Career Change Part Deux

mr_goo

Since reading and contributing in part to the original thread I would like to start a serious discussion on this topic. In particular for those in their 40s & 50s.

As the retirement age is gradually disappearing over the horizon for many of us (me very much included in this). Plus the government want the ageing population to continue contributing to the coffers of the IR. My big question is this. Where is the support program to support the future older worker? By this I mean there are many, many people in jobs in their 40s & 50s that will not be able to carry out their current role as the years roll on. I also expect the retirement age will eventually creep up to 70.

In my role as a rep covering the South/South West, I cannot see myself driving up to a 1000 miles per week much beyond the age of 55 (not withstanding that I do dislike my job). Talking to one of my fellow cyclists who is a builder in his mid 40s, he too has said that physically he cannot carry on much longer and would like to re-train, but is unable due to financial commitments.
I also recall that before Christmas this became an issue with the Fire Service, where the senior offices are stating that a fireman in his 60s cannot be expected to climb ladders to rescue people in peril.

The key problem with anyone in this age bracket is that with few exceptions we are all financially committed to providing a roof over the head and food on the table for our families. Not many are financially rewarded to the extent where funds can be set aside to finance a break to re-train for a couple of years. Therefore if we are to work up to and beyond 70 where is the support mechanism to ensure that we can? Unless we are all expected to stack shelves, work in B&Q or become a barista.

Your thoughts ladies and gentlemen.

BelgianBeerGeek

Mr Goos agency for the middle-aged bloke moving to a new career?
Seriously, I think you have answered your own question.

mm1

There are some over 50's employment agencies, haven't tried them yet will report back when / if I do. Having just been pensioned off at 54, I'd like to try something new. there is an adult careers service where I live (Cambridgeshire) which is unusual, but initial contact suggests they're not up to much. The Employment Service (Joke Centre) seems to be focused on bullying people off benefits so I haven't bothered.

Mikey23

Missus intends to work beyond 60 as a primary teacher even though she could retire with a good pension and lump sum. It doesn't seem that there is any ground between the extreme mental and physical demands of classroom teaching and all the admin and prep work that goes with it ... And sitting at home doing nowt and watching daytime tv. So I would like to sign her up for your agency!

slowmart

Why don't we all club together in a peer to peer lending group to self finance our semi retirement?


I would heartily propose acquiring property and conjoining three services, whores, cakes and a bike shop.

Bike and cakes down stairs with the knocking shop upstairs. The last two are recession proof and the third while viewed as a halo and ego project I would suggest the acquisition of bling bike bits being the main consideration.

The beauty of this is the working girls could bake the cakes between clients optimising their value as employees. Kerching

Who is in?

Stevo_666

Slowmart wrote:

Why don't we all club together in a peer to peer lending group to self finance our semi retirement?


I would heartily propose acquiring property and conjoining three services, whores, cakes and a bike shop.

Bike and cakes down stairs with the knocking shop upstairs. The last two are recession proof and the third while viewed as a halo and ego project I would suggest the acquisition of bling bike bits being the main consideration.

The beauty of this is the working girls could bake the cakes between clients optimising their value as employees. Kerching

Who is in?

Combining three of many peoples favourite activities in a business venture could have a lot of mileage. Motto could be 'Ride, eat, then ride and eat'

Mikey23

It has mileage...

VTech

The problem is that in the most, people are clouded to the financial apocalypse that is going to hit them in the not so distant future. Many people are going to be in a world of hurt as we simply can't finance the aged population.
I suggest that anyone who can should invest strongly in their own future as no one else will look after them. Those that can't should look towards something that will give them an edge, maybe an ability to be in a position where work will be doable at a greater age.

There is no real answer. Doom is on the way for most, regardless of choices made.

mamba80

VTech wrote:

The problem is that in the most, people are clouded to the financial apocalypse that is going to hit them in the not so distant future. Many people are going to be in a world of hurt as we simply can't finance the aged population.
I suggest that anyone who can should invest strongly in their own future as no one else will look after them. Those that can't should look towards something that will give them an edge, maybe an ability to be in a position where work will be doable at a greater age.

There is no real answer. Doom is on the way for most, regardless of choices made.

You are a cheery sort of chap aren't you?

VTech

mamba80 wrote:

VTech wrote:

The problem is that in the most, people are clouded to the financial apocalypse that is going to hit them in the not so distant future. Many people are going to be in a world of hurt as we simply can't finance the aged population.
I suggest that anyone who can should invest strongly in their own future as no one else will look after them. Those that can't should look towards something that will give them an edge, maybe an ability to be in a position where work will be doable at a greater age.

There is no real answer. Doom is on the way for most, regardless of choices made.

You are a cheery sort of chap aren't you?

I'm afraid that the truth is clear that there are a mix of people who are in total denial, are not willing to help themselves as they only think about today, those that do not help themselves as they make poor choices and those that do look after their future (very small amount of people in he last category)

It was actually a post I read in this forum from someone who said they were looking at a new type of work as they couldn't manage their current job of driving 1000miles a week into their 60's and 70's which made me post the earlier post on this thread. The reply he wrote was actually one of the most valid posts anyone has made on this forum about how to manage their future and many more should follow suit as the majority of us will be working into their 60's and 70's if they want some sort of standard of living.

WindyG

I agree with VTech, I am in my 40's and I won't be able to do my job into retirement so I have to start thinking ahead now and retrain, if I don't do it no one is going to help me and the future does look very bleak if I sit back and just wait to see what happens.

mr_goo

VTech wrote:

mamba80 wrote:

VTech wrote:

The problem is that in the most, people are clouded to the financial apocalypse that is going to hit them in the not so distant future. Many people are going to be in a world of hurt as we simply can't finance the aged population.
I suggest that anyone who can should invest strongly in their own future as no one else will look after them. Those that can't should look towards something that will give them an edge, maybe an ability to be in a position where work will be doable at a greater age.

There is no real answer. Doom is on the way for most, regardless of choices made.

You are a cheery sort of chap aren't you?

I'm afraid that the truth is clear that there are a mix of people who are in total denial, are not willing to help themselves as they only think about today, those that do not help themselves as they make poor choices and those that do look after their future (very small amount of people in he last category)

It was actually a post I read in this forum from someone who said they were looking at a new type of work as they couldn't manage their current job of driving 1000miles a week into their 60's and 70's which made me post the earlier post on this thread. The reply he wrote was actually one of the most valid posts anyone has made on this forum about how to manage their future and many more should follow suit as the majority of us will be working into their 60's and 70's if they want some sort of standard of living.

Err. That would have been me ( I think).

The problem that does need addressing is that nobody in government is discussing this and putting into a place a mechanism if you will that will enable the oldies to re-train. I am not expecting it for free, nothing ever is unless you live in Scotland or Wales.

There should be a counselling service for those in work and assistance in training. Period. This might seem a bit 'nanny state', but being provided with professional help/guidance in the current jobs market could be of great benefit in my opinion.

VTech

Mr Goo wrote:

VTech wrote:

mamba80 wrote:

VTech wrote:

The problem is that in the most, people are clouded to the financial apocalypse that is going to hit them in the not so distant future. Many people are going to be in a world of hurt as we simply can't finance the aged population.
I suggest that anyone who can should invest strongly in their own future as no one else will look after them. Those that can't should look towards something that will give them an edge, maybe an ability to be in a position where work will be doable at a greater age.

There is no real answer. Doom is on the way for most, regardless of choices made.

You are a cheery sort of chap aren't you?

I'm afraid that the truth is clear that there are a mix of people who are in total denial, are not willing to help themselves as they only think about today, those that do not help themselves as they make poor choices and those that do look after their future (very small amount of people in he last category)

It was actually a post I read in this forum from someone who said they were looking at a new type of work as they couldn't manage their current job of driving 1000miles a week into their 60's and 70's which made me post the earlier post on this thread. The reply he wrote was actually one of the most valid posts anyone has made on this forum about how to manage their future and many more should follow suit as the majority of us will be working into their 60's and 70's if they want some sort of standard of living.

Err. That would have been me ( I think).

The problem that does need addressing is that nobody in government is discussing this and putting into a place a mechanism if you will that will enable the oldies to re-train. I am not expecting it for free, nothing ever is unless you live in Scotland or Wales.

There should be a counselling service for those in work and assistance in training. Period. This might seem a bit 'nanny state', but being provided with professional help/guidance in the current jobs market could be of great benefit in my opinion.

In that case it was indeed very wise words

It's a shame that some people really do think they are ok because they will get a pension when there is no safety in that. I don't have a pension from a bank as I didn't trust them and I was found to be right where others may age and slightly older have lost huge chunks of savings trying to be safe !

I agree about the retraining but if they did open workshops you would just have a class of mid 40's - 60 year olds going for the same jobs you have hindered a going for now in there early 20's !

My advice is go out and do it yourself. I'm 41 and my 18 year old son is stronger, faster and sharper than me and the truth is that I never noticed the drop in all of those areas myself. That's the danger. None of us realise until it's too late.
I'm. It sure of the fix other than to go out and make your own chances but it would be hard for someone to take a pay it and go into a job that they can do into their 60's and 70's rather than sticking with slightly more money on a job they are already struggling with.

DeVlaeminck

I need to retrain, but in what I have no clue. I've fallen into part time work whilst doing most of the child rearing / house work etc whilst my partner's career has taken off a lot more and she has spent quite long hours at work - now they don't need me to walk them to school, read them a bed time story and all that stuff I find myself underemployed but with no real desire to try and expand what I do part time into a full time roll, especially since we just got a 20% pay cut!

fatsmoker

Guess I'm lucky in that respect. I could carry on doing what I do until 75. We do in fact have one teacher here in her 70s. She only does 5 hours a week, but it keeps her sane. Fingers crossed, it'll do the same for me, providing there are still thousands of Chinese teenagers who want a UK university education.

mr_goo

VTech wrote:

Mr Goo wrote:

VTech wrote:

mamba80 wrote:

VTech wrote:

The problem is that in the most, people are clouded to the financial apocalypse that is going to hit them in the not so distant future. Many people are going to be in a world of hurt as we simply can't finance the aged population.
I suggest that anyone who can should invest strongly in their own future as no one else will look after them. Those that can't should look towards something that will give them an edge, maybe an ability to be in a position where work will be doable at a greater age.

There is no real answer. Doom is on the way for most, regardless of choices made.

You are a cheery sort of chap aren't you?

I'm afraid that the truth is clear that there are a mix of people who are in total denial, are not willing to help themselves as they only think about today, those that do not help themselves as they make poor choices and those that do look after their future (very small amount of people in he last category)

It was actually a post I read in this forum from someone who said they were looking at a new type of work as they couldn't manage their current job of driving 1000miles a week into their 60's and 70's which made me post the earlier post on this thread. The reply he wrote was actually one of the most valid posts anyone has made on this forum about how to manage their future and many more should follow suit as the majority of us will be working into their 60's and 70's if they want some sort of standard of living.

Err. That would have been me ( I think).

The problem that does need addressing is that nobody in government is discussing this and putting into a place a mechanism if you will that will enable the oldies to re-train. I am not expecting it for free, nothing ever is unless you live in Scotland or Wales.

There should be a counselling service for those in work and assistance in training. Period. This might seem a bit 'nanny state', but being provided with professional help/guidance in the current jobs market could be of great benefit in my opinion.

In that case it was indeed very wise words

It's a shame that some people really do think they are ok because they will get a pension when there is no safety in that. I don't have a pension from a bank as I didn't trust them and I was found to be right where others may age and slightly older have lost huge chunks of savings trying to be safe !

I agree about the retraining but if they did open workshops you would just have a class of mid 40's - 60 year olds going for the same jobs you have hindered a going for now in there early 20's !

My advice is go out and do it yourself. I'm 41 and my 18 year old son is stronger, faster and sharper than me and the truth is that I never noticed the drop in all of those areas myself. That's the danger. None of us realise until it's too late.
I'm. It sure of the fix other than to go out and make your own chances but it would be hard for someone to take a pay it and go into a job that they can do into their 60's and 70's rather than sticking with slightly more money on a job they are already struggling with.

Same here. Son of 18 thinks I'm slow and not technically minded. Truth was that years ago I could do all the computer things from formatting hard drives/configuring/loading OSs/software/training and teaching end users. But somewhere along the line I lost interest and now have a massive gap in my knowledge. I have investigated re-training to do web design (ability to work from home when older) but not really sure if investing in this will be the best outlay for in time and money for my future working career.

You are right in the' living for the here and now' and not thinking about the future. However I believe that it is not a denial of this but a fear and the inability to cope with the inevitable when we get older. For the 'average Joe or Josephine' the cost of surviving in the here and now obscures the future and we have to immerse ourselves in the present. Thinking about the future can put most of into a state of mental turmoil and the coping mechanism is to exist in the present and very near future.
As stated earlier, there are very few that will be in a position to finance a re-alignment of their careers for working into their 70s. Therefore how are the majority expected to achieve this?

Interestingly I did a simple calculation on whether I could afford to retire with my reasonable standard of living, and the answer was no. It would have meant saving approx 30% of my salary over 20 years back, obviously not achievable when roof and food for family are needed. Therefore this government initiative to have every company provide a pension fund for its employer is ill conceived, considering a good deal of the contributions will be taken in administration costs by the pension company.

What a bl00dy mess this country is heading for.

mamba80

The problem with this doomsday scenario is that none of us know the future, ask Bob Crow? no one has any idea what trades will be in demand in 20yrs time let alone what our health might be like in our 60s and beyond.
Retraining costs a fortune, maybe 1500 a week in a tech trade + acc if needed, you then enter the job market, not knowing much, competing against guys who have been doing it for years.
As for Gov retraining... that's been done before, poor quality skill centre's, training in manual trades, vehicle mtce, welding.
unfortunately, so much of hi tech doesn't require large numbers of semi skilled workers, companies like Cisco and MS want certification and partner up companies to be their suppliers, with highly skilled and experienced work force.
Starting your own business? full of financial pit falls with a v. high failure rate and im guessing here, that the reason you didn't do it earlier is because you hadn't a clue what to do or how?
I don't see how counselling the over 50s is going to matter a jot...unless the over 50s are going to be trained to provide that counselling?
Unfortunately/fortunately, the state will take off the people who have provided for themselves and give it to those who have not, Cameron maybe protecting the wealthy pensioners but not all Governments will.

The reason folk bury their heads in the sand is because, aside from a very lucky few, most people are stuck with what they ve got.