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knocked off bike, driver switched insurance

gingamangingaman Posts: 576
edited April 2014 in Commuting chat
Morning all.

I was knocked off my bike a week ago, bike is a write off. I am fine apart from a large amount of bruising. I just had a call from the driver that hit me saying she has had someone else claim on her insurance recently and so has switched providers, and as she doesnt want to hit the new insurers with a claim in the first few weeks has asked I send the bill to her.

She has already started to change her story slightly since the event and sounds like she is trying to pull a fast one, should I sent the bill direct to her or continue through my (and her) insurer?

Anyone else had similar experience to this and can offer advice?
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  • DavdandyDavdandy Posts: 571
    She says she will pay the bill,oh yeah.But what about your injuries,is she paying for that too.

    Sounds dodgy to me.Although i hate insurance companies and the fake `where there is a blame there's a claim` culture i think you should stick to your guns and proceed as normal through your company insurance.
    Cannondale CAAD 8 105
    Rockrider 8.1
  • That you're asking the question suggests you'd feel better erring on the side of caution and let the insurers resolve the matter and I'd say go with that feeling.

    There's a reason why those who cause accidents have higher insurance premiums and it's a lesson she needs to learn. Looking to save herself a few pennies having endangered a life is such a discordant view as to what's important in such situations.
  • rjsterryrjsterry Posts: 17,952
    Don't see why you can't send her a copy of the replacement bill, but continue to pursue the matter via her insurers as a back up. In any case, her new insurers will be aware of her claim from the previous insurer - pretty sure that's a standard question when taking out a new policy.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.
  • First.AspectFirst.Aspect Posts: 4,308
    Strictly speaking, she's asking you to participate in insurance fraud. Effectively, she keeps having accidents but wants to pay for insurance on the basis of being a better driver than she actually is.

    This said, only you know whether it was her fault or not, and only you know whether it really is just property damage and some inconvenient bruising.

    In practice, if you would prefer to avoid that I suppose you could give the alternative a go, and proceed via insurance later if she baulks at the cost. Any way you could communicate with her by email, so you at least have a record of her tacit acknowledgement of fault?
  • Doris DayDoris Day Posts: 83
    Was the police informed when the accident took place?
    Your better off going through the insurer. Contact CTC or British cycling if you are a member CTC may
    be able to give you advice.
  • timothywtimothyw Posts: 2,482
    This person has caused two accidents recently and is now trying to commit insurance fraud to avoid having to pay the higher premiums that they ought be paying.

    They shouldn't even still be driving, never mind paying higher premiums.

    If it isn't going to bother you that this person is still on the road, then pick a number that will cover your replacement bike, helmet and any other gear, as well as any additional transport costs incurred while you have been injured, and get them to pay up immediately, preferably in cash to avoid any cheque clearance delays/shenanigans.

    If they aren't willing to do that within a few days then you know how serious the offer is don't you, or if they're trying to pull a fast one (as seems entirely possible, given that is what they are doing to their insurer...)

    Otherwise, do the right thing and go via their insurance.
  • Doris DayDoris Day Posts: 83
    Just to add. Her insurance is going to rocket anyhow if the accident was reported. Try to interact with her via email as that way you will have proof that she admits her part of the accident.
  • veronese68veronese68 Posts: 22,787 Lives Here
    I suspect the driver has no idea of how much it could all add up to. If you go through insurance they will also claim for all expenses including travel whilst you are without a bike, damage to the bike and belongings etc. That will add up to quite a bit before you even get into personal injury.
    I'd have a really good think about all the extra costs you have incurred and add that on to the value of the bike if it is written off. I suspect she will try to run a mile.
    Good luck, I hope it works out for you.
  • steve6690steve6690 Posts: 190
    By not reporting the collision to her insurers she is not complying with the terms of her contract, and if she doesn't mention it at renewal time then it's technically fraud. None of this is your concern though, but ask yourself this - do you want to rely on her word that she'll pay up ? She's already proved that she's dishonest.
    IMHO get your insurers to handle it asap, or go and see a personal injury solicitor. If you really want to give her a chance then get a proper examination on your bike and a quote for any repairs. Add a bit on for your time/pain/etc and give her 24 hours to pay.
  • rick_chaseyrick_chasey Posts: 50,040 Lives Here
    gingaman wrote:
    Morning all.

    I was knocked off my bike a week ago, bike is a write off. I am fine apart from a large amount of bruising. I just had a call from the driver that hit me saying she has had someone else claim on her insurance recently and so has switched providers, and as she doesnt want to hit the new insurers with a claim in the first few weeks has asked I send the bill to her.

    She has already started to change her story slightly since the event and sounds like she is trying to pull a fast one, should I sent the bill direct to her or continue through my (and her) insurer?

    Anyone else had similar experience to this and can offer advice?

    I think you should make it quite clear to her that the solution would have been to not do stuff that leads to people claiming on her insurance.

    Make it extremely clear that the most hassle free way of handling this is honestly and through the normal channels.

    Make the alternative seem horrific. Let her know you'll hound her like a dog until she stops arsing about and starts being honest and legitimate.
  • apreadingapreading Posts: 4,533
    I would tell her that you are going to let your insurance deal with it, but that you will notify them of her desire to settle direct, rather than claiming from her insurance. Then let your insurers deal with it.
  • redveeredvee Posts: 11,921
    She's obviously thinking that bikes are cheap to replace and that will be her only expense, she is wrong to think of this being the only expense. Quantifiable amounts in this instance are the costs to repair/replace your bike, figures that aren't quantifiable will be that of your injuries and other out of pocket expenses to get you back in the same position you were before the accident.
    Go through insurance company, if she insists on paying the settlement herself inflate the figure greatly and tell her it's to cover injuries both obvious and hidden that might surface in years to come and also for out of pocket expenses.
    I've added a signature to prove it is still possible.
  • cedargreencedargreen Posts: 189
    Are you sure she is actually insured?
    The story about switching providers because of a recent claim doesn't make any sense. I switched recently and the first question was whether I had had any claims/accidents/convictions/penalty points in the last five years and the second question was the policy number from my previous insurer, so the new insurer (if she has one) should be aware of her previous claim.
    It sounds as if she is either not insured or trying to commit insurance fraud by failing to notify insurers of 'accidents' including the one injuring you.
    As previous posters have suggested, contact her only be email and make it clear you will pursue her relentlessly.
    As a cyclist, I wouldn't do a single thing to make the life of this irresponsible motorist any easier.
  • ColinthecopColinthecop Posts: 996
    Alternatively, her insurance may just have been up for renewal, old insurer wanted X+Y so she shopped around and found one who wanted X despite disclosing the previous accident.

    May not be as dodgy as people think.
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 12,624
    As has been said above, she probably thinks a bike will only cost £100 or so so much could it be? Certainly not worth the hassle of insurance. For her, in her eyes.

    This is why I joined British Cycling, would let them handle it, and recommend that everyone does the same.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • DonDaddyDDonDaddyD Posts: 12,689
    gingaman wrote:
    Morning all.

    I was knocked off my bike a week ago, bike is a write off. I am fine apart from a large amount of bruising. I just had a call from the driver that hit me saying she has had someone else claim on her insurance recently and so has switched providers, and as she doesnt want to hit the new insurers with a claim in the first few weeks has asked I send the bill to her.

    She has already started to change her story slightly since the event and sounds like she is trying to pull a fast one, should I sent the bill direct to her or continue through my (and her) insurer?

    Anyone else had similar experience to this and can offer advice?

    Fu*k her, go through her insurance and let your insurers legal team take her to visit the cleaners.

    She clearly hasn't learned from her previous collision which led to a claim on her previous insurers.

    And even if this isn't your mindset relying on her to fix the damage is going to prove a hassle. Just claim, your not being an A-hole if you do.
    Food Chain number = 4

    A true scalp is not only overtaking someone but leaving them stopped at a set of lights. As you, who have clearly beaten the lights, pummels nothing but the open air ahead. ~ 'DondaddyD'. Player of the Unspoken Game
  • fat_tailfat_tail Posts: 786
    Alternatively, her insurance may just have been up for renewal, old insurer wanted X+Y so she shopped around and found one who wanted X despite disclosing the previous accident.

    May not be as dodgy as people think.

    I agree - some of the comments here have got the driver committing "insurance fraud". I don't think there is anything wrong with not going through your insurer if you can avoid doing so - by the time you factor in the excess and the increase in insurance premium it may be a better option to settle out of your own funds.
    Ridley Fenix SL
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 20,362
    Alternatively, her insurance may just have been up for renewal, old insurer wanted X+Y so she shopped around and found one who wanted X despite disclosing the previous accident.

    May not be as dodgy as people think.

    Agreed, i did that after I acquired some naughty boy points that led to a certain company putting my premium up by £1000. I found another one very easily which was actually a tad less than I had been paying before.

    However, avoiding the insurance is certainly dodgy and I reckon it's best to play this by the book
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • d.martd.mart Posts: 88
    She could be the driver in a thread like this next time:

    viewtopic.php?f=40012&t=12958651

    Now do the right thing and carry on through insurance
  • PufftmwPufftmw Posts: 1,941
    You should persue the claim through the insurer she was covered by when you had the accident. Changing insurers after an accident is not possible as the risk (ie her) was covered by one insurer up until the time she switched, so the new one won't cover her.

    If, on the other hand, she just wants to keep her insurance premiums down, then there is nothing wrong with dealing with her outside of her insurance company. You still have the option of going to her insurers, as has she, if she decides that the claim is more than she is willing to pay (cash) for.

    About 1990 some bloke did a u-turn into the front of my Granada Scorpio at a straight ahead only traffic light and did (at rates then) £850 damage. His car was a crappy beaten up Ford Escort. The police had been, were satisfied he was legit and insured but he rang up and offered to pay cash. I was a bit dubious but I went and got 3 quotes, went for the middle one and told him. Him and his wife turned up in the office in their finest with cash as promised. I didn't lose out and he was happy.

    At the end of the day, insurance is about getting you back to the state you were before the accident & no losses because of it, so in this case a similar bike in as good as condition and maybe something reasonable for pain/suffering (we are talking soft-tissue injuries) is what you should be seeking.
  • redveeredvee Posts: 11,921
    Pufftmw wrote:
    At the end of the day, insurance is about getting you back to the state you were before the accident & no losses because of it, so in this case a similar bike in as good as condition and maybe something reasonable for pain/suffering (we are talking soft-tissue injuries) is what you should be seeking.

    The injuries made up for 75% of my £2k win, mainly cuts & bruises but I did break a nasal bone when I headbutted the pavement.
    I've added a signature to prove it is still possible.
  • sleechessleeches Posts: 14
    Let your insurer deal with it - her problems are not your problems.

    Your claim will include full costs of repair plus some for your injuries, both of which are at risk if you decide to deal direct. You have nothing to gain for dealing direct and everything to lose, including loss of any right of appeal if things don't go as you expected.

    Dealing direct is not insurance fraud, and as others have pointed out, can be more efficient than going through the formal claims process, but it carries risks which you need to consider before jumping in.
  • bompingtonbompington Posts: 7,278
    sleeches wrote:
    Dealing direct is not insurance fraud
    Now I'm not fully conversant with all this, but assuming that's true, all insurance companies insist that you disclose any accidents, whether you claim or not - so how would it actually help you to pay up yourself, if not with the intention to commit fraud by hiding the accident?
  • apreadingapreading Posts: 4,533
    If you have had an accident which didnt result in a claim, that is not as bad for the insurers as an accident that DID result in a claim. Quite simple really. You have shown a propensity to settle direct and keep the costs/risk to the insurance company to a minimum. This *could* even mean that you are a lower risk to insurers than someone who has never had an accident, funny as it might seem. It also means your no-claims is not affected.

    But you can still use the insurance companies for the negotiation and she can decide to settle the costs direct rather than claim on her insurance, surely?
  • bompingtonbompington Posts: 7,278
    apreading wrote:
    If you have had an accident which didnt result in a claim, that is not as bad for the insurers as an accident that DID result in a claim. Quite simple really. You have shown a propensity to settle direct and keep the costs/risk to the insurance company to a minimum. This *could* even mean that you are a lower risk to insurers than someone who has never had an accident, funny as it might seem. It also means your no-claims is not affected.

    But you can still use the insurance companies for the negotiation and she can decide to settle the costs direct rather than claim on her insurance, surely?
    Are you basing this on knowledge of how insurance companies actually operate, or are you just guessing?
    Personally I would guess that "you have shown a propensity for evading the normal procedures and hushing things up" is more what they would think.
  • apreadingapreading Posts: 4,533
    I had a load of rocks thrown at my car when I drove past a gypsy site. Multiple stone chips and cracked windscreen. Then windscreen was covered (after an excess) and did not affect my no-claims or policy price. I costed a proper repair for the chips but then someone said they could just touch them up for £25 (its a 10 year old car now) so told the insurance company that I didnt want to claim and would sort it myself.

    No evasion or fraud there and nothing being hushed up.

    The only evasion or fraud is if she does not let the insurance company know it happened. There is no binding agreement that they settle all accidents and you HAVE to claim. They are more than happy if you tell them that you dont want to claim and will settle direct.
  • sleechessleeches Posts: 14
    bompington wrote:
    sleeches wrote:
    Dealing direct is not insurance fraud
    Now I'm not fully conversant with all this, but assuming that's true, all insurance companies insist that you disclose any accidents, whether you claim or not - so how would it actually help you to pay up yourself, if not with the intention to commit fraud by hiding the accident?

    Direct settlement is not fraud - but failure to disclose accidents is.

    An insured may want to settle direct to get a better figure - i.e. minimal personal injury payouts, or cheaper repairs than "approved" suppliers, or just because its quicker. A claimant may wish to accept because it's quicker, easier, don't want to claim for personal injury etc. Both parties have to agree.

    My point was that if you decide to go down this route then you should accept that you lose all protection that your insurance policy gave you - either as an insured or as a claimant.
  • fossyantfossyant Posts: 2,549
    Do what you need to do to cover your own ar$e !!
  • rolf_frolf_f Posts: 15,959
    fossyant wrote:
    Do what you need to do to cover your own ar$e !!

    What on earth has not forgetting to put your trousers on got to do with this?!
    Faster than a tent.......
  • gingamangingaman Posts: 576
    Thanks for the replies, all.

    In the end I went for the settlement, after advice from my insurers (through British cycling), and my employer (the bike is through Cyclescheme, so belongs to them).

    The driver paid up within hours of receiving the invoice and the matter is settled satisfactorily.
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