Mystery cyclist beating pros on strava

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  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    davidof wrote:
    Did non of the Olympic riders record a time for the segment?
    No but Phil Gil was recorded at some ridiculously quick time up there.
    _
  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    okgo wrote:
    Bear in mind Bibby times was from one if the pro races wasn't it but of draft?

    Tejvan just two seconds back could beat this 'jp' if he targeted I it (and indeed if it was or is real).


    I think Bibby's was from the RideLondon-Surrey race
  • okgo
    okgo Posts: 4,368
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    davidof wrote:
    Did non of the Olympic riders record a time for the segment?
    No but Phil Gil was recorded at some ridiculously quick time up there.

    Nah, it wasn't that quick, over 5 mins irrc.

    Over 5 min climb Pettinger would be quicker than lots of proper pro's.
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  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    Of course, all the Pros are uploading every single ride/race they do to Strava .....

    Oh ... no they don't - just the odd few ...

    Of course it's possible to cheat at Strava - it takes a file upload that can be in clear text - anyone with a text editor and a spare hour to edit the file could achieve it - anyone with a spreadsheet app could fake it more quickly...
  • frenchfighter
    frenchfighter Posts: 30,642
    I would imagine the shame of being found out vs the ego boost from being at the top do not net out favourably.
    Contador is the Greatest
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    frenchfighter wrote:
    I would imagine the shame of being found out vs the ego boost from being at the top do not net out favourably.

    Well - if you could just ask Contador that would be great .... ;)
  • okgo
    okgo Posts: 4,368
    It wasn't him, he was doing a race at the time.
    Blog on my first and now second season of proper riding/racing - www.firstseasonracing.com
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    okgo wrote:
    It wasn't him, he was doing a race at the time.
    If you can manipulate speed, heartrate and cadence then surely you realise that you can manipulate the date/time too!
  • OfficerDigby
    OfficerDigby Posts: 110
    Slowbike wrote:
    okgo wrote:
    It wasn't him, he was doing a race at the time.
    If you can manipulate speed, heartrate and cadence then surely you realise that you can manipulate the date/time too!
    If you can manipulate your bodies blood oxygen transportation system....
    Then editing a GPX file would be a doddle.
    Clearly it was Armstrong... Wasn't he banned from using his real name on Strava?
  • prawny
    prawny Posts: 5,440
    JP = Juan Pelota?

    Edit: and he's been on the BBC news website a lot in the last couple of weeks.
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  • davidof
    davidof Posts: 3,116
    Slowbike wrote:
    Of course, all the Pros are uploading every single ride/race they do to Strava .....

    Oh ... no they don't - just the odd few ...

    Unfortunately one of the odd few is Ten Dam :-(

    I set a KoM on an obscure little climb near my mums, then the Tour du Limousin blew through with 5 pros on strava. I'd have to get a Solex to get near them.
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  • adr82
    adr82 Posts: 4,002
    davidof wrote:
    Slowbike wrote:
    Of course, all the Pros are uploading every single ride/race they do to Strava .....

    Oh ... no they don't - just the odd few ...

    Unfortunately one of the odd few is Ten Dam :-(

    I set a KoM on an obscure little climb near my mums, then the Tour du Limousin blew through with 5 pros on strava. I'd have to get a Solex to get near them.
    Well at least you're not the type of Strava user who would immediately go and flag all their rides :)
  • jimmythecuckoo
    jimmythecuckoo Posts: 4,718
    ALIHISGREAT wrote:
    jimmythecuckoo wrote:
    Are people not now taking Strava a bit too seriously?

    Its not like its a proper race or anything.


    That's the beauty of strava.. you can take it as seriously as you like...


    Agree to an extent. But it will never replace racing for me.
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  • davidof
    davidof Posts: 3,116
    Here's an example of a double circuit of Box Hill, done from garage

    http://www.strava.com/activities/96873158

    I made the GPX by hand then road it on my trainer. Now 3000th place isn't anything to write home about but I could have told the trainer software I weighed 10kgs less and, well, bob's your uncle.
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  • jibberjim
    jibberjim Posts: 2,810
    davidof wrote:
    Here's an example of a double circuit of Box Hill, done from garage

    http://www.strava.com/activities/96873158

    I made the GPX by hand then road it on my trainer. Now 3000th place isn't anything to write home about but I could have told the trainer software I weighed 10kgs less and, well, bob's your uncle.

    You cannot take a corner on the zig-zags at the speed that trace has you doing it, it's impossible. Because of that it's obviously a fake, it's nowhere near as good as J P's attempts, it's a very tricky job to do well, riding the trainer like that certainly doesn't do it!
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  • sbbefc
    sbbefc Posts: 189
    That box hill climb has a staggering number of segements considering its only 2.5km with a 120m hight gain.
  • davidof
    davidof Posts: 3,116
    jibberjim wrote:
    davidof wrote:
    You cannot take a corner on the zig-zags at the speed t!

    Ian Bibby, amongst others, does.
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  • jibberjim
    jibberjim Posts: 2,810
    davidof wrote:
    jibberjim wrote:
    davidof wrote:
    You cannot take a corner on the zig-zags at the speed t!

    Ian Bibby, amongst others, does.

    No he doesn't, he drops to 20.1 kph in the 2nd zig and 20.7 kph in the 3rd zag (or zig) against an average speed of 31.5 kph whereas your example one your highest speed is in the middle of the 2nd zig at 28kph, 8kph ABOVE the average speed.

    It's not a realistic trace.
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  • davidof
    davidof Posts: 3,116
    It is a trace I did in a couple of minutes on Garmin maps but you can get the same thing on the ground if your GPS loses accuracy. As a poster above said, it is just numbers in a file.

    Maybe JP had more time to spend? Maybe they were genuine rides, but they got flagged anyway.
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  • mechanism
    mechanism Posts: 891
    Speaking of meaningless segments, there are at least 2 for the Torpoint ferry crossing.
  • jibberjim
    jibberjim Posts: 2,810
    davidof wrote:
    It is a trace I did in a couple of minutes on Garmin maps but you can get the same thing on the ground if your GPS loses accuracy. As a poster above said, it is just numbers in a file.

    Yes, everyone claims it's really easy to do, but no-one (other than JP) ever comes remotely close to creating a meaningful trace. J P's traces have all had various problems too, and I'm sure he/she's learning a lot from the feedback people identify from strava.

    Creating a good fake trace is extremely hard, it's not a case of riding at average speed X and then speeding it up to time Y, since that will generate unrealistic accelerations.

    It's not impossible to create fake data, but it's certainly not as easy as people suggest.
    Jibbering Sports Stuff: http://jibbering.com/sports/
  • rayjay
    rayjay Posts: 1,384
    Stick a camera on your helmet and get your stopwatch out. Simple.
    It shows our over complicated tech can get and it offers no real solutions if its not tamper proof.
  • Lightning
    Lightning Posts: 360
    jibberjim wrote:
    davidof wrote:
    It is a trace I did in a couple of minutes on Garmin maps but you can get the same thing on the ground if your GPS loses accuracy. As a poster above said, it is just numbers in a file.

    Yes, everyone claims it's really easy to do, but no-one (other than JP) ever comes remotely close to creating a meaningful trace. J P's traces have all had various problems too, and I'm sure he/she's learning a lot from the feedback people identify from strava.

    Creating a good fake trace is extremely hard, it's not a case of riding at average speed X and then speeding it up to time Y, since that will generate unrealistic accelerations.

    It's not impossible to create fake data, but it's certainly not as easy as people suggest.
    It's not easy for everyone, but it really is easy to do if you understand how it works. The thing is, people don't even bother because it's pointless.

    As for speeding up the average speed by X, that's a poor way to do it. If you fetch a ride with known power for all the segment points (in that attempt) and use the estimated incline on those points, you can automatically boost your "virtual power" to accelerate more/less depending on the incline (you can also add weight to that if you'd like) and averaging out everything.

    Any half-decent software engineer/programmer/whatever can code something up like this that produces realistic results (as realistic as a GPS, anyways). If you wanted to, you could even make it more realistic by averaging out the coordinates with all the data of all the people who have ridden the segment.
  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    ^ *cough* Allegedly

    :wink:
  • jibberjim
    jibberjim Posts: 2,810
    Lightning wrote:
    Any half-decent software engineer/programmer/whatever can code something up like this that produces realistic results (as realistic as a GPS, anyways). If you wanted to, you could even make it more realistic by averaging out the coordinates with all the data of all the people who have ridden the segment.

    If it's so easy, why are all the attempts so woeful?
    Jibbering Sports Stuff: http://jibbering.com/sports/
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    jibberjim wrote:
    Lightning wrote:
    Any half-decent software engineer/programmer/whatever can code something up like this that produces realistic results (as realistic as a GPS, anyways). If you wanted to, you could even make it more realistic by averaging out the coordinates with all the data of all the people who have ridden the segment.

    If it's so easy, why are all the attempts so woeful?
    Because no half-decent software engineer/programmer/whatever could be arsed to fake something as inconsequential as this ...
  • cal_stewart
    cal_stewart Posts: 1,840
    http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/lat ... imb-133063

    At it again
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  • rollemynot
    rollemynot Posts: 436
    Popcorn anyone?
  • frenchfighter
    frenchfighter Posts: 30,642
    Cal_Stewart wrote:
    http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/latest-news/mysterious-jp-sets-new-fastest-strava-time-majorcas-sa-calobra-climb-133063

    At it again

    Ha, nice! Smashed that record too.
    Contador is the Greatest
  • pollys_bott
    pollys_bott Posts: 1,012
    He / it was also running amok on the TdF second stage: I found him whilst marvelling at Marcus Burghardt's time from Holmfirth to the top of Holme Moss, randomly checked a few of the climbs back towards the start of the stage and he was there. Must have been flagged as couldn't find him last night...

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