Commuting time - How much will a new bike help

Ben5053
Ben5053 Posts: 12
edited February 2014 in Commuting general
Hi, i currently commute 8.5 miles each way on a £100 muddy fox mountain bike (unchaged - weights about 16-17kg i think + rubbish front suspension)) with a rucksack on my back. this takes me about 55mins on the way to work (taking it slow so i don't get sweaty) and 40-45mins on the way back (trying to get some cardio). i'm 180lbs ish. was deliberating spending some decent money on a new bike to cut down the time. looking at the claud butler regent 2013 (tourer) and the jamis nova sport 2014 (cyclocross) would appreciate any advice on how these bikes might change my commuting times with the same amount of effort put in? + any advice about bikes in a similar price range that would be better.

p.s route rises then falls in altitude, coast to coast (west Kirby to birkenhead) though never any really steep gradients. +planning on getting some panniers to replace the rucksack

Thanks in advance.

Comments

  • Ben5053
    Ben5053 Posts: 12
    p.s.s anybody know how much the claud butler regent weighs? cant find the info anywhere. thanks
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    I do about 11 miles (each way) and it takes me around 40 minutes at this time of year with heavy 32mm slicks on a CX bike that probably weighs in around 13Kg+ with mudguards, lights & rack on - I'm around 75Kg and I probably carry about a Kg of stuff with me. My route climbs ~500 feet each way.
    In the summer I reduce that time to closer to 30 minutes - slimmer tyres, no guards and the roads are cleaner.

    I get hot and sweaty throughout the year and wear cycle gear then change when I get to work. No way would I ride to work in my work kit - although returning home it wouldn't matter so much.

    A bike is only part of the equation when it comes to efficient travel. Your "rubbish front suspension" is probably doing you a favour if it's stiff and I guess you're still using mountain bike tyres? You could change those for slicks if you're on the road.
  • Ben5053
    Ben5053 Posts: 12
    hi slowbike, i wipedown/change at work but don't have a shower so cant rink getting to sweaty, the suspension doesn't lock but i wouldn't class it as stiff or bouncy - somewhere inbetween. i've considered changing the tires to thinner ones. any ballpark figure on how this might change my times?
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    Without getting sweaty - not much.

    We don't have a shower here either - but I can lock myself in a toilet with a sink - so I can strip wash.

    Getting fitter will give the best improvement to your times. Less knobbly tyres may help - your choice depends on the wheelsize though. I use CX and road bikes with 700 wheels ... my choice of tyre is no good to you.
  • zx6man
    zx6man Posts: 1,092
    Ben5053 wrote:
    p.s.s anybody know how much the claud butler regent weighs? cant find the info anywhere. thanks

    google search on a website shows shipping weight of 15kg
  • craker
    craker Posts: 1,739
    Over 9.5 miles I reckon on about 35 mins on a road bike, 45 on a rigid mtb with slicks and the one time I took my knobbled xc bike it was more like 55.

    If you're not prepared to work up a sweat there's not much point though.
  • markhewitt1978
    markhewitt1978 Posts: 7,614
    Quite if you aren't prepared to put some effort in then there will be no improvement.

    A road bike with a rider with good fitness can reasonably expect 15mph.
  • Ben5053
    Ben5053 Posts: 12
    as stated earlier i put in effort on the way back, just wanted to know how much my 55mins would be cut down on the way there. faster/more efficient bike = further faster for the same effort. From what you guys are saying though it seems the difference from getting a faster bike will make little difference to speed at the same energy levels? i was assuming slicker tires/better geometry would make me more efficient?
  • Ben5053
    Ben5053 Posts: 12
    zx6man wrote:
    Ben5053 wrote:
    p.s.s anybody know how much the claud butler regent weighs? cant find the info anywhere. thanks

    google search on a website shows shipping weight of 15kg

    thanks, do manufacturers normally round up the weight for shipping. 1kg for packaging maybe? be very pleased if it was under 14 with mudguards/rack
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    Ben5053 wrote:
    as stated earlier i put in effort on the way back, just wanted to know how much my 55mins would be cut down on the way there. faster/more efficient bike = further faster for the same effort. From what you guys are saying though it seems the difference from getting a faster bike will make little difference to speed at the same energy levels? i was assuming slicker tires/better geometry would make me more efficient?
    Marginal gains ....

    At higher speeds there is more to gain from more aero-dynamic positioning - at 9-13mph there is far less benefit.

    If you're talking about a bike that's nicer to ride then yes - a new bike would be much nicer - they always are ... (well pretty much always) ... and it'll probably be quicker - but only marginally.

    My winter/summer commute times differ by 5-10 minutes over an 11 mile route with 500 feet of altitude gain (I won't call it climbing as it's not really - except one bit that is). I think most of that time is down to the weather but some is down to tyres as I change them from summer to winter.
    Knobblies slow me down a bit more and studded really do take more effort to get going.
  • Barteos
    Barteos Posts: 657
    Get some slick tyres (no need for skinny ones) like Kojaks or Sport Contacts, lower your bars and see how much difference it makes.
    If after the change your average is still below 15mph, it's the engine that needs upgrading :wink:
  • daxplusplus
    daxplusplus Posts: 631
    Barteos wrote:
    Get some slick tyres (no need for skinny ones) like Kojaks or Sport Contacts, lower your bars and see how much difference it makes.
    If after the change your average is still below 15mph, it's the engine that needs upgrading :wink:

    +1
    Sometimes you're the hammer, sometimes you're the nail

    strava profile
  • fatsmoker
    fatsmoker Posts: 585
    Moving from a cheap MTB to a cheap road bike I went from 1 hour 20 to 1 hour immediately over 15 miles. Moving to a slightly more expensive road bike 6 months later and (a bit fitter) it's 55 minutes but not as sweaty. Bear in mind that when you get into town onto busier roads with traffic lights / junctions your average speed will drop, so you'll really feel the difference on stretches of road without lights and stuff.
  • notnot
    notnot Posts: 284
    There's a trial of commuting on a lighter vs heavier bike here (4kg weight difference). The cheaper bike was 50 quid, though steel bikes seem fashionable enough today that I don't think you'd find one at that price now! http://www.bmj.com/content/341/bmj.c680 ... d=21148220 Only for one person, but he commuted repeatedly and it didn't make any difference to the time it took.

    Both bikes there were drop bar bikes and the tyres look better for road riding than you're likely to have on the muddy fox. Changing the tyres to slightly thinner slicks shouldn't cost too much and may speed you up a little (or at least make the bike feel nicer to ride). I don't know if changing the fork to a rigid one is an option? Or you could also look at getting a secondhand bike that's built more for road riding and then selling the Muddy Fox - some shops sell quite OK hybrids for anywhere from £75-150, or places like Edinburgh Bike Co-Op and Decathalon sell decent budget new bikes.

    A pricier new bike may well feel better to ride, and if it gets you riding more and gets you fitter that's great. If you're commuting 15+ miles a day then it's quite reasonable to spend a bit on a bike to make the process more fun :) The biggest improvements to speed are likely to come through getting fitter and putting more welly in, though!
  • denzzz28
    denzzz28 Posts: 315
    I did a bit of experiment myself about this issue. I always use a racing bike with 700c 23 tyre. My bike has double panniers. The bike it self is around 11-12kgs my daily load is around 4-5kgs. Im 72kgs. My normal ride to work is around 25mins. This is around 50-60% effort. 20-22mins 70-80% effort. Full on 90-100% effort is around 15-18mins. 20-30% effort is about 28-32mins(very slow pace). Avg difference of 3-5mins.

    If i use a mountain bike with knobly tyres( and with the same panniers and loads). The bike alone is around 15kgs. Using the same effort I lost around 2-3mins in relevance to the respective efforts above. Yes it will make a difference but not much TBH. How ever if you are travelling 20miles then yeah it will make a big difference.

    The cheapest way i think is just use a slick tyre or road tyres to your existing bike so you will have a lower rolling resistance, meaning you exert less effort in peddaling. But if you can dish out a shinny new road bike then why not. But then again if you are parking your bike in a dodgy place then i wouldnt bother buying a new bike just incase somebody knicks it.

    I do long distance ride on weekends and having a heavy daily commuter bike helps to keep my legs strong so having a heavy bike is a good thing for me, especially that I only have a short ride home.
  • dj58
    dj58 Posts: 2,223
    If you are using off-road tyres swop them for some 1.5" wide semi-slicks run at 60-65 psi (guide only), you will need to adjust this according to your weight, you will notice the difference. If your bike has rear fittings for a rack, fit one and use a pannier instead of a back pack, that will get rid of the sweaty back syndrome.

    If you have secure facilities at work, consider leaving your work clothes there and cycle in some other attire. You don't have shower facilities, however the strip wash method and some inoffensive deodorant spray is an acceptable alternative.
  • roger_merriman
    roger_merriman Posts: 6,165
    With the no sweat and what looks like a fairly built up commute, I'd be surprised if any difference could be found.

    Slicks will make the bike mildly faster and easier but it's unlikely to make much difference neither a nice roadie, but it's a darn site more fun with faster/nicer bike.
  • joelsim
    joelsim Posts: 7,552
    Ben5053 wrote:
    Hi, i currently commute 8.5 miles each way on a £100 muddy fox mountain bike (unchaged - weights about 16-17kg i think + rubbish front suspension)) with a rucksack on my back. this takes me about 55mins on the way to work (taking it slow so i don't get sweaty) and 40-45mins on the way back (trying to get some cardio). i'm 180lbs ish. was deliberating spending some decent money on a new bike to cut down the time. looking at the claud butler regent 2013 (tourer) and the jamis nova sport 2014 (cyclocross) would appreciate any advice on how these bikes might change my commuting times with the same amount of effort put in? + any advice about bikes in a similar price range that would be better.

    p.s route rises then falls in altitude, coast to coast (west Kirby to birkenhead) though never any really steep gradients. +planning on getting some panniers to replace the rucksack

    Thanks in advance.

    I think it would make a hell of a difference. I have a heavy Trek 3700 MTB and I wouldn't dream of riding it on my 8/9 mile EW commute but on my Boardman Hybrid (circa 10Kg) it is a breeze.
  • roger_merriman
    roger_merriman Posts: 6,165
    Joelsim wrote:
    Ben5053 wrote:
    Hi, i currently commute 8.5 miles each way on a £100 muddy fox mountain bike (unchaged - weights about 16-17kg i think + rubbish front suspension)) with a rucksack on my back. this takes me about 55mins on the way to work (taking it slow so i don't get sweaty) and 40-45mins on the way back (trying to get some cardio). i'm 180lbs ish. was deliberating spending some decent money on a new bike to cut down the time. looking at the claud butler regent 2013 (tourer) and the jamis nova sport 2014 (cyclocross) would appreciate any advice on how these bikes might change my commuting times with the same amount of effort put in? + any advice about bikes in a similar price range that would be better.

    p.s route rises then falls in altitude, coast to coast (west Kirby to birkenhead) though never any really steep gradients. +planning on getting some panniers to replace the rucksack

    Thanks in advance.

    I think it would make a hell of a difference. I have a heavy Trek 3700 MTB and I wouldn't dream of riding it on my 8/9 mile EW commute but on my Boardman Hybrid (circa 10Kg) it is a breeze.

    Years ago had a cheap lump of a hybrid with panniers and stuff it was pushing 50lb which is Boris bike weights.

    As long as you don't flog your self it's perfectly comftable to ride 10+ ml commutes in urban areas wafting along at every light etc you'd catch up with all but the fastest of riders. Out of rush hr yes a faster bike could make some gains.
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    Joelsim wrote:

    I think it would make a hell of a difference. I have a heavy Trek 3700 MTB and I wouldn't dream of riding it on my 8/9 mile EW commute but on my Boardman Hybrid (circa 10Kg) it is a breeze.

    I think you missed the bit where the OP said he can't risk getting sweaty ....
  • joelsim
    joelsim Posts: 7,552
    Slowbike wrote:
    Joelsim wrote:

    I think it would make a hell of a difference. I have a heavy Trek 3700 MTB and I wouldn't dream of riding it on my 8/9 mile EW commute but on my Boardman Hybrid (circa 10Kg) it is a breeze.

    I think you missed the bit where the OP said he can't risk getting sweaty ....

    The laws of physics suggests that pushing 17Kg is going to need more effort than pushing 10Kg to achieve the same speed tho
  • roger_merriman
    roger_merriman Posts: 6,165
    Joelsim wrote:
    Slowbike wrote:
    Joelsim wrote:

    I think it would make a hell of a difference. I have a heavy Trek 3700 MTB and I wouldn't dream of riding it on my 8/9 mile EW commute but on my Boardman Hybrid (circa 10Kg) it is a breeze.

    I think you missed the bit where the OP said he can't risk getting sweaty ....

    The laws of physics suggests that pushing 17Kg is going to need more effort than pushing 10Kg to achieve the same speed tho

    A little yes but it's a relatively small difference ie 7kg.

    And the difference in average cruising speeds between a slow rider/route and a fast one isn't that great what 10mph or so. In almost all cases time gained or lost is marginal.
  • rolf_f
    rolf_f Posts: 16,015
    Basically, the weight of the bike only makes a difference when you are accelerating - so with a flattish route it's mainly going to be down to the lights. I think you can get a light bike up to speed more easily without developing a sweat but otherwise it makes very little difference. Certainly my experience with MTB commuting was it took little longer. When I try it now it feels much harder but whether it really is is another matter.
    Faster than a tent.......
  • markhewitt1978
    markhewitt1978 Posts: 7,614
    Of course with the MTB it will take more effort to keep it at speed due to the tyres and aerodynamic position of the rider.
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    markhewitt1978 wrote:
    Of course with the MTB it will take more effort to keep it at speed due to the tyres and aerodynamic position of the rider.

    But at the effort level the OP is intending on putting in I'd suggest that the difference will not be significant ...
  • joelsim
    joelsim Posts: 7,552
    Yep, there is plenty of stop start in London as you know.

    Plus the gearing on MTB's isn't as good. For instance if you get on a roll, then on my (albeit cheapo) Trek I max out very quickly.
  • drummer_boy
    drummer_boy Posts: 236
    Moving from a hardtail MTB, with semi slicks (1.8") and fairly high tyre pressure (for an MTB), to a CX with 28mm 700Cs, on a 11mile each way commute with 500' of climb over 2 hills reduced my time by 10mins (55-45). The route is half road half metalled tow path. I am a heavy rider as well at 240lbs.

    For me the CX is faster on the road sections, but suffers on the canal path, and vice versa with the MTB.I just really enjoy the feeling that, on the road, when I press the pedals down it more directly translates to forward motion than on the MTB!

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