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Athena 11s Vs Ultegra 11s

How Far is too FarHow Far is too Far Posts: 534
edited November 2013 in Road buying advice
Might be about to order a Canyon Al, but undecided on which group set to go for.

Anyone with any experience on either the Athena 11s or the Ultegra 6800 11s.

The bike will be used for weekday riding and will likely clock up big mileage, the idea of this bike is to keep my Sunday best bike fresh.

Thanks

Posts

  • smidsysmidsy Posts: 5,273
    If you have Shimano tools already you would have to invest in some different ones for Campag.
    Yellow is the new Black.
  • rolf_frolf_f Posts: 16,015
    smidsy wrote:
    If you have Shimano tools already you would have to invest in some different ones for Campag.

    Well, the BB tool which is a pain for Powertorque so you'll probably just defer that one to the LBS and a cassette tool for a fiver. Probably not really enough to influence a decision.
    Faster than a tent.......
  • bigmatbigmat Posts: 5,132
    I'd stick with what I had on the best bike - means you can swap wheels across (although, I think I heard that the spacing for Shimano and Campag 11S is the same, perhaps someone else can confirm?). In any event I'd be inclined to stick with what I knew*.




    * Assuming you have Campag on the best bike, otherwise you should upgrade that as well!
  • BigMat wrote:
    I'd stick with what I had on the best bike - means you can swap wheels across (although, I think I heard that the spacing for Shimano and Campag 11S is the same, perhaps someone else can confirm?). In any event I'd be inclined to stick with what I knew*.




    * Assuming you have Campag on the best bike, otherwise you should upgrade that as well!


    Yes, they are cross compatible for 11 speed only
  • matt-hmatt-h Posts: 847
    I have 6800 and it is beautifully slick with outstanding braking over the 105 i have on my other bike.
    I did build with 9000 Cables so unsure if that has anything to do with it

    Matt
  • meesterbondmeesterbond Posts: 1,240
    Yes, they are cross compatible for 11 speed only


    Really? That was a bit of an oversight by Shimano. People will be swapping components willy nilly and then where would we be?? :wink:
  • g00seg00se Posts: 2,221
    Both are good. I'll come down to personal preference. Try some out in the shops.
  • neebneeb Posts: 4,448
    Yes, they are cross compatible for 11 speed only


    Really? That was a bit of an oversight by Shimano. People will be swapping components willy nilly and then where would we be?? :wink:
    There was a thread on weight weenies implying that the Dura Ace 11sp cassette might even shift a little better with a full Campagnolo SR drive train than the campag cassette... And it's much cheaper and lighter than both the Record and Super Record ones. Assuming that the 11sp Ultegra cassette works just as well, that's about the same weight as the Record one and a fraction of the price...

    Of course the use of such non-sanctioned components may result in serious injury or death.. :wink: (Campagnolo have snipers stationed on some of the more popular cycling routes with very high-powered binoculars).
  • Thanks All.

    My good bike has Sram Red 10sp, My CX bike has Ultegra 6700 which has not been the best shifting bike I have ever had, my old winter bike has 10year old 9sp Ultegra which still shifts great.

    I have never had a campy bike so no idea what they are like, hence the question.
  • majormantramajormantra Posts: 2,094
    IMO 6800 is a much better buy. No stupid Power Torque, cheaper spares (chains, cassettes, BBs), fantastic front shifting...
  • g00seg00se Posts: 2,221
    Campag groups are currently split into to camps. Ultrashift and Powershift.

    Ultrashift (SR, Record and Chorus) have levers behind the brake levers which will sweep across the whole front two rings (small to big) and a thumb LEVER which sweeps back the other way in one push (on the right) - this includes the trimming positions).

    The left hand lever's finger lever will sweep over three sprockets into smaller gears - and a thumb lever which sweeps down five gears.

    It's fairly safe to use both at the same time - which is useful if you ride compact as you can drop to the smaller ring but up three or four at the back at the same time - to keep cadence similar.


    The Powershift levers (Athena, Centaur and Veloce) have thumb BUTTONS that drop one ring/sprocket at a time (like Shimano). So you don't get the same ability to go up through the gears quick.

    Campag have a reputation for kit that lasts a long time (wears in - not wears out) and is repairable - though Powershift lever spare parts seem to come in kits rather than the individual pieces.

    Compared to Shimano - you get more feedback from changing gear - so rather than a smooth sweep, it's more of a purcussive snap.
  • cyclecliniccycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    I think the above sums it up but also consider the shape of the hoods with campag. I do find them more comfortable and seem to given a longer flater rest for my hand than shimano shifters do. Deda bars seem to have just the right bend for campagnolo shifters. It just works.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • Thanks all, some good advise.

    Rich...
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 25,186
    g00se wrote:
    Both are good. I'll come down to personal preference. Try some out in the shops.

    That - this is the only answer you need! (although smidsy's point about tools is fair)
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 25,186
    g00se wrote:
    Both are good. I'll come down to personal preference. Try some out in the shops.

    That - this is the only answer you need! (although smidsy's point about tools is fair)
    good bike has Sram Red 10sp, My CX bike has Ultegra 6700 which has not been the best shifting bike I have ever had, my old winter bike has 10year old 9sp Ultegra which still shifts great.

    That's because you use one on the road in the dry, one in the worst possible conditions - in fact the sh1tt1er the better and one on the road in the wet. Of course the road bikes shift better than the CX bike!

    Have a listen to these - http://velocast.cc/portfolio-item/groupsets-part-1 . They know what they re talking about, ride and work with everything and are very fair
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • Thanks for the link to the podcast, it was interesting to listen to there opinions. I noticed they commented on the earlier Ultegra shifters with underbars cabling, they noted the same problem as I am having.

    I guess the old 9sp stuff was a good period for Ultegra, my old winter bikes does still shift very well will very little looking after.

    Still confused with Campy though and I guess as I have other bikes with Sram and Shimano on it would be wise to stay with them due to being able to swap stuff about.

    Rich...

  • I guess the old 9sp stuff was a good period for Ultegra, my old winter bikes does still shift very well will very little looking after.
    .

    Indeed... same applies to Campagnolo... their 9 speed groupsets were ace. In fact, I think the 9 speed period was the pinnacle of indexed shifting, since then only downgrades.
    2 years ago I put together a Campagnolo 9 speed groupset with no regrets over the previous 10 speed stuff
  • majormantramajormantra Posts: 2,094

    I guess the old 9sp stuff was a good period for Ultegra, my old winter bikes does still shift very well will very little looking after.
    .

    Indeed... same applies to Campagnolo... their 9 speed groupsets were ace. In fact, I think the 9 speed period was the pinnacle of indexed shifting, since then only downgrades.
    2 years ago I put together a Campagnolo 9 speed groupset with no regrets over the previous 10 speed stuff

    7800 was pretty ace, and that was 10 speed.

    7900/6700/5700 seem like a bit of a misstep by Shimano to me but they've put a lot of that right with the latest generation stuff.
  • styxdstyxd Posts: 3,234
    Still confused with Campy though and I guess as I have other bikes with Sram and Shimano on it would be wise to stay with them due to being able to swap stuff about.

    Rich...

    You won't be able to swap stuff about though, since your current gear is 10 speed and the new ultegra is 11.

    I'd go for campy, just so you can say you've tried it. You may even like it!
  • smidsysmidsy Posts: 5,273

    I guess the old 9sp stuff was a good period for Ultegra, my old winter bikes does still shift very well will very little looking after.
    .

    Indeed... same applies to Campagnolo... their 9 speed groupsets were ace. In fact, I think the 9 speed period was the pinnacle of indexed shifting, since then only downgrades.
    2 years ago I put together a Campagnolo 9 speed groupset with no regrets over the previous 10 speed stuff

    +Millions.

    And 11 speed is descending even further. 9 speed rules. In fact Obree swore by 8 speed and said anything else was wasted.
    Yellow is the new Black.
  • cyclecliniccycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    All my favourite MTB kit is 8 speed and I love the 8 speed Durace groupset I have on one bike it is simpley sublime. The 7403 hubs uhmm they are lovely too. I use veloce 10 speed I quite like it shifting is reliable at least.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • bigmatbigmat Posts: 5,132
    I have 7 speed on my early 90s Ridgebacks and its awesome, been almost faultless over the last 21 years. Any advance on 7?! ;)
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667
    I think the hidden shifter cables was a big step back. I rode exclusively 6500 9sp Ultegra on my only bike and recently borrowed a mates with 5700. Shifting felt sticky and was quite tough. If I went 10speed I'd be riding 7800.

    A friend has 10sp centaur which I find works very well, in spite of hidden shifter cables
  • cyclecliniccycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    5700 shifter should be slick, if set up properly. Sticky shifting is caused by cable that need changing or cable routing that has bends that are too tight - the end. It has nothing to do with hidden cables.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • smidsysmidsy Posts: 5,273
    5700 shifter should be slick, if set up properly. Sticky shifting is caused by cable that need changing or cable routing that has bends that are too tight - the end. It has nothing to do with hidden cables.

    Except Shimano changed the STI lever design on the Ultegra because of poor shifting on their first hidden cable versions!
    Yellow is the new Black.
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