Posted on the Internet: Southampton junction
RideOnTime
Posts: 4,712
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So what they're saying is as a cyclist you've got to negotiate the junction twice.
You can't turn right - your not good enough.
This is highway planning!!!!
Jesus.
Why not just line up the cylists and ram them off the road with bald headed Tw@ts in 4WD's.
Southampton the worst place to cycle?0 -
SpeechlessMy blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
https://twitter.com/roubaixcc
Facebook? No. Just say no.0 -
The green car on the left appears to be about to/able to turn right and would then run the cyclist down and as he is from Southampton he wouldn't be using his indicators
my isetta is a 300cc bike0 -
Just watched top gear and this seems straight out of their weird ideas0
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If you've failed at everything else in life then become a local government administrator...0
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Playing devil's advocate, it might be a particularly treacherous junction where this is the only advisable way to tackle it0
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Is this not the same as the hook type junctions in Melbourne? I can actually see how it might be a safer way to turn right at certain junctions. I hate those moments when you are waiting to turn right and cars are still whizzing past you from behind and also coming towards you too. You do feel very vulnerable stationary in the middle of the road on a bicycle.
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Cornerblock wrote:Is this not the same as the hook type junctions in Melbourne? I can actually see how it might be a safer way to turn right at certain junctions. I hate those moments when you are waiting to turn right and cars are still whizzing past you from behind and also coming towards you too. You do feel very vulnerable stationary in the middle of the road on a bicycle.
it is, but Im not convinced its intentional,and given its going to be fairly unique experience to most UK road users who have no experience of that kind of thing, is that really the safer way.
I mean youve still got cars who can turn right normally which you dont get in Melbourne at least, and obviously anyone brave enough to take prime is going to ignore the 2 stage thing anyway, so your just leaving the less confident cyclists whove got to be wary of people left turning into them if they stick to the cycle lane, plus when they line up for the 2nd stage, theyll naturally be at risk from the lot who will be aiming to go straight on (quite literally through the cyclists waiting) as soon as the lights change. so it sounds like a recipe for disaster as youll have all kinds of traffic using the junction differently with everyone having different expectations about what happens next and who goes where.
whilst it looks previously to have been a fairly horrible roundabout,that looks in part as much to do with the size and speed of the approach roads and it should have been an ideal candidate for a fully segregated approach, this seems like its ended up making it harder to cycle on by making it so awkward to use.0 -
Tempting though it is to blame this on brain dead traffic engineers (what other sort is there?) I detect a far more sinister culprit. It's no surprise to see the Sustrans logo all over this. Sustrans loves to present itself as pro cycling but it gets relatively large amounts of government cash and p*sses it away on converting bits of old railway lines which go nowhere useful. It's main purpose appears to be to allow government and the Dept for Transport to give the impression that they are keen on cycling while doing nothing to improve conditions for cycling on the road. The Sustrans website lists campaigns, but Sustrans is not a campaigning organisation and its 'members' have no say in policy. Unfortunately they are very good at self promotion and are often assumed to be the voice of cycling.0
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cedargreen wrote:Tempting though it is to blame this on brain dead traffic engineers (what other sort is there?) I detect a far more sinister culprit. It's no surprise to see the Sustrans logo all over this. Sustrans loves to present itself as pro cycling but it gets relatively large amounts of government cash and p*sses it away on converting bits of old railway lines which go nowhere useful. It's main purpose appears to be to allow government and the Dept for Transport to give the impression that they are keen on cycling while doing nothing to improve conditions for cycling on the road. The Sustrans website lists campaigns, but Sustrans is not a campaigning organisation and its 'members' have no say in policy. Unfortunately they are very good at self promotion and are often assumed to be the voice of cycling.
yep, suspect transexuals...0 -
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/ron.strutt/rrsustrans.html
Looks like I'm not the only person who thinks Sustrans is unelected, unaccountable and ultimately anti-cycling.0 -
It's not the worst idea in the world, mainly because cycle traffic's main issue in turning right is getting out into the main traffic flow in order to get to the right hand side of the lane, doubly if there is two lanes approaching the lights.0
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Why wouldn't you just follow the same route as the cars turning right? These odd directions can't be mandatory anyhow, can they?WyndyMilla Massive Attack | Rourke 953 | Condor Italia 531 Pro | Boardman CX Pro | DT Swiss RR440 Tubeless Wheels
Find me on Strava0 -
If this thread is to evolve into a discussion of SUSTRANS so be it.
Just to remind us of Scarlett Johanson who I know doesn't support SUSTRANS.
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I am very gratified to see that Scarlet Johanssen shares my distrust of Sustrans. I've been bombarding her with e-mails suggesting that we meet up to discuss the finer points of cycling policy but she always claims to be too busy.
If Sustrans is advocating apparently dodgy 'infrastructure' and apparently advising local councils, then yes I think it's worthy of discussion, and isn't hijacking the thread. Perhaps rideontime can tell us if he is a 'member' of Sustrans, since he seems to be upset at my mentioning them.0 -
Another devil's advocate viewpoint.
Sorry, but I can see where they're coming from.
Not every cyclist on the road is as quick and savvy as the rest. The instructions for the junction try to take this into account and keep them safe. They also assume that the cyclist doesn't want to leave the bike lane.
My kids are now grown up, but if they were still 10 yrs old and going through that junction, I'd be a lot happier if they were going the route shown.
The older I get, the better I was.0 -
cedargreen wrote:I am very gratified to see that Scarlet Johanssen shares my distrust of Sustrans. I've been bombarding her with e-mails suggesting that we meet up to discuss the finer points of cycling policy but she always claims to be too busy.
If Sustrans is advocating apparently dodgy 'infrastructure' and apparently advising local councils, then yes I think it's worthy of discussion, and isn't hijacking the thread. Perhaps rideontime can tell us if he is a 'member' of Sustrans, since he seems to be upset at my mentioning them.
No I'm not a member.
I too think it's a bit of tokenism and marginalies cycling from highway planning.
The NCN is just a few signposts isn't it?
Does it serve any real purpose?0 -
RideOnTime wrote:I too think it's a bit of tokenism and marginalies cycling from highway planning.
The NCN is just a few signposts isn't it?
Does it serve any real purpose?
£80mil (pa) for a few sign posts ....0 -
Anyone negotiated (by bike) the magic roundabouts in Swindon?seanoconn - gruagach craic!0
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cedargreen wrote:http://homepage.ntlworld.com/ron.strutt/rrsustrans.html
Looks like I'm not the only person who thinks Sustrans is unelected, unaccountable and ultimately anti-cycling.
That website hurts my eyes. Yellow on green :shock:0 -
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Swindon0 -
RideOnTime wrote:
boeing said zebedee, whoops wrong thread :?0
