36 Spoke Mavic Open Pro - Weight Penalty / Aerodynamics

JohnChristopher

Hi all, the Mavic Aksium wheels on my road bike are getting a bit worst for wear so I'm looking around for some replacements. I've read a lot of posts in this section about handbuilt wheels and so I was hoping to find something around £160 and found the Mavic Open Pro/ 105 wheelset from Rose Bikes.

http://www.rosebikes.co.uk/article/road ... aid:401809

So, I've looked through a lot of wheel threads about these wheels but they have been based mainly around heavy type riders, but I'm <9 stone. Would 36 spokes be a big disadvantage for club races & the odd time trial? What weight would they come in at roughly?

trek_dan

Probably be knocking on for 2kg, be a dull ride too.
For that budget you could get PX AL30's. Will be lighter, stiffer and a lot more suited to race/TT.

marcusjb

I'm about half a stone heavier than you at summer weight. I ride 36 spoke wheels for much of my riding - but I value reliability over weight as I am riding big distances in remote countryside.

However, for TT and racing you'd get away with considerably less in the way of spokes (my 'faster' wheels are all R32/F28 setups and even that is more than needed in reality - but again, I use those on summer rides of 1000km+, so don't want to deal with issues).

My 36 spoke wheels (Royce Titans with Ambrosio Excellence - DT revolutions on the front, I'd have to check what's on the rear) - they're lovely, but they're not exactly racey!

Nothing wrong with the hub/rim combo you've chosen - you should be able to get them built over here, with a lower spoke count for similar money I'd have thoughts.

ugo.santalucia

I think Rose should do what they do well, retail...
I understand the appeal of the price...
If you had to buy the components alone at online discounted price, you would pay 160-180 pounds... that means they knock the price of handbuilts to the point that the build is for free on top of discounted parts, you can be sure the quality of the build is crap.
If it sounds snobbish, I'll take the criticism... I often get to rebuild Open PRO bought cheap on the web

If you ask a serious professional, someone like Harry Rowland, he will charge you 250 for a lighter set (fewer spokes) based on the same components but built to last instead of built-for-the-bin

cycleclinic

I would agree with ugo. there is no way to build OP rims on 105 hubs for £160 and have some one spend time making them a good built. They will be machine built and hand finished anyway I cannot see any other way they can do them for that price.

As for how such a wheel would feel it is a 36 spoke wheel meant for heavy riders or for touring. For less than £200 find someone to build you rigida chrina 32H on 105 hubs that at least can be done and you will get a good build maybe a dull build but it will last. Or by another set of askiums.

If you want quality handbuilt with OP rims you will have to spend north of £200.

gabriel959

Ugo is right, bought one of those £160 Open Pro/105 wheelsets and had to have my rear re-built by a reputable wheelbuilder with new spokes as the ones that came with it were rubbish, which cost me £45. The front one was ok, thank goodness!

JohnChristopher

Thanks for the advice. I'm really glad I checked now! Think I might go for the Shimano r500's at £67.

Edit: @ trek_dan; AL30's sound good also but I don't want the hassle of changing the bearings frequently.

Remarkable

JohnChristopher wrote:

Thanks for the advice. I'm really glad I checked now! Think I might go for the Shimano r500's at £67.

Edit: @ trek_dan; AL30's sound good also but I don't want the hassle of changing the bearings frequently.

Incidentally, I was throwing out an old damaged Shimano r501 wheel a couple of days ago and decided to strip it down and weigh the rim out of curiosity. Approx. 478 grams including rim tape. :shock: That's pretty light I think..sort of blows the whole rotational weight thing out the window aswell..

buckles

Remarkable wrote:

Incidentally, I was throwing out an old damaged Shimano r501 wheel a couple of days ago and decided to strip it down and weigh the rim out of curiosity. Approx. 478 grams including rim tape. :shock: That's pretty light I think..sort of blows the whole rotational weight thing out the window aswell..

THANK YOU for this. I've always been curious about the weight of the R501 rims. Wanted to do the same when I rebuilt my R501 wheel with a Cole C24 but forgot and already done gone thrown the dang rim away before I got chance to frickin' weigh it!

I would happily race on R501s despite having hand built wheels that cost three times as much... including I built myself and wheels built by Harry Rowland

ugo.santalucia

Remarkable wrote:

Incidentally, I was throwing out an old damaged Shimano r501 wheel a couple of days ago and decided to strip it down and weigh the rim out of curiosity. Approx. 478 grams including rim tape. :shock: That's pretty light I think..sort of blows the whole rotational weight thing out the window aswell..

Why did you fit the rim tape back once you had ripped it off to remove the spokes? :shock:

majormantra

R501s use cheapo plain gauge spokes and Sora/Tiagra level hubs though, which is presumably where all the heft comes from. For the money though they make a perfectly usable, disposable wheel for riders that aren't too heavy.

Remarkable

I didn't bother fitting it again. Just wrapped it round the bottom of the rim before I lifted it with a fishing scale. The rim was worn a bit though, not sure how that would effect the outcome? You would think that it would be at least 100g heavier than that though with all the marketing hype of other wheels..

I would race on them too. Seriously good value.

milese

501's are the only wheel I've ever snapped spokes on. 3 of them in seperate incidents whilst riding normally, on the rear wheel.

I'm 72kg.

My rear wheel is now a power tap built into an OP, but am still using the front without issue.

buckles

I've snapped spokes on the round-spoked ones, but never on the bladed spoke ones.

ugo.santalucia

Shimano use cheap chrome steel spokes on their lowest range (R500/501), which is a shame...
On the other hand, if they used decent spokes, they could easily dispose of the rest of their low/mid priced wheel range, as that's pretty much the only upgrade you get over the above