Wheels for rim brakes

vecfluxx

I need a set of clinchers for cx training, but am not sure about a few things. I'm undecided about either getting hand builts, likely archetypes 32/32 but am unsure about hub choice, or a cheap set of factory wheels. R500's have held up fine over a year and a half (now winter wheels) for me on the road, will they be fine for cx? I'm 70kg if it matters. If i go handbuilt:

I really like the feel of wide rims on the road, does it also provide a significantly different tyre profile with cx tyres? I'm planning on running 30mm mud2's.

How long can i expect to get out of rims before the brake track is finished? Is there much difference between how rims wear?

Which hubs would you recommend, i'm considering novatec, ultegra or hope if they are worth it?

Are the handbuilts worth it over r500s, fulcrum 7s etc?

ugo.santalucia

You don't need 32 spokes, you can do with 28 and even 24 at the front. Choose a tubeless compatible rim, something like Velocity A 23 or Stan's Iron Cross (the latter tubeless only). Clinchers are OK on hard terrain, but when it's soft and muddy, you really want to go down in pressure and you can't go lower than 50 PSI with clinchers. Novatec road hubs and mud not the best of friends, they are OK if you don't mind doing your own maintenance (and lot of it)... Hope are better (although more money). For the spokes, trust your builder... Alpina DB are hard to beat as value for money

DavidBelcher

vecfluxx wrote:

I need a set of clinchers for cx training, but am not sure about a few things. I'm undecided about either getting hand builts, likely archetypes 32/32 but am unsure about hub choice, or a cheap set of factory wheels. R500's have held up fine over a year and a half (now winter wheels) for me on the road, will they be fine for cx? I'm 70kg if it matters. If i go handbuilt:

I really like the feel of wide rims on the road, does it also provide a significantly different tyre profile with cx tyres? I'm planning on running 30mm mud2's.

How long can i expect to get out of rims before the brake track is finished? Is there much difference between how rims wear?

Which hubs would you recommend, i'm considering novatec, ultegra or hope if they are worth it?

Are the handbuilts worth it over r500s, fulcrum 7s etc?

If you go down the factory-built route, Campag, Miche and Fulcrum make all cross-specific wheelsets with allegedly more durable and water/muck-resistant bearings and seals.

For handbuilt, I've found Hope and Dura-Ace hubs to give good results in all conditions over a number of seasons. Ambrosio's Zenith cassette hubs look nice but I don't know what their reliability for cross is like. If you happen upon any via eBay, Mavic 571s & Sachs-Maillard New Success are very good sealed-bearing cassette hubs from times gone by (early 90s) that will stand up to a CX environment and take modern HG-style cassettes.

David

vecfluxx

Thank you for your replies, forgot to mention i have tubulars for racing, is tubeless still something i should worry about or will clinchers for training/ tubs for racing be perfect?

angrynortherner

I go a lot lower than 50psi with Clinchers for racing. I ran my Clement PDX's (tubed) at 35 Psi in the X-League race at the weekend and finished with 13psi in the front after getting a slow puncture - I weigh about 83kg.
My Clements at 35psi were letting me out corner my team mate who was running Dugast Tubs on the muddy descent, I never once felt like my tyres were holding me back. I think if you run the PDX's tubeless on Velocity 23 rims you'll be pretty close to Tub performance.

barry_kellett99

I also ran much less than that on my clinchers last season. 25psi at times in my specialized terra pro's
No punctures, but i admit it is a fine line at that level and was relatively lucky I suppose. But 30-35 should be fine?

cyclingsheep

barry_kellett99 wrote:

I also ran much less than that on my clinchers last season. 25psi at times in my specialized terra pro's
No punctures, but i admit it is a fine line at that level and was relatively lucky I suppose. But 30-35 should be fine?

Often run 25psi with my clinchers but a lot depends on how rocky the course is. I judge it on the day.

barry_kellett99

cyclingsheep wrote:

barry_kellett99 wrote:

I also ran much less than that on my clinchers last season. 25psi at times in my specialized terra pro's
No punctures, but i admit it is a fine line at that level and was relatively lucky I suppose. But 30-35 should be fine?

Often run 25psi with my clinchers but a lot depends on how rocky the course is. I judge it on the day.

I'd agree with that, and scope out any heavy duty roots before hand and ride accordingly.

FransJacques

Wheelsmith in Scotland now have a 24mm rim: http://www.wheelsmith.co.uk/race24

To up the strength you can up the spoking to 24/28 and to save a bit 'o dosh you could go Laser front and rear. Don't know why people insist on putting 'aero' spoke on wheels that'll never travel faster than 25 kph. Fashion? Fad? Ego?

When I tried cross tyres on my Hed Ardennes I was impressed. At my weight tho they wouldn't last long as race wheels with their 18/24 spoking. I shoulda ordered a second pair in stallion build...

ugo.santalucia

FransJacques wrote:

When I tried cross tyres on my Hed Ardennes I was impressed. At my weight tho they wouldn't last long as race wheels with their 18/24 spoking. I shoulda ordered a second pair in stallion build...

True, although Archetype are exactly the same thing and you can have them built at a fraction of the cost of the Ardennes

walney

I am running Miche sintesi hubs with Mavic CXP 33 rims for my cross clincher wheels. I really rate the Miche hubs, cheap, sealed even look okay! I also use the MUD 2 tyres at 35/38 psi with an 84kg rider.

angrynortherner

Just in the process of re-rimming my CX wheels from Open Pro's to Velocity A23's - the a23 are wide enough internally to slot an open pro rim inside them - so looking forward to seeing if they help the CX tyres spread out a bit more.

ugo.santalucia

AngryNortherner wrote:

Just in the process of re-rimming my CX wheels from Open Pro's to Velocity A23's - the a23 are wide enough internally to slot an open pro rim inside them - so looking forward to seeing if they help the CX tyres spread out a bit more.

Yes, they are nice... the internal tubeless ready profile might give you some grief, unless you use a tubeless rim tape, like Stan's 21mm one. Other rim tapes just curl and wrinkle causing all sorts of issues... trust me...

angrynortherner

Have you set the A23's up for tubeless? If so, what do I need - just the yellow tape+valves or do I need Velox tape then Stans?

ugo.santalucia

AngryNortherner wrote:

Have you set the A23's up for tubeless? If so, what do I need - just the yellow tape+valves or do I need Velox tape then Stans?

No... you don't need Velox tape.... you need Stans or Velocity kit

angrynortherner

Having a nightmare with the clement PDX tyres and getting them to permanently seal - got them seated with some yellow tape but try to get them to sop leaking sealant around the bead is proving problematic. Does anyone now if this set up works?

majormantra

According to this they only place nice with Stans rims if you're running them tubeless: http://www.cxmagazine.com/going-tubeles ... mendations

Monty Dog

To run A23s tubeless, you'll need yellow rim tape plus rim strips and sealant. You can either buy the ridiculously expensive Stan's ones or make your own from BMX inner tubes - you need ones with a threaded presta valve+ locknut. Simply cut the tube around the outside mould line, push the valve through, secure with locknut and fold the tube over the outside edges of the rim. Fit the tyre and put in some sealant before seating - inflate the tyre and away you go if you're lucky. How well it works depends on how well the tyre bead seals against the rim - looser fit tyres may need an extra wrap of yellow tape. Can be a bit of a faff to start, but if you can get it to seal, then they should stay inflated.