E2E Audax Question

meursault

Some work colleagues and I are planning an E2E Lejog June 2014, and I was wondering if anyone can answer a question I can't find answers to elsewhere.

1. Can you stay in and use a motorhome for accommodation and spares?

Audax rules on web page

9.9.5 Participants’ personal helpers are not encouraged but may be permitted, at the discretion of
the AUK event secretary, provided the participant and their helpers agree:
(i) Not to drive a motor vehicle on a section of route in use by participants, except within 1km of a
control or in the case of an accident or emergency

Does this mean you can carry spares if needed? I am not sure of their definition of emergency.

marcusjb

This regulation was put in, primarily, for LEL. I.e. They didn't want dozens of motor homes on the route with 1000 riders. PBP is the same setup.

I can't remember whether it was tweaked in the AGM earlier in the month.

For a perm, it doesn't really matter. Slightly against the self-sufficiency ethos of Audax - but I am not a militant like those that believe you should only eat things that you hunt and kill whilst you are riding.

Confirm with the perm org, Mark.

Are you riding it as a Randonneur or Touriste?

I would like to ride a Randonneur LEJOG at some point - too many other goals currently though!

marcusjb

it was changed at the AGM - see below. The organiser should be fine with a motorhome acting as accommodation I am sure. As I said, any regulations regarding vehicles and helpers are primarily to ensure that those vehicles do not drive along the same (often narrow) roads as the riders on a large event such as LEL.

Apx 9.9.4 Where riders’ personal support is permitted, the rider and their helpers agree:
(i) Personal support is only allowed at controls
(ii) Not to drive a motor vehicle on a section of route in use by riders, except within 1km of a control or in the case of an accident or
emergency.
(iii) The rider will be held responsible for the behaviour of their personal helpers
(re-numbered, was 9.9.5, updated to match reg 9.9.2, (i) added)

meursault

Thanks Marcus, much clearer, but will drop Mark a mail to confirm.

Riding as Randonneur I think, 4 days 20 hours one.

marcusjb

The 'real' one! I plan on doing it sometime - my next couple of seasons are already sort of full - so it's at least 2016 before I think I can pull that one off.

How many of you are going to ride it?

Proper tough challenge. Look forward to hearing about your build up to it.

meursault

There are four of us riding it, then going for SR and maybe PBP.

Really enjoyed reading through your blog, looks like you could ride lejog in your sleep!

meursault

I found this

With over 60 countries represented, it certainly has a huge portion of the world represented. The French dominate, with a couple of thousand riders (you could always spot a French rider – mainly on carbon race bikes with a saddle bag the size of an apple. Many French riders were totally supported by friends/family meeting them at every control in their camper van with some hot food, a comfy chair and a change of clothes. Nice way to do PBP – whether it’s in the true spirit of long-distance riding is a contentious issue!).

Looks like it is OK to use a motorhome.

http://marcusjb.wordpress.com/2011/09/01/did-paris-brest-paris-2011-live-up-to-my-expectations/

marcusjb

Of course it is okay to use a motorhome - just with the restrictions that are described.

What the regulations are about (and PBP has similar, if not stricter regs on this) is keeping motorhomes and support traffic off the route the riders are following. LEL and PBP both issue a supporters route that they must follow.

It really doesn't matter for a perm.

meursault

This Audax thing does my head in, they seem a bit of a sandals and pipe organisation.

An email my colleague recieved from Mark who validates E2E says

GPX files no good for validaion, yet his Audax web page says it is acceptable!

No bag drops, but you can stay in hotels WTF?

So I can't have a change of clothes sent, but if I can afford it, 5* luxury spa and Sky Team pro soigneur!

Also, if you are still about Marcus, can you tell what BRM stands for on your 'Thinking about PBP blog?

One of the reasons to complete in Audax time, was to use as early registration for PBP, but your blog suggests Perms and DIY's don't count.

marcusjb

A permanent event (i.e. one that you can ride any time) can not help you pre-register for PBP no. You would also not be able to use a DIY or permanent in the 2015 season as part of your qualification SR.

BRM - Brevet Randonneur Mondiaux - any event that is run to BRM standards can be used as pre-qualification for PBP.

The biggest difference between BRM and AUK is the time for over-distance - BRM has no time for over-distance, so a 600km event has 40 hours, no matter whether it is actually 605 or 619km. This tends to only cause issues for the slower rider. There are various other small differences, but in reality it makes little difference to most riders.

Permanents and DIYs can not be run as BRM - so can not be used.

There are masses of BRM events next season.

Where does it say you can't have a bag drop on a LEJOG under AUK regulations???

There's a difference between what can be done under the regulations and what many feel should be done to remain within the "spirit of Audax". Most 600s have a bag drop at the sleep stop and I certainly use them. I know people who rode LEL and didn't use the bag drops to keep in the spirit etc. - they struggled a little once they had no dry kit etc. Do remember that PBP has no official bag drops - but you can happily arrange your own.

GPX validation for perms is slowly coming - and is widely used in DIYs. It's not a big deal and I wouldn't trust just GPX on a longer ride anyway; I'd be wanting to collect receipts etc. as well.

If getting your pre-registration BRM is important to you, just ride a 3 or 400 event and it's done. You don't need a 1000km+ to get a place on PBP (which people seem to be whipping themselves into a frenzy about). You won't need any pre-registration unless the world really has gone crazy. They are raising the capacity to between 6000 and 6500 riders. But I don't think it will fill up with pre-registrations. I know that I will take a 1000km+ pre-registration, but my stoker (who is new to big distances) will 'only' ride a 3 or a 4 - I am not at all concerned that she won't get a place.

marcusjb

meursault wrote:

This Audax thing does my head in, they seem a bit of a sandals and pipe organisation.

They are to a degree. But if the structure isn't to your liking, then just ride the ride and don't claim validation. No big deal.

Just wait until you ride PBP for lots of regulations! At least we don't have bike scrutineers here on events.

meursault

marcusjb wrote:

A permanent event (i.e. one that you can ride any time) can not help you pre-register for PBP no. You would also not be able to use a DIY or permanent in the 2015 season as part of your qualification SR.

BRM - Brevet Randonneur Mondiaux - any event that is run to BRM standards can be used as pre-qualification for PBP.

The biggest difference between BRM and AUK is the time for over-distance - BRM has no time for over-distance, so a 600km event has 40 hours, no matter whether it is actually 605 or 619km. This tends to only cause issues for the slower rider. There are various other small differences, but in reality it makes little difference to most riders.

Permanents and DIYs can not be run as BRM - so can not be used.

There are masses of BRM events next season.

Where does it say you can't have a bag drop on a LEJOG under AUK regulations???

There's a difference between what can be done under the regulations and what many feel should be done to remain within the "spirit of Audax". Most 600s have a bag drop at the sleep stop and I certainly use them. I know people who rode LEL and didn't use the bag drops to keep in the spirit etc. - they struggled a little once they had no dry kit etc. Do remember that PBP has no official bag drops - but you can happily arrange your own.

GPX validation for perms is slowly coming - and is widely used in DIYs. It's not a big deal and I wouldn't trust just GPX on a longer ride anyway; I'd be wanting to collect receipts etc. as well.

If getting your pre-registration BRM is important to you, just ride a 3 or 400 event and it's done. You don't need a 1000km+ to get a place on PBP (which people seem to be whipping themselves into a frenzy about). You won't need any pre-registration unless the world really has gone crazy. They are raising the capacity to between 6000 and 6500 riders. But I don't think it will fill up with pre-registrations. I know that I will take a 1000km+ pre-registration, but my stoker (who is new to big distances) will 'only' ride a 3 or a 4 - I am not at all concerned that she won't get a place.

BRM all clear now thank you for quick reply to my questions. I may be being a bit harsh on Audax UK, but the info on their site, to what a perm organiser says, appears different e.g. an email states explicitly no bag drops, but maybe it's ok within controls?

The thing is, we are not looking for any advantages or anything, but if we are attempting this, we would really like to give ourselves the best chance of completing it. Thanks again for all your help.