Swimming, not winning

Mikey23

Sorry mr brownlee, I'm afraid I can't help...

My swimming a pretty rubbish too so I eagerly await some more serious answes

slowbike

My Dad (retired) goes swimming when taking his grand daughters for lessons ...

Whilst lane swimming he had an informal race against a lad - the lad won ... and started to celebrate his victory when his mates politely pointed out that he had only won by a couple of strokes and he was half my Dads age!

No - don't have any pointers for you ... sorry ...

imposter2.0

madasahattersley wrote:

Coach says it should be very good for breathing

Breathing shouldn't be that difficult

MountainMonster

I've found taking in air and then expelling it works well for breathing.

Other than my sarcastic remark, i'm not of much use unfortunately. My guess is that it is just a fitness and development issue for you, if this was your first time swimming properly, like any other sport, you need to let your body adapt to the new routine.

gimpl

I'm a swimmer. Compteted as a kid and it has never left me.

Much like when you get started on the bike there really is no substitute for just jumping in and putting in the lengths, try not to go too fast - a common mistake for beginners who only know one speed - just get into the rythym. Most people will breathe every second or fourth stoke, some every stoke (very inefficient) and some weirdos mix it up alternating sides to breathe ! I'm a freak who breathes every sixth stroke but don't know anyone else that does this.

Experiment with breathing and also stroke length to find out what works for you. It can only benefit your overall fitness and improve your core plus givve your body an alternative form of exercise.

ju5t1n

Swimming really helped with my lower back pain. Stick with it. It doesn’t matter if others are faster than you, you’re a racing cyclist not a swimmer.

A few good tips here… http://www.triswimcoach.com/tim-ferriss ... beginners/

trek_dan

Its just practice mostly. I've started learning to swim from scratch over the last few weeks and it does take a few sessions to get used to it, first thing is slowing down and really concentrating on technique and stroke count (however embarrassing it may be seeing fat blokes in their 60's pass you!) On the plus side I've started to develop arms muscles. I may be talking out of my backside but I'm sure having a cyclists build like me doesn't help when trying to swim slowly as being tall and skinny doesn't seem very buoyant.

Bozman

I used to swim a lot and after a lay off I always found the first 10-15 lengths a pain and then you just get in to a rhythm and you're away.
I was at my fittest when I used to swim as well as cycle, I couldn't tell you the ins and outs but it really seemed to help with my breathing, the one place that I noticed an improvement was climbing, the downside was gaining muscle where you don't want it and that's why I ditched it.

iPete

Went from 25m to 1 mile in 3 weeks, keep at it, go 3 times a week and it'll suddenly click. Work on a pace that allows you to get the breathing correct/find a rhythm and start adding bi-lateral breathing as you get better.

bianchimoon

start slooowly, wear goggles, breathe - put head under water, 2 strokes then head out of water breathe - repeat, keep as low as possible in the water, so water buoyancy does most of the work, you'll build up speed as you get used to the breath and stroke technique

cyclingsheep

The other thing about breathing while swimming, and this may seem counter intuitive, is to slowly breath out while your head is in the water prior to taking your next breath. This enables you to get more oxygenated air in during that quick inhale. Also look at triathletes swimming, they usually have great technique so use less strokes but still move quickly and as swimming seems to be to help your lung capacity not your legs triathletes don't tend to kick much either.

buckles

Maybe a lack of bouyancy due to lack of body fat? Also poor technique due to lack of practice?

wavefront

I took up swimming again last year, and hadn't swum since my teenage years. I would agree that just because you're 'fit', you may not be swimming fit. I found sorting my (bad) technique was my first big hurdle, and you have to watch out because just doing aimless lengths without knowing what or how to improve will just re-enforce bad habits and bad technique. Many suggest a swim coach to ensure you get the technique right, following it up with very regular sessions.

Getting into a rhythm is important, and I find a 50m size pool alot easier than a 25m. Just allows me to concentrate and work on my stroke. (I'll add here, that I used to struggle to do swim even 1/2 a length, but now can do 1k ok - I'm improving all the time).

As for breathing, I used to breathe on one side only, on every 2nd stroke. This upset my body position in the water and made me breathe too fast. Waiting four strokes was too long. So try bi-lateral breathing - where you alternate breathing sides (weirdos apparently do this as someone said above!!) left to right, on three strokes, and it helped me no end!

Maybe look at www.swimsmooth.com for tips? The book is pretty good too.

antfly

As the pros say, being fit for cycling just makes you fit for cycling, nothing else, even walking can be a problem when you spend hours every day on a bike...I find swimming is good relaxation and good for the muscles on days off the bike, you don't have to go fast, breaststroke is good.

kwi

Sounds just like what I experienced getting back on the bike, start of slowly and easy and build up easy. You'll be doing a mile in no time.

mm1

Teaching my children to swim put me off for life. There's nothing more miserable than standing waist deep in cold water. B.C. (before children) I taught a cycling friend to swim, within a few weeks he was thrashing up and down the pool with ease, but then he was pretty quick on the bike so no surprise.

Moonbiker

1/ Am I slow because of poor technique, or because my swimming fitness isn't there yet (arm strength etc)

Impossible to know without seeing you swim but probably poor technique, with swimming technique is loads more important than in cycling.



Very common issue is peoples hold there head to high in water & legs trailing down making it hardwork, body should be horizontal in water etc.

I recommend doing some training lengths with kickboard & also leg floats which will help with this.

Somes basics:

http://www.activetrainingworld.co.uk/news/2012/03/14/improving_body_position_in_the_water

nochekmate

As others have said - it takes time to get 'swim fit'. Not too sure how your coach feels it will benefit your cycling other than a bit of cross-training. Cyclists often have relatively big legs proportionally and this can be detrimental causing legs to be relatively low in the water, increasing drag and inefficiency. You need to work on the efficiency of hour pull, the efficiency of your kick and the technique of breathing - rotating rather than lifting the head because this will only cause the legs to drop lower in the water - check out the swimsmooth website for technical drills etc.

bernithebiker

Shouldn't this be on www.tritalk.co.uk?

Pross

Technique is very important in swimming in my limited experience. I have reasonable technique at breast stroke and can swim (literally) miles although not very quickly and providing I don't get bored. I find the action of the stroke fits well with breathing every other or every third stroke. With front crawl I can swim fairly quickly for about a length or as far as I can manage on one big breath. However, as soon as I try to breathe correctly I get in a panic and end up swallowing water. I just cannot get the rhythm and technique right so end up swimming slowly with my head out of the water. Upper body strength plays a part as well but I don't feel embarrassed by bloaters passing me - as far as I'm concerned they have greater buoyancy so waste less energy keeping afloat!

ddraver

Hee hee, when I started biking I used to swim, it was great getting my riding buddies in the pool and putting the hurt on THEM for a change!

It ll take time, remember cycling does sweet FA for your arms! It really helps me with core strength and general all over body fitness which can't hurt (never tell them I said this but those triathlete's have got a point...)

Finally, technique makes massive difference! If you can get a friend who swims to give you some tips or go to a few swimming classes with a decent coach you ll be amazed how quickly you improve. Those floats are nt just for kids! I have a friend who's very good at swimming and she took some of my less good friends for a swim, in half an hour they looked like different people in the water!

Pross, think smooth, exhale underwater whilst your other arm is forward and then gently turn your head as you raise the next arm to breathe. Note that you breath in the trough created by the passage of your head through the water, you don't need to lift your whole mouth out. I don't tend to even close my mouth when swimming crawl

graeme_s-2

Swimming is virtually all technique (or at least it's much more heavily weighted towards technique vs fitness compared to running or cycling). I'm a lapsed triathlete who's just started swimming again. I've barely swum in the last 2 years, but my first swim back last month I still knocked out 1400m in half an hour without too much trouble because my stroke is basically decent from swimming a lot as a kid.

I'd look at some online tutorials and drills to improve your stroke. You really need to focus on one thing at a time to improve, sounds like breathing might be a good start. If you're really serious about improving then you can't beat getting some advice and tips from someone who's actually seen you swimming.

Omar Little

Technique is crucial like others have said. A basic tip for those wanting to improve is slow things down a bit and lengthen the stroke.

For breathing i'd stick to what you are comfortable with. If you feel fine with every third then that is good as the stroke is more balanced and you will more streamlined in the water however for alot of swimmers the lowered oxygen intake can fatique them faster so the gains made with the streamlined stroke are lost. Even at the Olympic level this happens - sprinters will breath maybe once or twice in the 50m, but in longer races (even those as short as a 100m) then alot will be breathing every 2nd stroke apart from at the finish or turn.

peat

Swallow your pride and get the hell out of the fast lane until you are fit/fast enough.

Nothing will razz your fellows swimmers off more than some tugger getting in the way every 4 or 5 lengths. The lanes are there for a reason.

jordan_217

I'm not a coach, I could probably give you some pointers though. Fancy meeting up at the St Ivo one evening? You would need to check with the life guards though...

Fursty Ferret

I swim like a ball-bearing.

Gpfanuk

Ooops! I appear to have logged onto the swimmingradar.com website. Apologies for that!

phreak

madasahattersley wrote:

Some really helpful stuff here. I didn't realise breathing every stroke was inefficient - this is what I was doing, and I still felt like I needed to breathe more!

It's mainly due to the shape of your body when you breathe. You want to stay as flat as possible, and obviously when you breathe your body is rotating to allow your mouth to leave the water.

I used to swim a lot up until maybe early 20's, and coached for a few years. From my own experience of getting back in the pool I'd say the fitness, or lack of, will trump technique. When racing I mainly did butterfly, but my crawl was ok technically, but after a gap of a few years, I really did struggle to maintain any kind of pace for more than 100 metres or so. The muscular endurance just wasn't there.

The moral of the story is that practice is really the only way round it. Whilst cycling may give you decent cardio strength, it does nothing whatsoever for the upper body strength you need to swim well.

djhermer

I too am interested in how your coach thinks it will aid your cycling. I can't see how it will improve your cycling performance. It might in fact impede it if you're swimming when you could be cycling. It's a genuine question though, brought about by a very similar discussion/argument I had recently with a friend who said he hadn't cycled in 6 weeks prior to one of our rides, but he'd been swimming everyday so should be absolutely fine....

LegendLust

If I were you I'd get out of the 'fast' lane at least until you get quicker int he water. The amount of abuse a work colleague gives to slow swimmers clogging up the fast lane is unbelievable! Mind you he was a county standard swimmer when he was younger.

al_kidder

You've got good legs.....buy a pair of flippers