Do it all....... er...... hardtail?

son1

It's time to upgrade my trusty fury hardtail. Been a great steed this past two years. Been trawling through post after post but just seem to add another bike to the list instead of whittling it down.

I'm after something that climbs well, gives confidence on the descents lightish and most of all fun. My budget's a nice round grand. I'm 6ft 1 and 15 stone (in heavy shoes) riding a medium fury.

In my head currently is: carbon 456, ragley Marley, piglet, blue pig, whyte 901/905 and a curve ball that is a giant anthem 29er. Don't mind building up or using 2nd hand parts.

Would like to hear your experiences with the above or anything similar?

brucie45

I understand your frustrations, I went for something a little different (see my sig) while faced with the same predicament. This really is my do it all bike, I commute on it, attempt DH lines, black trails, towpaths etc etc.

If it were my choice on a £1k budget I'd be leaning more towards the On-One 45650B Deore version, add a Reverb for £150 and it really is going to handle most things you chuck at it.

kevinharley

brucie45 wrote:

If it were my choice on a £1k budget I'd be leaning more towards the On-One 45650B Deore version, add a Reverb for £150 and it really is going to handle most things you chuck at it.

^^^^ This!

(But then, if you've been reading all these 'what HT threads' recently, you'll already know that I'd recommend it, as this is what I've just got!)

The new Carbon 456 will get you 'lighter', but is already £100 over your budget, and that's without a dropper (if that's your thing!) FWIW, I reckon a dropper is worth the extra ... and I'm a recent convert from someone who used to be a bit 'sniffy' about lowering your saddle for steeper stuff ... always used to figure that if you can't ride (mince, in my case) down stuff with the seat at the right height, you should get off and walk! But having experienced a dropper for a few weeks, I've errr ... revised my opinion, and its a nice thing to have!

£1k will also get you a very good spec used HT, or a bike built up with used bits and pieces ... if you can be bothered to wait! Personally, I think the spec of either of the On One's is hard to beat at the price ... plus its new and runs nice and smoothly ... and you can always upgrade to better / lighter stuff as things wear out.

son1

sweet lookin bike, loving the tyres. Prob leaning towards an on one. I reckon 130mm forks will b plenty for me. Have crests on Superstar hubs on the fury, would I need something stronger on my new build and is the general consensus that 650b is the future?

brucie45

kevinharley wrote:

brucie45 wrote:

If it were my choice on a £1k budget I'd be leaning more towards the On-One 45650B Deore version, add a Reverb for £150 and it really is going to handle most things you chuck at it.

^^^^ This!

(But then, if you've been reading all these 'what HT threads' recently, you'll already know that I'd recommend it, as this is what I've just got!)

The new Carbon 456 will get you 'lighter', but is already £100 over your budget, and that's without a dropper (if that's your thing!) FWIW, I reckon a dropper is worth the extra ... and I'm a recent convert from someone who used to be a bit 'sniffy' about lowering your saddle for steeper stuff ... always used to figure that if you can't ride (mince, in my case) down stuff with the seat at the right height, you should get off and walk! But having experienced a dropper for a few weeks, I've errr ... revised my opinion, and its a nice thing to have!

£1k will also get you a very good spec used HT, or a bike built up with used bits and pieces ... if you can be bothered to wait! Personally, I think the spec of either of the On One's is hard to beat at the price ... plus its new and runs nice and smoothly ... and you can always upgrade to better / lighter stuff as things wear out.

At that price I think it's unbeatable for what the OP's after. I did see that you had done that too

chrisw333

At the price you may as well get the built bike. I doubt you'll do it cheaper.

brucie45

son1 wrote:

sweet lookin bike, loving the tyres. Prob leaning towards an on one. I reckon 130mm forks will b plenty for me. Have crests on Superstar hubs on the fury, would I need something stronger on my new build and is the general consensus that 650b is the future?

Crests will cope with a lot more than xc but without knowing your rididng type, weight etc its hard to say whether you should upgrade. I went with Flows as I'm quite heavy and ride my riding style is hard on components. 650b does seem to becoming very popular but 26" wont be going anytime soon!

kevinharley

son1 wrote:

Prob leaning towards an on one. I reckon 130mm forks will b plenty for me.

The On One has 140 RS Sektors! 8)

son1 wrote:

is the general consensus that 650b is the future?

Who knows? I think there is a small, but noticeable difference in 'rollover' ability, and in traction up steeper nadgery climbs compared to the 26" Boardman I previously owned ... but some of this is undoubtedly also down to the slightly bigger volume tyres the On One has ...

Yes, I succumbed to the 650b ... but not because "I must have the newest thing" (29ers were "the newest thing" a while ago ... and I let that one pass me by! ) ... but seeing as I was in the market for a new bike, and the On One was such a decent spec for the money, it just made sense to me. Had the new Carbon 456 been on sale at the time I placed my order, it may well have been a different story ... although swinging a further £200 past the wife would also have been a different story!!

rockmonkeysc

The On One frame is no better than the Fury. I would spend the money on upgrading what you have with an XT groupset and some Rockshox Revelation forks. You will end up with a much lighter and better bike than the 456.
On One are good value but their frames weigh a ton and the paint isn't great. They haven't got any of the damping qualities that steel frames used to have.

chrisw333

Can a fury take 140mm forks?

kevinharley

RockmonkeySC wrote:

The On One frame is no better than the Fury. I would spend the money on upgrading what you have with an XT groupset and some Rockshox Revelation forks. You will end up with a much lighter and better bike than the 456.
On One are good value but their frames weigh a ton and the paint isn't great. They haven't got any of the damping qualities that steel frames used to have.

Whilst manufacturer claimed weights are to be taken with a pinch of salt, On One quote a weight for the 45650b of 13kg (full bike!); Halfords quote 13.1kg for the Fury (which, as a 26" wheel version, would be a little lighter than an equivalent 650 wheeler)

So, whilst the Fury frame is probably a little lighter, its not going to be particularly noticeable IMHO, particularly as the OP is 15st. XT kit will make it lighter still, admittedly ... but I wouldn't plug a RS Revelation (140mm?) into the front of a Fury frame, unless you can adjust it down to 120mm ... in which case what's the point?

And as regards the paint ... its an MTB .. it will get scratched and scraped ... or you can heli-tape it ... or even better, get the On One in 'Super Raw' (unpainted!) finish, which looks fabulous IMO!!

son1

hmm... guess i should've mentioned I'm running xt mech cassette and rotors and slx 9 speed gears on the fury along with crests ( tubeless and sealant) so its prob as light as it'll be. Wouldnt dream of shelling out for new forks on it, as quite like the epicons. never had a problem with them and dont know why they get such a bad rep, pretty decent forks in my eyes. Could probably do with more travel at times though to suit my style and heft. If I got a new frame then I'd get new forks. The drivetrain on mines relatively new but fancied going 10speed maybe 1x10. Decisions…..

lancew

With that On-one frame take a stealth dropper or do you have to drill it?

son1

Took a quick look and I see those On-One 45650B are sold out. The carbon 26 inch isn't massively lighter than the bigger wheeled steel one.

brucie45

Lancew wrote:

With that On-one frame take a stealth dropper or do you have to drill it?

I wouldn't be taking a drill near any of my frames to be fair :shock:

BigAl

Judging by the current spec of your Fury, I'd be looking at getting a new frame & forks only

For your £1000, I'd go for a Cotic Bfe and some Revelations. You should have plenty enough left in the budget to upgrade to 1 x 10 SLX. Actually I'd go for a Soul but maybe the Bfe would be a better bet for a 15st fellah!

son1

So its Soul or 456…. Any love for the ragleys

rockmonkeysc

I don't think you can get a reverb to fit a 456 frame at all.
My 456 was well over it's claimed weight and had flakey paint. It took a lot of abuse but I wouldn't buy another one.

passout

Carbon 456 or if going steel them a Cotic Soul.

Tigger con carne

Bikedeals are posting that Marleys are going for £748 on CRC at the moment with the code on the front page.

Barrelmaker

RockmonkeySC wrote:

I don't think you can get a reverb to fit a 456 frame at all.
My 456 was well over it's claimed weight and had flakey paint. It took a lot of abuse but I wouldn't buy another one.

Newer ones are dropper compatible with 30.9 seat tube diameters.

son1

would I be better to wait for stock of the newer carbon 456 than plump for a 2nd hand older model?

The Rookie

kevinharley wrote:

So, whilst the Fury frame is probably a little lighter, its not going to be particularly noticeable IMHO,

The older Carrera frame (pre reinforcing between TT and seat tube) are about 1750g for a 16" frame, the later one I've weighed at just over 2Kg for an 18", the 456 frame (not 650B) is quoted at 2553g for a 16" - that's quite a lot heavier!

I too would be in the camp for some sensible upgrades to the Fury (limited to 120mm forks though, so that may not be what the OP wants), the One-one has a heavy frame and rather basic Deore drivetrain for it's price, other bits are much better though.

son1

Def had in my head to get a new frame, but if a steel or carbon frame won't improve the ride quality from what I have now then I'm not sure what to do. I thought with what I have now plus £1000 budget I would be able to improve quite a bit

The Rookie

Which model Fury do you have? With or without the small bridge from TT to seatpost?

The older frame is a good ally frame and can be taken quite far with sensible mods, unless you want more than 120mm of travel (a Q only you can answer) then it's worth sticking with, the later frame is heavier and feels a bit harsher to ride (tried 2). See links in my sig for some ideas.

If you want more than 120mm you have 3 choices
1/ New bike
2/ New frame and build it up how you want it
3/ New frame and forks and carry over stuff worth doing so from the Fury, sell what you are left with.

By New, it could be 'new to you' nothing wrong with good used parts as long as they do what you want.

You can do anything short of full on DH with a 120mm hardtail, but it won't be as good over rougher stuff than a slacker longer travelled bike, it will almost certainly climb and go cross country faster though - your priorities only you know.

Measuring up my frame I'm 90% certain I could build it as 650B with 2.25" tyres as long as I had no front mech....

rockmonkeysc

son1 wrote:

Def had in my head to get a new frame, but if a steel or carbon frame won't improve the ride quality from what I have now then I'm not sure what to do. I thought with what I have now plus £1000 budget I would be able to improve quite a bit

An On One steel frame definitely won't improve ride quality, they are very stiff (harsh) frames.

Ferrals

I've recently bought a whyte 901, bear in mind i'm returning to mtb after a long time so my skills and confidence are rusty, but it certainly hasn't felt limited against anything I've tried to ride, including some local DH tracks.

son1

Yeah I have the newer white fury with the little bridge. I can pick up an unused ragley blue pig frame locally for cheap money if that makes a difference. Is there much difference in 26, 27.5 and 29er forks or must they be used for the proper wheel size

The Rookie

The arch moves further from the axle to accomodate the bigger wheel (well tyre strictly), most 26" forks won't take larger (will take a 650B with just about zero mud clearance), a 650B fork will take a 26" if you are future protecting (some manufacturers look likely to drop the 26" specific fork and sell you a 650B fork for both wheel sizes, after all it's only 1/2" difference), a 29er fork I'd only use on a 29er.

A Blue pig frame is much nicer than an on-one (IMHO) but will still be heavier than alloy, heavier than the piglet frame as well.

son1

Ok so probably rule out steel and 29er. Carbon 456 or an Alu whyte. Now we're getting somewhere. Anyone know if whyte frames are the same across the range. Next step 120 or 140 fork

benpinnick

Bird Zero

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Go on sale in about 10 days. Plug over!