Light Blue Cycles

bmxboy10

Hi again. In my attempt to look for a steel framed bike I came across the Light Blue Kings F&F. Not custom but not bad for £800 as its an 853 frame and includes fork, polished stays and forks, headset and stem. Made in the UK too. Anyone know anything about these frames?
http://www.lightbluecycles.co.uk/isonim ... gs-grp.jpg

Camcycle1974

Stunning looking bike (I live 4 miles from the shop) Genesis are they not?

unixnerd

I think BikeRadar did a review on one few months ago, they look lovely. Maybe I'm a heretic but I'd prefer them to have mudguard mounts.

mattythemod

Ison ( importers of Salsa , Surly etc etc ) in Cambridge`s in house brand Saw one earlier this year at Core Bike trade show very nice indeed close up , quite retro but modern twist !

neeb

Depends on what you are wanting - these are very old school, with narrow tubes and lugs. Looks lovely, but a tig welded 853 frame made from oversize tubing will be quite a bit stiffer and lighter.

sloppyschleckonds

I quite like the look of the new SS Evo in light blue

Camcycle1974

Yes sir! That is lovely. Didn't know Cannondale had gone down the steel route. Nice simple lines and a great paint job. The same blue I am contemplating for my steel renovation next year.

meagain

"....they look lovely. Maybe I'm a heretic but I'd prefer them to have mudguard mounts."

Just so. After all, that which they are copying would have had 'grd mounts and sufficient clearances.

rolf_f

neeb wrote:

Depends on what you are wanting - these are very old school, with narrow tubes and lugs. Looks lovely, but a tig welded 853 frame made from oversize tubing will be quite a bit stiffer and lighter.

Do the lugs really make that much given that oversize tubing presumably means more metal? And the need for stiffness in a frame is proportional to the riders weight; oversized might mean overstiff.

Personally, just on the grounds of looks I'd rule out tig welded steel frames; just a bit dull and joyless IMO compared to a nice lugged frame!

neeb

Rolf F wrote:

Do the lugs really make that much given that oversize tubing presumably means more metal? And the need for stiffness in a frame is proportional to the riders weight; oversized might mean overstiff.

Personally, just on the grounds of looks I'd rule out tig welded steel frames; just a bit dull and joyless IMO compared to a nice lugged frame!

The lugs do add a bit of weight - maybe not much, but it's unnecessary and at odds with what a modern steel tubing such as 853 was designed for. Older heat-treated steels (such as 753) couldn't be tig welded without being damaged (and tig welding, at least of bike tubes, is a relatively recent invention), so had to be brazed or lugged. Modern high-end steel tubes such as 853, 953, XCR etc are actually designed to be tig welded, so by using lugs you are purely adding weight for cosmetic reasons. For me at least, there's just something a bit wrong about that in a bike frame.. But I acknowledge that others may have validly different opinions..

As far as oversizing goes, it generally doesn't add weight because the tube walls are thinner. Whether the oversize tubes are heavier or not, increasing the diameter fairly dramatically increases strength and stiffness, which is always going to either increase stiffness or decrease weight, or perhaps both. Yes, the need for stiffness is proportional to rider weight but also to riding style - even a light rider is going to notice annoying flex in a narrow-tubed steel frame when climbing hard out of the saddle if they are used to riding more modern frames. You end up just adapting your riding style, so unless you are competing it is to some extent just a matter of taste, but you will really notice the difference compared to a stiffer frame. And yes, with the super-mega (or whatever) oversized steel tubes now available it is also possible to make a steel frame too stiff for a lighter rider, so you can go too far the other way too.

<edit> P.S. I should add the disclaimer that I have no personal expertise in this stuff, I just read up on it a lot before getting my own steel frame..

Camcycle1974

neeb wrote:

Rolf F wrote:

Do the lugs really make that much given that oversize tubing presumably means more metal? And the need for stiffness in a frame is proportional to the riders weight; oversized might mean overstiff.

Personally, just on the grounds of looks I'd rule out tig welded steel frames; just a bit dull and joyless IMO compared to a nice lugged frame!

The lugs do add a bit of weight - maybe not much, but it's unnecessary and at odds with what a modern steel tubing such as 853 was designed for. Older heat-treated steels (such as 753) couldn't be tig welded without being damaged (and tig welding, at least of bike tubes, is a relatively recent invention), so had to be brazed or lugged. Modern high-end steel tubes such as 853, 953, XCR etc are actually designed to be tig welded, so by using lugs you are purely adding weight for cosmetic reasons. For me at least, there's just something a bit wrong about that in a bike frame.. But I acknowledge that others may have validly different opinions..

As far as oversizing goes, it generally doesn't add weight because the tube walls are thinner. Whether the oversize tubes are heavier or not, increasing the diameter fairly dramatically increases strength and stiffness, which is always going to either increase stiffness or decrease weight, or perhaps both. Yes, the need for stiffness is proportional to rider weight but also to riding style - even a light rider is going to notice annoying flex in a narrow-tubed steel frame when climbing hard out of the saddle if they are used to riding more modern frames. You end up just adapting your riding style, so unless you are competing it is to some extent just a matter of taste, but you will really notice the difference compared to a stiffer frame. And yes, with the super-mega (or whatever) oversized steel tubes now available it is also possible to make a steel frame too stiff for a lighter rider, so you can go too far the other way too.

<edit> P.S. I should add the disclaimer that I have no personal expertise in this stuff, I just read up on it a lot before getting my own steel frame..

You certainly did your research well!