Stans Alpha 340/400 Wheel Advice

TastySoup

I'm looking to buy some new hand built wheels to replace the stock ones on my carbon bike. I have made my mind up about the rims but need some advice on the spokes and lacing patterns.

I will be using the wheels for the Fred Whitton, other sportives and some road racing, I do most of my cycling in Northumberland and the Peak District. I weigh 62-65kg, 5"11 tall, and strengths are climbing seated or out of the saddle. I am looking for a light wheel that is going to suit my riding. My options are:

Option 01) Front: Stans Alpha 340 Rim / DT 240 Straight Pull hub / 20 DT Competition Spokes
Rear: Stans Alpha 400 Rim / DT 240 Straight Pull hub / 24 DT Competition Spokes

Option 02) Front: Stans Alpha 340 Rim / DT hub (Standard) / 24 Aerolite Spokes
Rear: Stans Alpha 400 Rim / DT hub (Standard) / 28 Spokes (Aerolite Non Drive, Competition Drive)

Option 03) Front: Stans Alpha 340 Rim / DT hub (Standard) / 24 DT Revolution Spokes
Rear: Stans Alpha 400 Rim / DT hub (Standard) / 28 Spokes (DT Revolution Non Drive, Competition Drive)

I have been advised that Option 1 (Straight Pull) will be the stiffest / Option 02 more Aero with the bladed spokes / Option 03 marginally will be the lightest.

Do bladed spokes may any noticeable difference?

Are Straight pull hubs the way forward. Is the extra stiffness worth the extra few grams and lack of bladed spokes?

Will I notice any difference between Aerolite and DT Revolution spokes? (Aerolite add £120 to the build)

Any advice would be massively helpful. Thanks

ugo.santalucia

A few remarks

1) Using straight pull spokes if you don't have to is like deliberately squeezing your balls in a bench vice... it's not clever. Extra stiffness can be achieved using a wider hub, not by using straight pull spokes

2) Using Aerolite spokes for the sake of it is the same as above.. they are overly expensive and super twisty even when held with an aero holder

3) More techy: a rear DT 240 has a rather narrow flange, which combined with a "soft rim" a low spoke count and light spokes makes the worst wheel you can possibly build in all respects

4) Stans rims make sense if you ride tubeless, otherwise there are better and cheaper options

5) If these are the options the builder gave you, change the builder as he seems to screw you with unnecessarily expensive and inappropriate options... if you picked your options, listen to the builder's advice

troj

My vote is for option 3. Why do you want to have a Alpha 400 rear? At your weight an Alpha 340 with 28 or 32 spokes would be just as good. Yes you notice the difference with bladed spokes but only in the hip pocket. Straight pull hubs might cause a hassle sourcing new spokes quickly. A 28/32 build with Alpha 340 DT Swiss Rev's front and NDS with DT Swiss Comps DS, bass nipples and standard 240 hubs is my conservative option.

TastySoup

The wheel builder did give me a couple of other options one being Mavic Open Pros on Hope hubs with DT competition/super comp. This was at the lower end of what I was looking at.

The builder and a couple of the other guys in the shop all had Stans rims with various hubs and spokes and all spoke very highly of them.

What rims would you recommend as a basis for a light but stiff climbing wheel?

ugo.santalucia

TastySoup wrote:

The wheel builder did give me a couple of other options one being Mavic Open Pros on Hope hubs with DT competition/super comp. This was at the lower end of what I was looking at.

The builder and a couple of the other guys in the shop all had Stans rims with various hubs and spokes and all spoke very highly of them.

What rims would you recommend as a basis for a light but stiff climbing wheel?

I do have Stans 340 and that's why I am telling you use them for what they are: tubeless!
The new batch weight 400 grams, so not far off most other rims on the market. The main problem is the 240 hub, which is a great hub paired with deep carbon rims, but less so if paired with shallow rims < 32 holes.
You want the Stans? Get the Stans, but pair them with Dura Ace hubs 24/28 or other hubs with a wider flange.

DT super comp are stupid spokes that require special nipples for a tight fit... they might save a fraction of a gram each over the standard DT comp... I would never use them

TastySoup

Ok, Thanks. So assuming I'm not wanting to run them as tubeless yet, what rims would you recommend as a base for a light, relatively stiff climbing wheel?

troj

What is your budget? I'm assuming these "climbing" wheels will have to descend as well?

TastySoup

Indeed, in reality they need to be a decent all round wheel, but not too heavy. Looking around the £550-£650 range at the moment.

ugo.santalucia

TastySoup wrote:

Indeed, in reality they need to be a decent all round wheel, but not too heavy. Looking around the £550-£650 range at the moment.

Archetype or A 23 with an Off Centre rear... this way you can get light spokes even NDS

caadybrompton

ugo.santalucia wrote:

TastySoup wrote:

The wheel builder did give me a couple of other options one being Mavic Open Pros on Hope hubs with DT competition/super comp. This was at the lower end of what I was looking at.

The builder and a couple of the other guys in the shop all had Stans rims with various hubs and spokes and all spoke very highly of them.

What rims would you recommend as a basis for a light but stiff climbing wheel?

I do have Stans 340 and that's why I am telling you use them for what they are: tubeless!

If I may jump in on this one.
I too had been looking at these as a potential new lightweight wheel set for a hand built job.
I currently have Mavic Elite's which came with the bike, but was thinking about selling them on Ebay and getting a better hand built set of light wheels.

One thing I had noticed when surfing the web was a lot of mentions of blowouts with the Stans 340 when run as tubed.
Have you heard much about this Ugo , hence your statement above that I quoted?
It seems the Pacenti/Hed Belgium/Archetype might be better choices, albeit slightly apples and pears comparison.

ugo.santalucia

caadybrompton wrote:

One thing I had noticed when surfing the web was a lot of mentions of blowouts with the Stans 340 when run as tubed.
Have you heard much about this Ugo , hence your statement above that I quoted?
It seems the Pacenti/Hed Belgium/Archetype might be better choices, albeit slightly apples and pears comparison.

My take on the subject is: these rims are designed to go tubeless... as such they are not designed to take 120 PSI... I use them tubed with 32 mm tyres at 60 PSI and they are great, but if I used road tyres, then I would go tubeless at 90 PSI or so... hence my previous statement

They are not apples for pears as they are all 17/18 mm rims (internally) so comparing them is legitimate. Archetype is the best pound for pound, HED is the best if money is no object

cycleclinic

If you want a low spoke count use an Archetype or pacenti SL23 rim the latter is stiffer. For 20F/24R rim you need a stiff rim and a rear hub that gives a good NDS bracing angle. The Kinlin XC-279 is another wide rim that is very stiff and under half the price of the pacenti rim, it heavier as well. Mate these to Miche Primato hubs or other more expensive hub in those low drillings for a stiff wheel even with thin laser spokes.

For light and wide rims that are designed for tyres at 110 psi there is the Ryde Pulse Sprint in (24H still waiting for Chickens to list these) 28H and 32H drillings. These are 385-395g and they come in off centre drillings. This rim a far stiffer than an open pro as well.

OP rim on hope hubs is a nice training wheelset a good all rounder but a master of none.

The problem with tyres blowing of stan 340 rim and the price means I never use them and now Ryde have a better rim out see above there is no need to use them period.

A good wheel for racing/climbing needs to stiff so it does not flex when you stand up and rock the bike of course this should be avoided but many riders rock away flexing there wheels slowly to death. A stiff wheel will slow this process down a fair bit.

TastySoup

I had a chat with the guys at Strada. He has advised me that the Stans 340 will not last as long as other rims and have been known to go out of true quite easily.

He has recommended Pacenti SL23 on DT240 or Aivee Hubs with 24/28 CX Ray spokes.

Do you think these will be a better wheel than the Stans?

ugo.santalucia

I tend to agree, my Stans 340 are for disc, so they won't wear off and they are 32 holes, so they do stay true.