made any difference (to be honest I have no idea how much he did have) it's just that when I hear the oft repeated line about never having hit you clackers on the top tube, that incident always comes to mind.

In his case it was the classic of a car turning left just in front of him and him slamming on the brakes and sliding off the seat. It was amazing how much damage he did from such a simple incident.

The Rookie

Which was probably as his 'bits' hit the back of the stem I would suggest.......my cousin had similar when he was hit by a U-turning car on his motorbike and that came from hitting the back of the tank, he didn't actually move as such on the bike.

Angus Young

The Rookie wrote:

Which was probably as his 'bits' hit the back of the stem I would suggest.......my cousin had similar when he was hit by a U-turning car on his motorbike and that came from hitting the back of the tank, he didn't actually move as such on the bike.

No, he did land on the top tube causing what was, effectively, a 'pinch flat' on his urethra, bursting it in the process*. He came into the office looking a little pale and said "I've just had an accident, I think I've hurt myself." He got little more out of us that "Oh, O.K." "I think I need to go to hospital" he said. Oh, O.K. So I took him out on the street to get a taxi. The lift jammed on the way down but, luckily, that only lasted a few minutes before it righted itself. I put him in a taxi with a cheerful "See you later!" What he hadn't told me was that before he'd come into the office he'd gone into the toilet and blood had been hosing out of his John Thomas. If he'd have told me that I'd have got in the taxi with him and I might have been a little less calm when the lift jammed! By the time he got to the hospital he was covered in blood. And all from a simple slide onto the top tube.

* Writing that sentence has just reminded me of another incident where a friend of my girlfriend slipped off onto the top tube and burst one of her labs!