Show stopping knee pains

Bobster90

Never had this before starting to get worried wondering if anyone has any experience on this and can hopefully tell me i'v been a idiot but I will heal back 100% and can learn from it.

So i'm 24 and have been doing XC mountain biking for 3 years and loving it only doing 20ish miles once a weekend, but recently i'v upped my training and have been doing 30-40 mins turbo training twice (in top gear bad I now know) a week for the past 6 months.

My fitness and climbing is currently at a personal all time high so last week I had a week off work and accumulated up to 80 miles and done two 1 hour turbo sessions in the week, well over what i'm used to and I felt okay apart from some muscle aches and knee pains by the end of the week.

Its been 5 days of rest and the muscle aches have gone but my knees are trashed i'v had to go to work for 4 days but having today off to fully take the weight off my knees and will have the weekend to sit about and rest. After that If I still have the pains in my knees I was going to see the doc.

It's hard to tell where the pains are coming from but I would say its mainly around the knee caps and at the bottom of the cap, feels better if i'm walking slowly but stairs are a nightmare, Iv started taking ibuprofen and applying some gel since day 3 of the pains and its hardly had any effect. My knees don't look or feel swollen and don't particularly hurt on any area to touch.

So did I overdo it? my knees where very strong and had no twinges or pains during or after any rides before this high intensity week. Should I keep off the bike for another week? If the pains go I will ease back in and change the way I train (lower gears higher RPM)

Hope someone can give their opinion will be much appreciated, thanks

Bob

kajjal

If carries on you may want to seek medical advice just in case.

Two factors that contribute to this are over exercising and bike setup. It sounds like you have overdone it, warming up and rest are as important to fitness as the actual exercise. Best to just listen to your body.

The other thing is the longer / harder you ride the better your bike setup needs to be. This is more obvious on road bikes but also true for mountain bikes. Until I set it up properly my road bike after about an hour gave me knee, ankle, saddle and back pain. Now I can ride it hard for hours with no injury or pain. This helped me improve the setup of my mountain bike which only previous gave me any strains if I really sprinted hard for longer stretches and now gives me no problems at all.

Ferrals

I have no medical knowledge so don't treat this as gospel, but i have had lots of issues with my ankles, shoulders and knees so here is my experiance

1) if it persists, dont bother going and seeing a doctor they will probably just say take painkillers, lay out £20-30 to see a decent physio.

2) over-exersizing makes your muscles tired, and so they dont hold your joints in place, you get a bit of rubbing and it inflames, iboprofen and rest should deal with this. build up training slowly.

3) muscle imbalance, this is what caused havoc with my shoulders from swimming and surfing too much, if you are excersizing a set of muscles that move in one direction you have to excersize the set that move in the opposite diection to support your joints. I'm not sure if this applies to knees in the same way, but try to mix things up so one muscle group isnt eting disproportonatley powerful.

4) I've found lots of stretching (once rested after initial pain and with a gentle warm up) has cured any knee pain i've ever had. have a look at IT band stretches.

Bobster90

Thanks for the reply, its took this injury to make me aware of just how important is to take care of your joints and learn what i'v been doing wrong the past 6 months, turbo training in top gears with little or no stretches warm up or cool down's and doing 30 second sprints and 2 min cool downs all in highest possible resistance ans gears is absolute abuse to the knees and cant believe I got this far without pains.

I haven't got my turbo training bike or my mtb bike professionally fitted only from what I feel comfortable with but have not felt any pains during or after rides or turbo training for 3 years so i'm really hoping I have just strained them over the week rather then cause permanent damage. :oops:

edit: I have a 60 mile off road ride coming up in 3 weeks looking like a cancel really don't fancy doing more damage.

kajjal

I setup my bikes myself after reading up on the web which was a very useful experience. It sounds like you have not warmed up properly and severely overdone it. Have a read on the web about training and if you ignore the obsessive types there is a lot of good advice and idea's out there.

May be worth a trip to your GP to see what help and advice they can give. Most will discuss things over the phone first if that is easier.

Bobster90

2) over-exersizing makes your muscles tired, and so they dont hold your joints in place, you get a bit of rubbing and it inflames, iboprofen and rest should deal with this. build up training slowly.

Sounds like I got a case of this maybe, going to rest for as long as it takes got the rest of my life to keep fitness up same can't be said for having strong knees. I'm going to do a complete overhaul of my training techniques and riding positions when/if the pains subside. will definitely be seeing the physio if the pains continue into next week.

Ferrals

I had really bad left knee pains from over exercizing, have a go at some IT band stretches (http://www.runnersworld.com/injury-trea ... d-syndrome). I just do the foam roller and stretch 3, and it really helps. i found the other stretches pulled my knees a bit

FWIW I mountainbiked obssesively from the ages of 12 to 18 and never once stretched down, my flexibility was shot and I'm still having issues with flexibility from it in my mid thirties.

steve6690

I have an imbalance which causes problems with my right knee and achilles tendon if I don't stretch and foam roll. Recently my right knee started to ache after sessions on the turbo ( 4 a week at the moment ). I'd been too lazy to foam roll my IT band and quads before each session and the knee flared up again. Prior to the last session I hit the foam roller again and there was no pain whatsoever afterwards.
Try a cheap foam roller and do some stretches - you may find it cures the problem.

Bobster90

Thanks for that, the pain currently feels too intense to be doing stretches although I will look into them when the pain eases, as I sit here and move my legs around to feel where the pain is coming from its like a sharp stabbing pain sometimes on the top of my knee caps and at the bottom but nothing behind my knees, my left knee feels a bit worse maybe because its my strongest/leading leg.

Also although I said in my first post my leg aches have gone I do detect muscle fatigue and tightness still in my legs especially around the knees.

marcus'73

I recommend going to a Sports Physio. I was doing a programme of stretches given to me by an NHS Physio and they helped with my tendons in the back of my knee (the initial problem) at least in the short term but they were exacerbating tightness in IT bands which was pulling on my knee cap. Now I have sports massages periodically, use a foam roller daily and it is manageable as long as I don't run my seat too low for too long- I've switched to a dropper post which helps a lot as well. My Physio also recommended a product called Biofreeze and icing after exercise both of which I use as soon as I get back from a ride. Apparently I'm stuck with it as long as I ride a lot as I'm 40 it won't get any better unless I reduce the intensity.

martinmeatpie

Firstly the others are right. forget NHS pay for a sports physio for true advice and diagnosis. I stumbled across Body Geometry Fitting when I first got my 29er. Was not going to pay for it like some centres offer. Found a guide on line ( cant remember where at the mo. ) but it showed pedal stroke /back/ arms position and angle on bends foot and cleat angles. brake lever angle and position/saddle/bars/stem length everything. Spent 2 hours or more with my bike in the dining room in front of tele setting it up. I tell you I noticed the difference straight away as I did a 25 mile trip on a route I do on old railway lines and canal paths and it only felt like 12. Control was better. But most of all my power to pedal changed a lot. Didn't feel I was having to use my legs so hard. So worth a look. If I remember site will let you know.

ALS8

Did you hear a 'pop' at any point? It is possible that you have a meniscus tear. Meniscus tears are the most common type of knee injury. The meniscus consists of 2 pads that disperse friction in the knee joint and if a twisting action was involved at the time you started to notice the pain, than a tear could be the cause. I work as a soft tissue treatment adviser and I hear of similar symptoms every day. The best thing to be doing, regardless of what the injury is, is putting cold compresses on it to reduce the inflammation and swelling. This will also help relieve related pain. You want to get down as much inflammation as possible. If the inflammation is always present, it forms a barrier and blocks the bodies natural ability to bring blood flow to the area. I highly recommend looking into the BFST Knee wrap. It promotes circulation to help accelerate your healing. The bodies natural ability to do this is quite slow....especially to the knee. I've included a link for more information.
http://www.kingbrand.com/Knee-Injury-Tr ... =1105PV102
http://www.kingbrand.com/Meniscus_Tear.php?REF=1105PV11

Bobster90

Well I was still having pains last week, mostly when I'm sitting down for long periods on the computer or at work where I'm constantly up and down step ladders and stairs. So decided to see a physio she done some knee motion tests and then wrestled my legs twisting them until I felt pain but awkwardly I never felt pain through the whole session even when she had all her weight on my leg and I tried to lift them up on a chair, which is obviously good news and she finally put it down to strained IT bands.

She gave me some knee strengthening exercises and told me not to train until the pain has completely gone although I cant be bothered to do the exercises as they look like they just hand them out to everyone and their NHS exercises for some reason. so no training or riding for me for a few more weeks as they still ache now and then.

Bobster90

ALS8 wrote:

Did you hear a 'pop' at any point? It is possible that you have a meniscus tear. Meniscus tears are the most common type of knee injury. The meniscus consists of 2 pads that disperse friction in the knee joint and if a twisting action was involved at the time you started to notice the pain, than a tear could be the cause. I work as a soft tissue treatment adviser and I hear of similar symptoms every day. The best thing to be doing, regardless of what the injury is, is putting cold compresses on it to reduce the inflammation and swelling. This will also help relieve related pain. You want to get down as much inflammation as possible. If the inflammation is always present, it forms a barrier and blocks the bodies natural ability to bring blood flow to the area. I highly recommend looking into the BFST Knee wrap. It promotes circulation to help accelerate your healing. The bodies natural ability to do this is quite slow....especially to the knee. I've included a link for more information.
http://www.kingbrand.com/Knee-Injury-Tr ... EF=46PV102
http://www.kingbrand.com/Meniscus_Tear.php?REF=46PV11

]


Thanks for the link I'll have a look at that. I didn't hear or feel any pops just a gradually come on after the week of high intense riding and eventually got so bad I couldn't ride anymore or walk fast for 2 weeks now I'm just left with knee pains now and then if I sit for too long or stand in one spot for too long or up and down stairs.

marcus'73

It is worth doing the exercises. Especially the ones with a roller I "rested" for a week when I first injured myself and first ride back the pain returned, so I gave up and rested six month's before I pulled the bike out and thought I'd give it another go and the pains returned straight away so I sought professional help. That was 4 years ago and as above I still have to manage it - but as long as I do the exercises and take care with the putting ice on etc. it's alright. Last summer I did a back to back trip to Glentress then Spain and rode pretty hard 7 out of 10 days with no ill effects. Only real problem I've had was after I walked Hadrian's Wall a month later then went straight out on the bike the next day and that set me back for a couple of weeks even after Sports massages.

Bobster90

That really sucks, makes you wish you would have appreciated not having these pains but its only until something goes wrong. The pains are minimal now in day to day life and work but each day is different, I haven't ridden the bike properly in 6 weeks nor have I trained, so I don't know if its going to be a reoccurring problem after every ride or training session.

I'm building a log cabin in my back garden which will house a turbo trainer, rowing machine and cross trainer. I figured the cross trainer will be a good replacement from doing them boring knee exercises the NHS hands out. Will start small only in zone 1&2 heart rate on the turbo trainer for 30-40 mins, no intervals for 2-3 months and lots of good warm ups and stretching after.

hopefully this will rebuild my strength, I am only 24 and the physician did say there was no joint damage only muscle strain which pulled on the knees. So hopefully I can still get away with this and can continue as before but alot smarter.

trekvet

AS it didn't come on at the time but afterwards I would suggest quad stretches, particularly as muscle strain is mentioned. Look, when the muscles have been pulled/strained they recover full of scar tissue so now you have to stretch to turn the scar tissue into muscle fibre (it won't happen by itself). Build up to grab foot and hold till heel touches butt, then float knee back a couple inches and hold till heel again touches butt; which stretches top of quads. For pain below kneecap do shin stretches, by walking slowly to front door on heels only and back on the toes, do a couple of times.

Bobster90

I'll give them a go, can I just do these stretches whenever and on cold muscles? and how long for?

cheers

trekvet

"stretches whenever and on cold muscles? and how long for?"

I do mine predominately in the bedroom before turning in, as that way any new inflammation is settled before you use it (in the morning). Common sense I call it.

They respond better when warmed up.

For each stretch on the internet it says 20-30 secs, but I said "Build up to" and "till" and "slowly". So start with 15 secs. and probably end up with 60secs or so in a month or so. A stretch too far and you back to square one. You have to play it by ear.

For stretching could be months or years (for a tight knee following plantar faciitis I'm 10years in and not finished yet).