Just talked to royce

cycleclinic

I am excited about some new hubs. I have just got of the phone with Cliff at Royce about a special.

I keep some Gigantex 50mm deep carbon rims which I want to build into some race wheels for my Sannio which I want to take racing next year. also I just like the frame (large diameter columbus genius tubing it gorgoeus). The rear rim is 24H and should be laced radially on the NDS according to gigantex. This pose a problem for many hub as there is a risk of flange failure although it as least minimised due to the low tension, the other problem is I normally have is I have to use nipple freeze or self locking nipples so the NDS spokes don't unwind as low tension radial spokes are prone to this.

So I thought why not use triplet lacing (2:1) in which the NDS spokes run at twice the tension. Of course I could buy a cheap BHS triplet hub for this however there hub is the same dimemensions as a standard hub aslo the bearing are crap. The thing with 2:1 lacing as the NDS spokes are running a double tension you can move the NDS flange out a fair bit. No one make such a hub (fulcrum hubs) so I called Royce and they will.

So I have specified for campagnolo 10/11 speed and DS flange spacing of 17mm and and NDs flange spacing of 43mm. the NDS spokes wil be laced radial heads in and the DS side 3x. Drilling on the DS will be 16H and NDS drilling is 8H. Spoke length calculation will be a odd for the DS but 48H 5x apparantly works we'll see. This truely is not like any hub on the market today that I am aware of. Most hubs put the NDS flange for tenion balance at 33-38mm and DS flange for 11 speed has to be position at ~17mm from centre. Royce do not make anything close.

This will give me a NDS bracing anlge of 9.1 degrees and a DS bracing angle of 4.3 degrees and equal tenion on the DS relative to the NDS. So I will be able to tension the wheel to 1000N and be nowhere near the tenion limit of the rim.

The hubs flanges will be titanium and the shell is carbon. The bearings will be 6001 main body and 6902 in the freehub. Ti axle and freehub body.

This is why I am excited it is also an experiment but I see no reason why it won't work very well. I don't have pics yet as it will take 4 month for these to be built.

marcusjb

Cor - guess they're going to cost a penny or two!

Cliff is awesome (if not slightly grumpy engineer type when dealing with idiots like myself!) and does make such beautiful stuff.

Great products and I look forward to seeing photos of these specials in the future.

cycleclinic

They are not cheap. Retail is £950 but I am a shop so they are not costing me that. I will get a photograpgher (in exchange for some bike bits) to photograph these as they will deserve that.

He was not grumpy at all and was quite willing to build it to my own specifications which is the whole reason why I called him.

napoleond

I CANNOT WAIT to see these!

cycleclinic

Tension balance will be 80% NDS/DS not 100% as stated. So 1000N DS will give me 800N NDS spoke tension that is still good enough.

Rear hub should be 320g and front 105g so not light but not too heavy either wheelset weight should be c.1525g so not too heavy for 50mm deep carbon rims with these sort of hubs.

marcusjb

thecycleclinic wrote:

They are not cheap. Retail is £950 but I am a shop so they are not costing me that. I will get a photograpgher (in exchange for some bike bits) to photograph these as they will deserve that.

He was not grumpy at all and was quite willing to build it to my own specifications which is the whole reason why I called him.

Ah, but you're not an idiot who didn't regrease his Titan hub.....

I said slightly grumpy - in a good way. He has always given me top class advice and the products of his I have are just astonishing (hubs and BBs).

ugo.santalucia

But most importantly, are you friend with Sannino on Facebook?

majormantra

Interesting!

cycleclinic

Never thought to look for Sannio on facebook. Waiting though is going to be hard work.

napoleond

Oh FFS. Now I want a Royce track crank :evil:

rajMAN

Have had the pleasure of visiting Royce on a couple of occasions and always found Cliff a great enthusiast and not at all grumpy. Royce make superb products and don't really shout about it. I have used their hubs for may years now and they are almost boringly reliable and beautifully finished. Would love a set of gold hubs for the ultimate Bobby George look.

marcusjb

I think I used the wrong word - he's a very nice chap and not grumpy in the sense of being miserable. He just maybe despairs a little when having to explain how to do something to a not very technical idiot like myself!

I've always found him to be super-helpful though and I rate his products beyond highly. They are near indestructible and really do perform.

But, no, he isn't grumpy or unapproachable - he's a very nice man!

pete.whelan

have used Royce bottom brackets for many years (never had to replace a bearing after many thousand of miles) on quite a few bikes. Cliff always obliging when asked awkward questions

cycleclinic

I paid up today and changed the design slightly. As I will only be runnning campag 10 speed on this bike I have opted to move the DS flange out to 19.5mm from centre. I picked the original dimensions so I could run shimano 11 speed but that is not going to happen on a Sannio. Tension balance will be now 92% i,e 1000N DS 920N NDS.

I might get a Royce BB for this too.

ugo.santalucia

SANNINO FFS!!!!! :evil: